Weddingbee boards

So as I mentioned in another post, FI has just recently clammed up on the topic of weddings, when it was something we had been able to discuss before. On the one hand I felt like I should drop it because he clearly needed some space on the topic. On the other, I was nervous about his suddent shift in attitude and inability to even speak about the topic and left wondering what it meant.

So I brought it up last night, which was probably the wrong thing to do. Not that I wanted to get engaged right away, but I was just confused about his recent change in attitude on the topic and wondering if there was anything we needed to discuss, i.e., he was uncomfortable with the spring timeline we'd set.

He basically told me I knew very well that I was causing trouble and 'attacking' him when I brought up wedding stuff. I was kind of shocked. If he had said "You know what, you need to give it a rest. I know it's important to you but I think you bring it up way too much and that's obnoxious," hey, I would have been fine. Because at least that would have made some sense. But he basically said he thinks I'm attacking him and purposely 'trying to make him mad' by speaking about the topic.

I don't know where he's coming from with this. The only thing I can conclude is that the topic DOES make him upset/angry, and therefore he assumes it was my intent to make him angry. But seriously, it's not like I ever bring up the topic in a nasty or attacking way. For example, we went to a wedding last week and saw something particularly cool so I said "Wow, maybe when we get married we can do ____." Again, maybe overboard, but not attacking!

He went to visit his sister recently and she is single and very eager for us to have a wedding. So maybe she put the pressure on and it was just too much, I don't know. Just not sure what to think here.

Sorry! A little summary:

I am 31 and he is 35. We met two and a half years ago and 'officially' started dating exclusively 2 years ago. We are both pretty established in our careers and lives at this point.

In the beginning he wasn't sure about marriage but he slowly came around on the topic, and kind of 'picked up steam' in talking about it over time. I think especially because he probably wants kids and, unfortunately, our ability to have them will not be unlimited time-wise.

We both have lifelong best friends that we grew up with, went to college with, still live near us, etc. It just so happens that we all met at the same time (I was out with my best friend and he was out with his at the same bar, I met him and my friend started dating his friend) and so our relationships started at pretty much the exact same time. His friend and my friend are now engaged and will be married this summer. At first this seemed to make him more excited and open to the topic of marriage and he wanted to talk about it more. Then, suddenly, just recently, he clammed up about it.

This led to me asking him why the sudden change, which led to him saying I 'knew very well' that I was 'trying to start a fight' whenever I brought up marriage, which I in fact did not know and left me confused!

Thanks for all of the insight. I will probably smooth things over this evening and tell him it wasn't my intent at all to make him upset, and then force (possibly with duct tape,) myself not to speak about it for the next few months at least.

I think he is probably adjusting to the idea of this going from 'hypothetical' to 'real'. He's agreed to a hypothetical engagement but when it starts to get 'real' in terms of actual plans it is a bit different, and I think his best friend doing all of these things has made it much more real. In the end there is no way for me to know if he will make that leap with time but I know that nagging him certainly won't help, so I just have to wait and see.

Also, in a weird way I kind of think there is a male ego thing going on with his friend being engaged. I don't know why, just an instinct on my part and the fact that his friend didn't tell him that he was going to propose so it was a surprise to both of us. 

I think possibly it bothers him a little to know that he put me off for awhile when it came to engagement, in comparison to his friend who lavished his girlfriend with the big ring, surprise romantic proposal, etc. I kind of think on some level every guy wants to see themselves as your hero or knight in shining armor, and to some degree I wonder if that made him feel a little bad.

In the end, who knows?

I can somewhat relate.  My boyfriend hasn't been upset/defensive about it when it's brought up, but he has mentioned some things that might help understand your guy's point of view.  I know that in our conversations (we know we want to get married and talk about the future a lot, but we've specifically talked about marriage a handful of times) he wants it to be a surprise.  He's a wonderful guy, and always tells me "don't ever worry about this - I got this one".  I think it's his way of proving to himself that he's "grown up" enough and being a responsible, independent person ready to make a committment - he wants to do it for us and make it really perfect.  He also mentioned that it's tricky, because although he wants to talk about marriage and things, anytime a friend of mine gets engaged and we bring it up somewhat he said that if he was planning something he'd want to wait anyway - he doesn't want to immediately be around anyone else.  This might be some insight into your guy.  He probably wants to surprise you, and even though your intentions for bringing it up are completely genuine and understandable, he might feel "darn, the surprise factor is gone - now I have to wait again" when it's brought up, and he feels like he's at square one.  I agree with what some others said - completely, COMPLETELY drop it for a while.  The "you talk about it too much" factor is completely thrown out the window then.  That's what  I've done actually, too - not because of arguing or any type of uncomfortable issues with my boyfriend at all - but just to ensure that he can do his thing and surprise me like he really wants to.  I'll be honest - it's hard sometimes!  But just keep hanging in there.  Vent to us on here! 

 Give your guy the benefit of the doubt for at least 2 months - just like it was said earlier - if at that point (July or so) he STILL is defensive and strange about it...it's time to have a very serious conversation.  Maybe he'll end up proposing before July and you won't even have to go there at all. :) Best of luck! Hang in there!

Ha ha, well, the consensus seems to be to drop it, so I suppose that is what I'll do! I don't know, it is still hard. I think his strange reactions tell me that, for whatever reason, the idea of marriage is bothering him or he's struggling with it. It's hard for me not to feel a little annoyed by that, although I know how non-productive it is. A little part of me just gets annoyed now because he wholeheartedly expects me to do all the usual nice things I usually do for him. Like, no, I don't want to marry you, but I expect you to continue making my dinner and cleaning my house. Well, until spring then, I guess, and if it's still an issue then I'll have some hard decisions to make. 

No, I hear you. And I understand the difference between feeling and doing. A feeling is something that occurs naturally, you can't help how you feel. Yes, I feel a bit annoyed right now when he's kind of stonewalled on the topic but when I come home from a long day he wants a foot rub. But doing is a different matter. I understand if you can't forge forward and be nice to each other when you're not really feeling it, it's not a good thing.

As far as the smothering thing...not knowing your friend at all, that sounds like a pretty jerky way for her ex-boyfriend to end a relationship! Isn't 'it's not you, it's me?' pretty standard, vs. 'it's all your fault woman!' I don't know, in our case I don't think that's the issue. Maybe he does think I am smothering him on this particular issue, but in part that is due to HIS initial enthusiasm in talking about it, and my confusion when that suddenly changed. As a rule we are both super independent. 

I think everyone else has already responded very well and given you great advice.  However, I don't like some of what has been said.  Not because it isn't valid, it's just that I feel differently.  You are adults, and therefore should be able to have an adult conversation.  Even if he were to say, "I'm not sure yet whether I want to marry you," at least he's giving you information rather than getting defensive and snippy.  He should not have sole control over what you're allowed to discuss with him.  Are you a child or are you his equal?  He can't just be unwilling to have a discussion with you.  That's ridiculous.  I think it's perfectly reasonable to discuss where you stand in your relationship. 

Reading your most recent posts, I wonder - does he rub your feet?  Does he ever cook you dinner?  Does he ever clean the house? 

You have to give out that treatment sparingly.  Seriously.  You're spoiling him.  This is just coming from my point of view.  In my mind, the roles should be reversed.  He should be giving you the royal treatment.  And if he wants to get snippy with you just because you want to have an adult conversation about where your relationship is going, I'd say CUT the royal treatment.  He's a grown man, he knows where the kitchen is.  He knows how to use a vacuum cleaner.  He needs to realize that your kindness should be appreciated.  You are not a live-in maid.

Sorry, I just hate to hear about a good woman being treated like that. 

Aw, thanks so much everyone for taking the time to post! It's so cool to see the support and advice!

I think what I keep coming back to is that I just can't know. I can't know if he's just nervous about the proposal, if he doesn't like the idea of marriage at all, or what. And even if he says one thing now, there's still no way for me to know how he will feel when it's time to make it 'real' in the spring.

I guess what I have learned from the situation is that there are no guarantees in life. And to a degree, if I do love him, I will take him at his original word that this is something he wants to do. Of course we will have to talk about it again in the future but I think for the next couple of months at least I will retire the topic and hopefully give him time to reflect and figure things out without any pressure.

I think the hardest prospect for me will be what to do if he say no when next spring rolls around. I will be 32, not getting any younger if I want to have kids! Like someone said upthread, would you rather be with someone who you love but will not get married, or be alone with the prospect of maybe finding someone who wants to marry. I think the Catch 22 for me is that I do love him, but if by age 36 he is still not able to commit, despite knowing how important it is to me, then to some degree that makes me view him in a different light.