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Have you seen this article about costumes versus cultures?
http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/26/living/halloween-ethnic-costumes/index.html
What do you think?
My personal opinion is that it's silly and overreacting. Should I be offended that people dress up like toothless red-necks because I grew up in the country? Should fat people be offended by fat-person costumes? Should clergy be offended by priest and nun costumes? Is dressing up like a homeless person with a bottle of whiskey inapporpaite too? Pretty much everything can be "offensive" if you try to make it so.
This parady kind of sums up how I feel about the whole thing: http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/were-a-culture-not-a-costume#.TqwnQt4r2dA
I guess the campaign worked in a way, because I'm here talking about it...
I think it's silly too. You are only offended by things when you choose to be.
I think we try to be way too PC these days. Everyone is afraid of offending someone.
I agree with you. I am mixed of cultures, two which are shown in this article actually. I think Halloween is one of those special times of year were it is ok to be politically incorrect. I hate how everything now has become so PC. I am much more offended by the "sexy" costumes for women and the people dressing up as the recently dead (Amy Winehouse, Steve Jobs, etc) than I am of someone dressing up as a stereotype. To me, as long as you understand that it is a stereotype then why the hell not. It is Halloween for jeepers...if you aren't offended someone or scarying them, I think you might be doing something wrong.
Wow. I think there is a line, and sometimes that line gets crossed yes, but it is by everyone on Halloween. I like the point someone made in the comments on one "Are you mocking the sterotypes or the people themselves?" because, unless you are a total nitwit, people do in fact realize not all Middle Eastern people are terrorists, not all black people are gangsters, not all white people are red necks ect ect... They play off the stupid sterotypes and everyone gets made fun of, then gets over it on Nov 1.
I see both sides on this one ..
but one funny entirely reverse politically incorrect example .. is that one of my friends went as a Deaf American Idol contestant ... he himself is Deaf ... you should have heard him sing a-m-a-z-i-n-g-l-y hilarious !
Its very silly in my opinion...its all in fun...No matter what you ever do, it will eventually offend someone
I think certain things - like black-face or anything related to Nazis - is crossing the line because they are rooted in concepts of bigotry/hatred. But simply dressing up like a stereotype of another culture is all in good fun as far as I'm concerned. Its just important to avoid being mean spiritied about it.
I don't know, I think this is a delicate issue. It seems in the article that most of the races/cultures that are against this are the ones that deal most with racism and stereotypes. I can understand it.
I think people should be careful with the costumes they chose.
Honestly, dont these college kids have anything better to do? Go crawl under a rock on October 31st if youre do utterly offended by a dude dressed up as a giant penis, Paris Hilton, or a ninja. I'm sure last year when I was tinkberbell the entire fairy population of southern California was up in arms over my insensitivity.
@mandypop: Okay, I must be dumb but what is this "black face" stuff. I totally get it is something being racist towards black people... but how? Nevermind, the internet is great.
Though I agree, Nazi anything is way far beyond the line no matter who you are. Of course now that I think about it, not that I know anyone who would, but like Viet Cong, USSR soilders or something like that, would be across the line I think too. Those are the kind of thing that are too close to the now to be funny. Of course, one could also say the same thing about the suicide bomber costume...
Also, the article stated that there was no white stereotype...helllooo jersey shore costume anyone?
@mandypop: So... the picture of a black NBA player in white-face dressed as Justin Timberlake that I saw on yahoo's hompage is okay, but for Justin Timberlake to dress in black-face and go as the NBA player is not? Either it's all fair game or nothing is, IMO.
How is it not okay to dress as a geisha, or in a Mexican poncho or in black-face and it's perfectly fine to dress as a reneck NASCAR fan, a pregnant hillbilly bride or a dumb blonde? Double standards are BS, as is the fact that there is no white stereotype. I just listed 3 of them.
@zippylef: Because black face makeup has a deep, historical root in bigotry, racism, and segregation. Its not JUST the make up. Its the traditon behind the idea of black face.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackface
And I didn't say it wasn't ok to dress up as a geisha or any of those things - I said "its all in good fun" as long as its not mean spririted and based on bigotry and hatred.
@chasesgirl: "Black face" is a white person painting themselves black, and has a long history in racism in America.
This campaign actually originated at OU (the school where I'm currently a grad student), so there have been tons of conversations about this around town this week. My point of view on it is that not every cultural costume is included here as offensive and unacceptable, but what crosses the line is when someone appropriates a caricature of another culture that is an unflattering representation.
I think that, yes, Halloween is in some ways about crossing boundaries and flouting normal rules of propriety, but I also think that people need to give their costumes some thought. Halloween is HUGE here in Athens, and some students really go too far. That's why this campaign started.
@chasesgirl: Sadly, there are many examples of people being harrassed and called terrorists just for looking like they come from the Middle East. I think that reinforcing that stereotype is a pretty tasteless move.
@zippylef: Honestly? I get offended if somone dresses up as a stereotypical Southern hillbilly, at least if they are not from the South themselves. Can't people come up with a halloween costume that isn't based on making fun of some group of people?
@mandypop: I know what blackface is and I know the history behind it. I just don't agree with double standards. Like I said before, it's an all-or-nothing for me.
@historienne: Yea, I had a friend in 5th grade (which for me was in 2001...) who was Muslim, spoke Arabic and prayed 5 times a day so some were at school. He and his family were recent immigrants from a country in the Middle East, I don't remember which, but needless to say, 5th graders who don't understand can be real jerks. We ended up in the same middle school and the jokes didn't get better for a long time.
I'm surprised by some of the responses on this post. I agree that Halloween is about fun and games, but dressing as a racial or ethnic stereotype of any sort seems way over the line to me. I think dressing as a specific celebrity, like the Justin Bieber example (haven't seen that picture, myself) is a different issue entirely. Blackface, given its racially-charged history (as @SadieBee pointed out) is not acceptable regardless. I think most people would find a costume like "stereotypical Jew" or something along those lines completely offensive; I certainly would.
I think most of us would see a costumed stereotype, like the examples given in this campaign, and, 1) hopefully know the person well enough to understand that it wasn't meant as racist, or 2) not be swayed into buying into the stereotype. However, there are ignorant people out there. Why normalize their beliefs by making it into a part of the holiday? There are so, so many good costumes out there that aren't about an entire race or ethinicity.
ETA: Just want to add, I'm not the hypersentitive type IRL, really, and I understand the feeling that people can be overly-PC.
Except that in the case of black Americans, its not a double standard. After white people deal wtih 100 years of being citizens in a country where they were not allowed to vote, go out in public after sunset, or sit in the same restaurants as everyone else, maybe I'll feel a little sympathy for us unlucky white people who have to think of something marginally more creative than blackface for Halloween....
@mandypop: So how about all the "Indian" costumes? Because in many parts of this country, Native American are STILL marginalized people. They have been treated as bad, or worse than black people in America for much longer (like the white colonists deciding to give them smallpox and wiping out entire nations to sending them to reservations where their culture wilts away) and it still happens. But no one is up in arms because some kid dresses up in leather and put a feather in their hair.
@mandypop: Maybe I feel the way I do because I grew up as one of the few white kids in a black neighborhood and spent my whole childhood being called "cracker", "honky" and "white girl". Racism is racism to me. No form of it is any less or more offensive.
I find these 2 pictures to be on the same level, personally.
White dude dressed as Lil Wayne
Black guy dressed as Justin Timberlake
Sorry, amnystik. I'm done threadjacking now.
Like I said - is it mean spirited or not? I dressed up as Pocahontas when I was a kid because I thought the culture was really interesting and I loved Native American flute music - I didn't paint my face red or do anything disrespectful. I'd view that differently from some frat boy idiot covered in "war paint" mocking "war cries" and all that crap. Its all perspective I guess - I'm white/Arabic and really don't find the terrorist costumes offsensive at all - seeing as Im not a terrorist - haha.
@chasesgirl: I don't know about being "up in arms," but I agree with you that the headdress-y Native American costumes aren't cool, either. I think the *perceived* differece is that it's a cultural representation from another time period, like having little kids dressing up as Native Americans at a First Thanksgiving play or something. If it's presented as just "this is what 'Indians' look like," definitely not OK.
I wouldn't let my kids do it, but if my kids asked to dress up as a stereotypical Native American for halloween it would be a good chance to start a dialogue with kids on what Native American cultures are today (there are some great books for kids about this very topic).
@mandypop: I think dressing up specifically as Pocahontas, or a particular celebrity or historical figure, is different than dressing as an ethnic stereotype. No issue with that here. And as you said, I'm sure it wasn't mean-spirited in your case!
Also done threadjacking. :)
ETA: Mariachi band - wouldn't have an issue with that either. Would be particularly awesome if people actually had instruments and could play. "Mexican on donkey" - not OK.
Some of it makes sense if the cultures think of it as offensive, but I'm not sure how dressing up as Osama is necessarily making fun of a culture. It's making fun of a man that our country, after 10 years, finally killed for killing thousands of people and showing no remorse. It has nothing to do with culture.
The way I see it, if you are sensitive enough that you can't allow others to dress up as a mariachi band, then the world will never learn to laugh at ourselves and move on. If you can't laugh at yourself, then other people will always view you as a sensitive person to be tip-toed around.
But I can see the other side of it, for sure, but that's juist how I feel
whilst reading everyones post i thought, how are any of the costumes mentioned above actually scary... isn't halloween supposed to be scary like witch, dracula, monsters.... i tend to stick to the typical halloween costumes.
but i do agree with @Canuba a certain historical figure or celebrity is totally different than dressing up as ethnic stereotype.
for example ... i should be allowed to dress up as someone i like whether it be diana ross or marilyn mounroe i like both these women for their talents so dressing up as either is fine
I think the campaign is silly. It's a costume, that's it. Maybe it's because I am offended by very little but I just don't see the big deal.
@PitBulLover: I agree.
People are just wayy too sensitive about... well, everything nowadays.
I get that SOME can be offensive, but with the prevalence of "funny" (or punny, rather) costumes nowadays, aren't a lot of costumes parodies anyway? I had a friend dress up in a prom dress and a pregnant belly, with a sash that said "Miss Conception." Is this offensive to mothers? To teen mothers? My mom thought it was hilarious and had had me at 20. It was cute. It was Halloween. People chuckled. The end.
It's just Halloween, sheesh.
I'm not saying some costumes aren't inappopriate, but the vast majority I don't think are TRULY offensive. Yes, some people are jerks and will take things too far. But that happens all the time.
I dont think the campain is "silly" in any way. These college kids that have nothing better to do with their lives are actually standing up for what the believe in and reguardless of if I or you or anyone shares their beliefs.. that is a commendable act in itself. Many might think that they are being too sensitive, I think they are being sensitive enough. They are not going out shooting people that are essentially poking fun at who they are, or who society views them to be (i.e. an arab with a bomb) they are doing the mature thing and campaining. Isn't that what makes this country so amazing? People can stand up for their beliefs? It is just socially ok now to make fun of arabs. Right after slavery was abolished.. it was socially ok to dress up in black face with a nuse around your neck, but it never made it right. These people have a right to be upset just like black people have to right to be upset when they are told to bite the curb.
I get where these students are coming from. Dressing up as a certain celebrity is one thing, but to put on blackface and dress like a gang member is crossing the line. Suicide bomber in Arab clothing- yeah I think it's offensive.
There are so many costume ideas available, why not go with something that won't offend. Maybe it's "too PC" but what's the harm in taking a little extra care with the culture and feelings of others? That's just being nice.
I think their point is valid. I think it is important to consider the message that your costume is sending.
Racism/sexism/ableism - or any other form of discrimination or oppressive behaviour doesn't get a pass from me just because it is hallowe'en and "just for fun."
That isn't to say that you can't have fun costumes that come out of specific cultures, just to try and be sensitive about it.
Someone dress like Justin Beiver or Lady Gaga ause they admire them, they dress like 'Insert stereothype' here as mocking.
I think these kids have a valid point, I understand why some people might it as silly but the truth is when you live with the world laughing at your culture becaouse of a silly stereotype, sometimes is... i don't wanto to say hurtfull or humilliating, let's say you feel helpless. You know your culture's not like that but that stereotype but it's offensive when no one seems to understand it.
Of course halloween it's about fun, and everyone has a right to have fun, just as everyone has a right to defend they culture. just saying.
I think these students probably just didn't get invited to the big Halloween party :P
Seriously, its all in fun. I won't be offended if someone dresses up as a dumb home-schooled farm kid. I would laugh at it, and probably give them some tips! It's about dressing up as something you aren't - and usually the more unusual or funny, the better. I think these kids could be putting their efforts toward much more productive things than trying to reform a night where college students are pretty much dressing up in the dumbest or sluttiest thing possible and get drunk.
The only one I've heard of so far this year that crossed the line for me(and was actually suggested by my school's newspaper) was dressing up as Dan Wheldon (famous Indy car racer killed two weeks ago in a horrific in-race crash) and 'ripping holes in your uniform, bonus points for lighting yourself on fire'.
Well, if you aren't going to dress up as Indians, Geishas, Native Americans, Rap stars, etc.... I guess you shouldn't be dressing up as witches either, because that's offensive to the Wiccans. No Druid costumes, either. Let's see... I guess Goth and Emo costumes are out. Hmm, I could write a whole long list that essentially ruins dressing up Ever. Period.
No matter what you do, somebody somewhere is offended. Dressing up at Halloween is supposed to be about fun, not pointedly trying to offend any one group. The majority of people are not dressing maliciously. But, I guess somebody has to find a way to suck the fun out of everything.
@expecting rain - RE: "and the people dressing up as the recently dead (Amy Winehouse, Steve Jobs, etc)"
I'm dressing up as Steve Jobs on Monday; my entire department at work is. (I work in IT.)
I agree with the article, it's offensive. It would be different if they were dressing up as particular people though.
There is also the whole thing with women only dressing up as "Sexy ____". I think there are so many other options out there for costumes!
This website has some great culturally sensitive and creative costume ideas http://takebackhalloween.org/
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