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I am in the UK, and I notice a lot of people here are from the USA, and we have different traditions.
One of the things that I keep noticing is that brides complain about their BMs being picky over dresses, and BMs whining about the dresses that they have to wear. I would be all ok with it, if the bride paid for the dress, but I often see people being asked to pay $200 for a dress they don't like and will never wear again, plus matching shoes etc (never mind the cost of hosting a bridal shower, bacholerette (sp?) party and actually going to the wedding).Does anybody remember Mrs Penguin's blog post on how much going to a wedding costs, never mind actually being part of the wedding. http://www.weddingbee.com/2009/08/26/the-cost-of-being-a-wedding-guest/
When I mentioned this on another board, I was told "if you can't pay then don't agree to be a BM".
Another thing that I see is cash bars being referred to as "cheap" "tacky" and other things. In the UK it is common to have wine with dinner, then maybe champagne for toasting and speeches, then the rest of the night is either cash bar.
I don't think that BM's should be put in a position where they feel they can't afford to come to your wedding. It would break my heart that my BM wouldn't be able to stand next to me on the most important day of my life, due to finances.
In conclusion, I would prefer a cash bar over having to make my closest friends pay loads of money to be in my wedding, and would by them their dresses.
Well put. You get the opposite of flames from me! (So, ice? That's no good. You get my point. lol)
We're subsidizing the cost of my bridesmaids' dresses. Since we can afford it, we really would like to do it. We tried to buy them for them, but all of my bms said that they didn't want us to do that! Such sweet girls. :)
We have a best woman, and we kow that she has a really poorly paid job. We are buying her dress for her, and will make sure it will be something that she will wear agian.
It really annoys me, that there is an attitude of "well I had to pay for my BM dress, so they can too". It sounds a bit bridezilla-ish to me!
I agree with you too! My BMs are having their dresses made by a seamstress so they can each get the style they prefer. She's actually much cheaper. I'm also buying the fabric for them to cut the costs even more. I don't think a cash bar is "tacky"--I think people need to pay for what they can afford. We're hosting wine, beer and champagne. I'd love to provide liquor too but it's way over budget!
I agree with you on several of your points. I think the trend of mismatched dresses and prints is becoming more popular because girls are being more sympathetic about the stigma of the ugly dresses. I wish I could pay for my girl's dresses, but we're on a super limited budget. I'm looking for dresses well under $100 though...
I'm jumping on the ice train!
Oh i hate the "eye for an eye" atittude, to, in regards to dresses. Just b/c it's "even stevens" doesn't make it all okay.
We covered ALL of my bridesmaids expenses (i was going to buy dresses but mom ended up making them--i still ended up paying for hair and makeup PLUS i bought them presents). I spent SO much money on all them, but I felt it was the right thing to do. Then, when I got shafted with an expensive bridesamid dress plus having to do my own hair and makeup for their weddings, it just felt...i dunno, unreciprocated, even though I understand that that's how it is. I felt like, "really?" and kind of unprioritized in the big scheme of thing. Lavish flower arrangements but no love for the bridesmaids? I'd rather scale back on things like cake (which I did) to let my friends know I appreciated them. It's a very european mindset, but I also think it's just common courtesy
That's why I'm a big fan of picking a color (like black or brown) and having the BMs pick their dresses. Most would either already have a dress they could wear or would pick one at a price point they felt comfortable with. And if I thought any of my BMs truly had a hard time with the finances of it, I would pay for their dress. (I paid for a friend's dress in my first wedding for just that reason).
Cash bars, on the other hand, I just can't get behind as much. I totally get where you're coming from, but I do think the reason why most people don't agree with cash bars is similar to your reasoning behind the BMs dresses - people don't want to have their guests pay anything to attend their wedding. Hope that makes sense.
I agree with you. Our bar is included with cost of venue, so we don't have that worry, but my BM's are allowed to wear whatever closed toed black shoes they want, and we paid for the rush order on their dresses and half the cost of the dresses. I hate being a BM in a wedding wearing a dress I will never wear again. Our BM dresses can be cut off at the knee and can totally be worn again as a LBD!
With my BMs, I've asked them to buy a cocktail or tea-length dress in purple. Light purple, dark purple - don't care. Just purple, ideally more bluish than reddish. And silver shoes. Dark silver, light silver - don't care. My hope is that they'll be able to truly wear them again. It was always my intent to have a mis-matched bridal party, but the decision seemed even more reasonable when you consider that none of my ladies live in the same state, so all of them will be stuck paying for airfare at least once for my wedding. And if any of them had declined to be a BM due to cost, my fiance and I would have figured out a way to include them. These friends are the family I've chosen, and I want them up there with me when I say "I do".
That's true, but a lot of brides today are giving their 'maids a color scheme and letting them pick their own dress, or putting their girls in dresses from JCrew that they can definitely wear again. Personally, my two girls requested a color they wouldn't look dead in and something that wasn't strapless. Though I've seen a million beautiful strapless dresses, I've decided to go with a dress with straps that will make them happy. Also, I did my best to keep it under $100.
And like Albee, I think a lot of us (me too!) are choosing to serve wine, beer and sparkling wine for free rather than have a cash liquor bar. It seems like a good happy medium between cash bar, which is seen as tacky in the States, and paying off your outstanding wedding liquor debt for the next 3 years.
I agree with you in some aspects but I really don't see what a cash bar has to do with bridesmaid dresses. I think that in every wedding there are priorities and compromises. I wouldn't dream of having a cash bar and wearing a dress (as a bride) that cost several thousand dollars, some brides would be fine with that.
I think you are drawn to the BM dress situation b/c of cultural reasons. I know that in Ireland it is expected that the bride will pay for BM dresses, thats just how it's done (maybe the same in the UK?). Here in the US it has been traditionally expected that if a BM agrees to the position, she will pay for the dress.
I don't see anything wrong with helping your BMs pay for their dresses but I don't think it's horrible if you don't.
PS, I've lived in both Ireland and the US, I've been in 3 weddings where I paid ~$200 for each dress that I'll never wear again. I choose a color and a lenght and asked my BMs to pick the dresses. Some choose dresses that cost less than $100.
My point is that people prioritise free booze but at the detriment of having to have their BMs pay lots for dresses.
I totally understand if budgets are limited and people have cut back on loads of other things, but when people have open bars, $$$ dresses etc, and then make friends buy dresses they don't like/ will never wear again, it annoys me.
So you are saying that you'd rather buy dresses for your 5 closest friends and have the 200 people you INVITED to your wedding buy their own booze at the event that you are hosting?
Lets put an aussie spin on things, If the BMs dresses cant be worn again the bride pays. If the BMs are given heaps of freedom they pay. as for alcohol It is rare to see a cash bar or free spirits it is generally free wine beer and champez as we aussies like to call it.
BTW I didnt realise you Poms have cash bars, I don think aussies are as into spirits, probably a climate thing, we love our Beer and Whiiiine
@JoeyEmma, I'm an Australian living in the UK, and having a British wedding. One of my bridesmaids is British and the other one is Australia -- so their expectations are a bit different, too!
I do get where you're coming from on bridesmaids' dresses. As I'm paying for the dress, I feel like I'm more able to be more specific about what I want. If I were asking my BMs to pay for the dress, I'd feel really awkward telling them I want them to wear a certain dress or a certain style.
I agree that some of the language used on WB about cash bars can be a bit hurtful coming from a place where cash bars are absolutely the norm.
I've never been to a wedding with an open bar after dinner. We're having a cocktail reception with free drinks, wine during dinner and champagne for toasting. Once the disco starts, we'll put any cash we have left over from the reception budget behind the bar, and after that it's the traditional British wedding disco cash bar. My guests will be drinking on my tab from 5pm to 9pm -- which I'm comfortable is enough.
My feeling is that, as this is a predominantly US board, some things that strike me as tacky or that I wouldn't dream of doing are normal in the US, and so I shut up about them because it's not my place to judge what's tradition/etiquette in other countries. Yes, I do feel a bit stung when I read negative comments about the way I'm having my wedding -- but I accept that they're based on different cultural norms, and try not to let the sting go too deep!
i'm walking the middle line here (so lukewarm water to run with the flame/ice theme? ok, i've taken it too far)...
we're hosting beer and wine all night, but not cocktails. and i've offered to pay for all the girls' dresses, but am INSISTING on two of them since they're in different financial situations. So 2 of my girls are insisting on buying their own dresses, and i'm insisting on buying 2 of the girls' dresses.
how's that for a nice middle ground? ;)
Simplechic- I like it.
The main bug bear is when it is a dress that the BM hates or will NEVER wear again.
For my bridesmaids, I just told them that the dresses had to be blue and at least knee-length. They got to choose the style themselves. My MOH was able to wear her dress again at her own wedding reception a few months later, so I was glad she got extra use out of it.
As for the cash bar, if I drank, I would be all for it. I think that if guests want to get drunk, it should be on their own dollar. And I know that not everyone gets drunk, so sorry if it seems like I'm generalizing.
I didn't have alcohol at my wedding, but if I had been pressured into it, cash bar would have been the direction I would have gone with. though not for the toasts.
@simpleandchic -- you've just underlined for me why I'm finding it tricky to figure out whether to pay for my girls' dresses or not -- because it's a pretty fluid situation in Australia! I want them to basically choose something I'll also like, but I think I'll offer to pay (and hopefully end up splitting the difference...).
@wonderland - I completly agree, it's not anyones place to judge people based on traditions in a different culture, and honestly, traditions or norms among different groups of friends.
Every wedding I've ever been to have been weddings with open bars where the BMs pay for their own dresses. This is what is normal in my region among my family and friends.
I try not to use the word tacky and I understand that an open bar isn't expected in all cultures/groups. In the same way that people don't like being judged for having a cash bar, I don't like being judged for the fact that my BMs paid for their own dresses.
Weddings are full of priorities and compromises.
Whether or not something is tacky or appropriate depends entirely on how it would be perceived by guests.
Different stroke for different...hemispheres? Time zones?
I agree with you TOTALLY. I actually just told my BM's to get whatever dress they wanted and gave them a choice of two colors. My MOH didn't like the idea of a bunch of different fabrics (she is way more picky than me), so she actually talked them all into going for the same designer and same fabric, but there were still about 50 dresses to choose from.
I didn't know she was being kind of MOH-zilla about this (she is very perfectionist, but my other BM's all know her well so we all just thought it was funny). I asked the other BM's if they wanted me to tell her to lay off, but they all said they were fine with her suggestion so we rolled with it.
I guess its easy for me to say not to take the whole BM Dress thing so seriously because a) I had awesome BM's who didn't care about what they were wearing and b) I didn't care much about what they wore. But I think its totally right, you should look at it as a big picture thing, not as a dress. They are spending a ton of money to be in your wedding, the least they can get out of it is a dress they may be able to wear again someday!
@JoeyEmma:
"One of the things that I keep noticing is that brides complain about their BMs being picky over dresses, and BMs whining about the dresses that they have to wear."
I must say, I RARELY if EVER hear any bride on this board whining or complaining about their bridesmaids and the dress. Most of us are very understanding of the financial obligations imposed by a wedding and we have tried to be sensitive to it. I'm just saying, I don't think it's fair to make such sweeping observations about a nation full of brides.
I choose not to comment on the "cash bar" issue as I don't want to fuel that debate...
I'm not doing cash bar but I by no means find it tacky. However, I'm going to have to go ahead and disagree with you that it is a "bridezilla" attitude to say that since I've had to pay my own way as far as BM expenses go, I should have to feel bad making my BMs pay their own expenses, especially since they are picking their dresses. With my group of friends at least - and I can't speak for anyone else's experiences but my own - it's expected that the BM pays her own way. As is evident here, that is obviously not the way it is in some circles or cultures, but that's been my experience. I'm not making them wear any particular shoe or jewelry and we're having a day of beauty which is my treat, I just can't afford dresses for six girls.
And BTW - the word "bridezilla" is just as offensive on WB as the words "cheap" or "tacky"
And before I get flamed for saying we're doing open bar but I'm not paying for dresses, my parents are paying for all reception costs. I would be paying for the dresses myself, and while my parents can afford open bar, I can't afford to pay for dresses. My parents also insisted on open bar as that is the norm in our circle.
I should have pointed out that my musings came from another wedding board. A girl was complaining that her BM was complaining about having to wear a dress that she hated. The BM was having to pay for a pricey dress which she would never wear again. All the comments from other brides, were basically telling the bride to tell her friend it was tough luck, that she had to have that dress and that she had agreed to be a BM and would have to do it.
I posted that they could consider paying for the dress for her, and got shot down. They pointed out that they had had to buy dresses they didn't like in the past.
I'm not happy that I have a $200 dress in my closet that is a) ugly b) makes me look fat and C) can't wear again.
=]
The alcohol: I have never been to a wedding where we were expected to pay for alcohol. My family would not have looked upon a cash bar favorably!! Its the same on my husband's side. We decided to pick our venue with this in mind, and chose a city park where we could schlep everything in ourselves.
This way we were able to provide our own alcohol (tons of it) and make everyone happy, while saving money, too. It cost us under $1000 to provide limitless wine, beer, and liquor, plus a bottle of champagne per table for the toast. Everyone was super happy with the serve-yourself style we chose (no bartender) and we didn't break the bank to do it.
I think a lot of people haven't experienced things outside their own cultural norms, and more importantly, haven't experienced being judged on their norms verses others. That's why I like weddingbee, a lot of different cultural practices get brought to my attention, even within the US. I agree that using the word tacky is not very sensitive and would never do it myself since I don't like the word, but at the same time thinking that something is tacky is not inherently wrong is it?? I am positive there are some things that I chose to do with my wedding that people would find "tacky," and it doesn't offend me because I have different tastes from others, and we come form different backgrounds.
Maybe I just look at WB too scientifically, just looking at facts, not taking it personal! ^__^
@ejs: Really?? I LOVE my puke green, full length satin dress that makes me look pregnant!! So many appropriate occasssions to bring that bad boy back out for a party! lol.
Hey, don't you British do themed pub crawls, or is that in the movies? you should do an annual bridesmaid dress pub crawl!
We should start a thrread on what to do with old, unwearable BM dresses. I know some people get them made into other garments, or use them to make fancy pillowcases!
We're hosting wine and beer and people can purchase mixed drinks if they so choose, and not paying for bridesmaid dresses. We're on a tight budget, and I really don't mind if people think I'm tacky for my limited bar and purchase-if-you-please option.
I mentioned to my bridesmaids that they could all pick a knee length dress in navy blue so they could all stay in their own budget since I have one bridesmaid who needs to be very fiscally responsible right now due to her job situation and another who just came back from the Peace Corps and is also adhering to a strict budget, but they nixed it. They're all very busy and didn't want the added pressure of having to find their own dresses, even though I told them I wouldn't be demanding about what they choose at all, as long as they felt good. So for their convenience, we'll just go with a dress around $100 and call it a day. They don't have a problem with it and I don't have a problem with it.
Y'know, I feel like I have to justify my decisions in these posts, and I think that's worse than actually making the decisions. I'm kinda tired of people judging the way other people decide to do things. Respectfully comparing and talking about differences in cultural norms or area customs is one thing, and it's fine talking about why you felt you needed to make the decision you did, but I think it's pretty annoying to throw blanket statements of "that's wrong" in either direction.
I agree with you 100%!!! I couldn't afford to buy my MOH's dress, so I told her to get something she liked that she could afford. I was not going to throw down an edict that she spend $400 on a dress she'd probably never wear again!
@sunshinebride I will admit that I have never been on a themed pub crawl! I think they're mainly a film thing, or for hen/stag nights or other 'events'.
Mind you I only moved here in my mid-20s, so it might also be part of the university scene.
I agree with you totally. I didnt want my bm to have exspensive dresses i was thining 50 buck dresses and actually found ones for 20. That way there not out that much.
I agree with the dress thing. I have two BMs, sister and cousin, and I told them they could pick any J.Crew dress that came in the the specific color I picked, and I bought them. (Even with that my sister complained!) I didn't want them to have to fork out the money when I knew they would be throwing me 2 showers and a bachelorette party. However, as far as the cash bar: personally, I would definitely be embarrassed to make my guests pay. There are ways to save on cost for the bar, such as a signature drink or wine/beer/champagne only, and I would rather do that.
My Bm's knew that I couldn't afford to buy their dresses and they were more than happy to purchase it themselves. That being said I didnt' want them to spend a lot on the dress. I was pretty open about what they could wear as far as color and style as long as the colors stayed in our color scheme. We all went shopping together. Well they actually all decided on the same dress and it was about $150. I thought that was too much to spend on a dress but they told me I had no say in how much they spent. The dress looked great on all of them (they are all different shapes too!) so they agreed that that was the dress they would be wearing. Since it is chocolate brown and knee length they all said they could wear it again but we shall see....
So to offset the cost of the dress I paid for the cabin we stayed in the weekend of the wedding. That way they didn't have to pay for lodging.
As for the bar at the wedding, we had wine gifted to us from a friend that works at a winery and DH's uncle gifted us a keg (he also had a jockey box thing that has the tap on it so it didn't feel like we were at a keg party!)
And I agree with spinningjenny, we shouldn't say a particular way is right or wrong, nice or tacky. It seems like most of us on here are payng for our weddings ourselves, we should be able to do what we want for our wedding and not have to worry about offending anyone.
eh...i think this is a regional, cultural, and social thing. In my social circle, it would be taboo to ask guests to pay for their own drinks. you either have no alcohol, limited alcohol, or free alcohol. you dont ask people to pay. in my circle, its also expected that BMs buy their own dresses. Ive been in multiple wedding with various edics about said dresses, and for my wedding, I gave them a choice of 10 different styles. But nonetheless, I didnt pay. Nor did I pay for airfare, hotel rooms, etc. I paid for jewelry and make up. For some people, $200 is a lot to pay for a dress. For others, its not. I think we should just keep in mind that we all have different backgrounds and expectations. I didnt even occur to me to pay for their dresses, and I didnt even consider buying their dresses (I had 9 BMs) and making the guests pay for their drinks. but if thats the norm where youre from, more power to you. Just dont judge us, because we arent judging you.
I totally understand and agree with you...however, luckily my BM's ARE buying their own dresses. It's funny, actually - my MOH is SO used to being a BM and her other friends are exremely high-maintenance (as she can be herself) and expected all their bridesmaids to do EVERYTHING these brides say / want. In fact - my MOH keeps tellin me - "oh you'll come around and start bossing us around". She's not USED to having such a laid back girl, such as myself - be a bride...
I keep telling her - I want to make sure THEY are comfortable and I DON'T have any demands that they must adhere to - and SHE (my MOH) isn't comfortable with that! she doesn't think it's natural! lol
Now, granted, I'm very thankful that they are paying for their own dresses - but I keep reminding them - my most important "demand" is that THEY are comfortable wearing this dress all day! I don't wanna pick something that A. doesn't look god on them and B. they're not comfortable in.
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