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Further more, she answers a question from a mom who refused to go to her own son's wedding over it. It's the second question down:
http://www.slate.com/id/2235064/pagenum/2
I LOVED the response from Emily Yoffe. I can't believe any mother would refuse to attend her own son's wedding because of this, and I'm hoping that she was set straight after reading this.
Not that the son wasn't at fault entirely, but jeez, talk about over-reacting!
I can't believe a mom would refuse to atten her own son's wedding. RUDE.
Holy karp! I personally do not agree with the no-kids-allowed scene, but this reaction was pretty ridiculous!
Personally, I think "no kids" policies are ridiculous, but I do agree with her that the mom shouldn't have boycotted her son's wedding because of it!! It's crazy what weddings can do to families.
We're having a child-free wedding mostly to keep costs down, but also because our reception is in an art museum. Little fingers around priceless art leads to an evening that the parents will inevitably spend eagle-eying kids. I see absolutely nothing wrong with child-less receptions, as long as everybody is included or excluded evenly. This mom was crazy!!
i wish i could find a martha stewart article stating that it is ok to not have kids at a wedding. we don't want to have kids and my mom thinks that is horrible. she told me to find out martha's opinion and she might reconsider. I haven't been able to find anything yet!
I definitely think that there are places and events that are inappropriate for children. While there are exceptions (breast-feeding mothers, kids with special needs perhaps)- there's no reason that parents can't be away from their kids for 4 hours during a reception.
@ mskalinin and PeytonL79 you say that you don't agree with childless receptions and they are ridiculous, why do you say that? I'm not looking for a fight, just curious as to why you feel so strongly that others should not get to have the wedding of their choosing?
Corgi- Here is an article from Martha's website about not inviting children and how to put it on the invite:
http://www.marthastewartweddings.com/article/the-guest-list?page=2
My mom was the opposite, she wanted NO kids at all there but we compromised to have immediate family children only.
I'm curious... Why do the people who think "no kids" is inappropriate feel this way?
@summergirl- thank you!!!
@teaadntoast- my mom had a bunch of reasons. First because she thinks weddings are "family events" and its rude to exclude any family members. Second because everyone else in our family has invited kids and she's never heard of a wedding where kids arent invited. Third because we shouldn't expect families to have to hire babysitters for their kids (I told her that we'd get a babysitter on-site; she told me no decent parent would leave their kid with a babysitter someone just hired for the day).
it always so confusing to me when people get offended that their children are not invited. i had a NO KIDS wedding and a couple of people brought their children anyway...and then commenced to complain all night about how "little joey" couldnt eat this and "little joey" didnt like that. thats why he wasnt invited.
Im throwing a party. your kids ARENT invited. if you cant bear to spend 4 hours without your kids, dont come. Whats the problem? just because you feel weddings and receptions should be "family friendly" events, doesnt mean everyone else does. my ceremony didnt start until 8 pm and my reception was VERY cocktail focused, Not appropriate, IMHO, for kids.
and to think a MOTHER convinced her whole family to boycott because a 6 year old wasnt invited... people are so selfish.
I'm not saying that others shouldn't have the weddings of their choosing, but I do think no-kids policies are taken to the extreme when the result of the policy is to, for example, exclude neices and nephews of the bride (i.e., the bride or groom's siblings' kids), or other children with whom the bride and/or groom have a close relationship. For example, if the bride/groom has a close friend who has children and the bride/groom personally knows and spends time with those kids - try explaining to a child who truly loves the bride/groom why they can't attend the event.
I am admittedly a little biased because I have a daughter, and I don't see children as the wedding-plan destroying tikes that some brides do. I've attended a couple of weddings with my daughter when she has also been included, and I've left her at home (with my ex) for a few weddings, most recently one in which I was MOH.
I think that if a couple is going to have a no kids policy that will wind up hurting the feelings of the people who they are closest to (i.e., siblings), they seriously need to reconsider that policy. To perhaps change it to - only children of family members included - or something similar.
I personally don't think small children belong at weddings. Teenagers and older kids would be fine. I don't have any kids, but when I do, I will not want to bring them to a wedding especially if it's fancy. I just don't understand why people want to have to worry about watching their kids at a wedding instead of leaving them with a babysitter. Sorry if I offended anyone, but I wouldn't be able to enjoy myself if I had small children there.
I think some people feel their children should be involved in every event. I have friends who bring toddlers to jewelry parties and Mary Kay parties and things like that and they get offended if you ask them (nicely) not to bring them.
@CorgiTales - I'm guessing your family didn't do the "kids table" thing at Thanksgiving, huh?
This is just my opinion, but I really think the only viable argument against a no-kids policy is one of convenience for parents - and if you're hiring an onsite sitter that one loses a lot of its punch.
so much of my life w/my family and friends involves their children! i could never ask, and wouldn't want to for that matter, for them to leave them at home. i want my whole family to share in my special day. so i'm curious too.
@Peyton - I think a lot depends on the kid and the event.
I've known lots small people who enjoyed getting dressed up and were capable of sitting quietly for an extended period. I've also known bunches who were like to die if they weren't the center of attention and never met nice pants that didn't require immediate soiling.
I'm also hard pressed to remember an event that I didn't attend as a child, exclusion from which scarred me for life.
Kids are great. Their company is, in many instances, preferable to that of adults. There are circumstances though, and a wedding may be one of them, where their presence is undesirable for the comfort of both guests and the kids themselves.
I didn't say anything about people not getting to have the wedding of their choosing, I just said I would personally not ever do that and I don't agree with it. Does it mean I would boycot a wedding where kids weren't allowed? Absolutely not. But I wouldn't be very impressed with the choice.
But I am sure there are people who would have not been impressed with our choice to include our pint-sized family members on the invite list while listening to my 4 year old autistic cousin yell "Yay!" during our ceremony. To each their own.
Edit: As to the reason why I think its so important to include children: I simply view my family members as my family members. Our wedding was about our family and closest friends coming together to support us getting married and committing to each other and our families for the rest of our lives. I find it unfortunate to not include a family member just because they're aren't the right age.
I personally like the sounds of kids and babies making noise in those quiet solemn moments of ceremonies. It keeps me firmly grounded in the absolute reality of the world, and these kids are the future of the families that my husband and I married into. All my relatives and friends who brought their children took turns keeping their eyes on the hoarde (we had over 20 kids under age 11 running around, it was fantastic) and everyone was happy to be able to see each other. We have family from all over two countries, and many of them rellished the opportunity to see their nieces, nephews, cousins they hadn't seen in a few years.
We are allowing immediate family's children at our wedding. But FI's brother and sister in law said that they are getting a sitter for their 2 kids because they said they want to enjoy themselves. I just told them- either way is fine with me. Although I think that weddings with kids are fun, I also think its totally fine to have a no-kids wedding if thats what you want!
I agree that it could get hairy if the bride or groom are actually close to any children but a lot of people just aren't. There are lots of kids in my family and of course I love them as family members.... but in general? I just don't like kids. I'm sorry... I just don't really interact well with them. I'm not silly. I'm not patient. I don't think its cute when things get destroyed. Kids are really loud and really messy.
I feel like if there is ONE day of my life that I should have my way-- it should be my wedding. I don't want fingers in the cake or crying during the ceremony or sticky fingers on my dress.
I realize I'm being brutally honest here and I probably wouldn't say all those things to anyone in my family, but those are my true thoughts on the topic.
I think the polarity of opinions in this thread really drives home the point about children vs. no children (and, for that matter, a great majority of the entirety of wedding-based decisions): Whether or not you (and your FI) want to include or exclude children should be *your* decision, and not one that is based on what everyone else in your family wants!
It should be a choice that is made at the discretion of the couple without fear of repercussion(s) or judgment . . . just like where/when the wedding is held, whether or not an encore bride decides to wear white, or whether a first-time bride decides to wear color!
WB is last place I would expect to find a *no children please* policy to be referred to as *ridiculous* . . . what is right for each couple is as varied as the couples here themselves.
@Corgi: I too am firmly in the no sticky fingers/ messes/ crying camp.
I think an interesting point to also bring up is, are the kids really THAT offended they can't go? Unless the bride and groom go out of their way to have a kid-friendly reception with activities for them, no kid has fun at a wedding that's under the age of 11 or so.
I'm totally okay with child-free weddings, and I often wonder why parents get so offended when their child isn't invited, especially because the child usually doesn't care one way or another. I know that when I was little, an evening away from mom with the cool babysitter was always more favorable than a boring adult event. So I have to wonder, if we're not offending the child, why are we offending parents with a "no kid's reception" when the child doesn't care and/or often understand what's going on anyway?
@corgitales, we must be related! LOL! I dont care much for children at this point in my life. I did not invite my own neices and nephews, and it was my decision. No one forced me. So when the couples 'no child' policy eliminates children they have close relationships with, they are aware of it. And to suggest that i have to have a 'good reason' not to invite kids is presumptuous. Any reason is a good reason. Its my wedding.
AFishCalledPuddles - but I think the things you're comparing are apples & oranges. Whether or not a brides choose to wear color, generally speaking, isn't going to result in the exclusion of anyone or seriously hurt anyone's feelings. When couples choose to take no kids policies to the extreme by excluding their siblings' children (as in the example posted above), people's feelings often get hurt. I agree in principle that a bride should have her day and get what she wants for her wedding, but I don't agree with the trend that appears to be occuring where that "it's my day" mentality is used to justify hurting others' feelings. Do I think the mom in the example posted should have boycotted her son's wedding? Absolutely not. Do I think that the couple in the example posted above was ridiculous to begin with? Yes. But we're all entitled to have opinions on here, and I know this is a hotly contested topic.
@CorgiTales - If it's helpful to hear, I like kids quite a bit, but I still wouldn't include them at my wedding or reception for the reasons you mention.
@MissChapstick - I wonder if some of it has to do with changes in parenting over the years? Or maybe in different regions?
I'm glad I'm not the only one! I thought I might have to duck for cover bc I feel like I've gotten a lot of crap for my opinions on kids.
@peyton- you're right... it isn't quite the same because feelings are involved. But, we have to look at whether it is reasonable for feelings to be hurt in the first place. You think its ridiculous not to invite kids; I think its ridiculous to have hurt feelings because your kids can't come. I think that when it boils down... we need to not judge each couple for choosing to celebrate their wedding in their own way.
I have a child and I personally don't have a problem with the "no children" request for a wedding. Would i go this route? Obviously not, but i have been to a few weddings where the mothers have sat at the table the whole time trying to keep their kids entertained for the night, which inevitably prohibits them from mingling and having some adult time. I've also witness slightly older kids being bored out of their minds with nothing to do. On the flip side, I was recently at a wedding that had several children and towards the end of the night, they stole the show. They were out on the dance floor and everyone circled around watching their cute show off dances. It was adorable.
I do think that you may want to keep in mind whether the majority of your guests are local or having to travel. If they are traveling for your wedding, it's a little much to ask them not to bring their children. Having to leave your kids behind while you are several hours or even a plane ride away is very difficult, inconvenient and expensive. If they are all local, it's a little easier to get a sitter for the night and have a fun night adult night. Just a thought for those that are considering an adult only reception...
There were no fingers in my cake, there were no messes spilled on my dress or anywhere else, and I am pretty sure that the kids who attended my wedding had a ton of fun running around the park we had it in and playing with each other.
I think you're free to have your opinion on here, whether or not you think a childless wedding is ridiculous. The important thing is to acknowledge that its the bride and groom's choice. Having an opinion about the choice is not something that can be helped. Did any of you ever stop to think that saying things like "Children don't belong at weddings," can be pretty offensive, too?
I remember not being invited to weddings as a little kid. I definitely wanted to be able to go and see the bride and such, but I wasn't included/welcome (I don't know if it was my parents choice or the bride and groom's choice).
I also remember being allowed to attend the ceremony and then being unceremoniously dumped back at home with a sitter so my parents could attend the reception.
I wasn't scarred for life because of it.
I think too many people worship their children and refuse to exclude them. It's fine for children to realize the world doesn't revolve around them and that they are not always welcome. It's also fine for parents to realize that the world doesn't revolve around their children and that their children are not always welcome!
@ Miss Chapstick: I definitely think this is more about the parents than about the children!
@ Peyton: Obviously there are extreme brides who are callous and demanding. Ignoring that extreme, why should *any* decision a bride makes be open to judgment and referred to as *ridiculous*? That hardly seems fair - the last thing any bride needs is additional pressure from family members (or even friends and co-workers, etc.) over whether or not children are invited to a ceremony. Wedding planning is stressful enough!
And, since I am being completely candid (and Peyton, this is totally not directed at you in any way!), what is more disturbing to me than the *it's my day* mentality some brides display is the *i have kids and therefore everything should revolve around me* mentality that some parents display.
@arosychicklet & afishcalled puddles- i agree about the world revolving around the kids mentality! When I was a kid my parents did not take me to weddings (although they weren't no-child weddings); they didn't take me to adult-oriented movies; they didn't take me out to nice dinners. They took me to kid appropriate places and when they wanted a nice meal they got a babysitter. I was a server for years and I"m sure that has effected my view of children because day after day after day I had to clean up after them while their parents smiled blindly on as the screamed and disrupted everyone. sigh.
Um, the bearded mom answer had me laughing. The poor mom :) I would never want to have that conversation with anyone!
I'm inviting kids that are related to myself or my FI, but all the other kids need to find other arrangements. I think neices, nephews & cousins have the right to be at my wedding... but if I allowed my other friends to bring their broods our wedding would be overrun with children!
I'm not against the "no kids" policy, but I'm not 100% for it. It depends on the situation, your location & your personal feelings. To each their own :)
@corgitales, i was a nightmare to have at a wedding when i was younger. i could not sit still for the life of me. once i got myself and my older sister removed from a church service because i kept crawling over the pews [our mom was singing in the choir]. sooo i'm inclined to not invite kids. however, i do plan on including my nieces and nephew and inviting the kids of guests who will be travelling because it's hard to get a sitter for several days versus one night. but for locals, it shouldn't be too hard to find a sitter for a few hours. too be honest, it's also a cost consideration as well.
as far as the original post, i'm shocked a mother led the charge for the boycott! that's more hurtful than anything else.
As far as worried about kids being bored, its a good opportunity to teach kids that sometimes you're gonna be bored, and you just gotta suck it up and deal with it. I think a wedding is a perfect opportunity for a child to see that, in fact, the world does NOT revolve around them. They can witness first hand the world revolving around the bride and groom for a couple hours.
@mskalinin - It's not really fair to say that everyone has a right to his or her own opinion while simultaneously slamming the one you find objectionable or offensive in the same breath.
And while I agree in principle that the best way to teach children to act like adults is to expose them to situations where they are obligated to behave, brides and grooms aren't being unreasonable to ask that their wedding not be used as a "teachable moment" in basic etiquette. This is leaving aside the fact that, short of bodily restraints, some of the most charming, well-intentioned and affectionate kids are, because of age or termperament, incapable of sitting quietly for the duration of a marriage ceremony or entertaining themselves during cocktail hour.
How was I slamming anything? I clearly said its everyone's personal choice.
@ Corgi: I think our parents were certainly cut from the same cloth! My brother and I did not go to fancy dinners or other adult social events . . . if my Mom was hosting the event, my brother and I would stay long enough to greet guests, say good night, and then we went upstairs.
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