Ectopic pregnancy and the "abortion" debate…..

posted 1 year ago in Pregnancy
Member
3170 posts
Sugar bee

First of all, I’m sorry you are having to go through all of this!  Thank you though for sharing your story, I feel like a lot of people don’t look at this issue in that way and could use a wake up call. 

Member
5130 posts
Bee Keeper

First of all, I’m so sorry for your situation.  I can’t even imagine what you’re going through right now.

I went to Catholic high school and was required to take a theology class every semester of every year through graduation.  In my unit on birth control, we discussed this exact sort of situation.  According to the priest who taught the class, in this situation, the proper thing to do would be surgery right now.  In this surgery, you would not actually kill the fetus; you would just remove it.  Then, all doctors and nurses would solemnly watch over the baby as it naturally died (because it no longer had your body to support it).  If you were Catholic, you would have a priest there so he could baptize the baby immediately before it died.

I think the Catholic church is about as pro-life as you get, and even they would be in favor of getting that baby out of you before it does any lasting damage.

Member
4338 posts
Honey bee

I mean this in the nicest way possible, but why are you doing this to yourself? You’re already in a terrible predicament I wouldn’t wish upon anyone. Why are you asking bees who disagree to potentially judge and insult you?

Member
3170 posts
Sugar bee

@GreenEyedMoon:  In this surgery, you would not actually kill the fetus; you would just remove it.

So I totally understand you are just repeating the Catholic Church’s standpoint, but isn’t that really just splitting hairs? Isn’t cutting off someone’s oxygen supply killing them?

Member
5130 posts
Bee Keeper

@Natalieh86:  According to the church, there’s a difference.  If someone cannot live on their own without extraordinary means and is not expected to get better (in this example, the baby needs extraordinary means because the mom’s body is basically a life support system.  The baby isn’t expected to get better because the pregnancy isn’t viable.  The statement also applies to other situations, like if someone is braindead and in a coma after a car accident, and the doctors say there’s no way they’ll recover, and the person is on life support), then it’s okay to remove their life support system.  That way, you’ve done everything you can to try and save the life, and you’re simply removing the extraordinary measures keeping them alive.  In the car accident example, you would remove the life support system and allow the person to suffocate or starve or whatever – not inject them with a heart-stopping drug.

Splitting hairs, yes, but the Church says it’s an important difference.

 

OP, I don’t think anyone in the world could possibly criticize you for deciding to terminate the pregnancy.  The only criticism you could possibly garner from anyone, in my opinion, is for how you do it.  That being said, I personally don’t care how you do.  You’re in an impossible situation, and all I want to do is give you a hug.

Member
4338 posts
Honey bee

@3xaCharm:  No matter the outcome, I wish you a speedy recovery, and peace as you go through this rough patch. I hope the bees have the decency to stay respectful and realize you are a person facing a horrible scenario no one can possibly understand until standing in those shoes. I can’t explain the mentality to you, because I don’t understand it myself, but I hope understanding it helps you in the way you need, and I hope your story brings tolerance and consideration from the other side.

Member
129 posts
Blushing bee

To my understanding greeneyedmoon is correct about Church teaching. Ectopic pregnancies are the only time it is morally acceptable to deliberately end a pregnancy.  Intention matters here. In this case, it is not your intention to end the life of the baby (though it is a foreseeable consequence). It is your intention to use medical intervention to treat a situation that is life threatening to both you and the baby. Unfortunately, the only treatment available will almost certainly have the unintentional but foreseeable consequence of the baby’s death.

Member
5129 posts
Bee Keeper

@3xaCharm:  I can’t respond because I’m scary ridiculously prochoice, I just wanted to send my love your way that I am so sorry about everything you are going through. Hugs.

to everyone else, she’s asking for a calm debate, please don’t attack her. 

Member
3170 posts
Sugar bee

@GreenEyedMoon:  Thanks for the explanation.  

I feel like the issue with the “mother’s life” exception isn’t that most people don’t agree with it.  I would be interested in the numbers but I would imagine that a pretty low number of people would actually agree that you should not be able to terminate the pregnancy.

I think that main issue is that so many people don’t realize the importance of protecting this right. 

Member
646 posts
Busy bee

In my catholic pre-marital classes they touched on these type of situations. Sometimes you are best off going with the science. Jesus would not want you to suffer when there is science there to help you. 

I’m very sorry you are struggling with this. I wish you the best and hope your heart is not heavy with any guilt because you are doing what is best for you. Remember Jesus loves you and understands. 

Member
243 posts
Helper bee

A lot of fertilized eggs get lost around this point. I don’t see the purpose in trying to take this to term as you’ll very likely lose the embryo at some point down the road. For me that would be worse: letting the recently fertilized egg to actually grow considerably, potentially becoming a grown fetus, without proper conditions or nourishment and risk to both of your lives. I think restarting is much more humane. 

I don’t know how this feels from experience but my mother does and I really empathize with what you’re going through. She tried to bring a pregnancy to term too late in life (no risk to her physical health though) and it all fell apart around the 4th month.  I think the pregnancy ending at the 4th month was much harder than if it had failed early on. 

Member
2034 posts
Buzzing bee

I am so sorry for your loss. 

I am poltiically pro-choice, but FI and I grew up in very pro-life households and are parents are as pro-life as you get. In general, they would say to take the chemo to treat you, and a side effect would be that you would miscarry the child. You aren’t trying to kill the child or end the pregnancy, you are saving your life. It would be reckless for you not to save your life because taking no action could kill you and your child.

 

Member
988 posts
Busy bee

I was intrigued by this question, so I started doing some reading on the Internet. I found several Christian non-Catholic viewpoints arguing against abortion for ectopic pregnancy. Their main argument is that abortion is always murder and is against God’s law. They also justify this by reporting some (IMO misleading) statistics saying that tubal rupture is not that common and not that lethal when it happens. They also argue that tubal pregnancies can sometimes become viable (there a small number of reported cases), so abortion isn’t justified as the fetus could survive even though the odds are small.

You can see these links for their full arguements

http://rightremedy.org/tracts/9

http://inashoe.com/2008/06/ectopic-pregnancy-and-the-sanctity-of-life/

http://www.ethicsdaily.com/christian-leader-rejects-abortion-to-save-a-womans-life-cms-12978

The official position of the Association of Pro-life physicians is “It is only ethical to remove the tubal pregnancy if spontaneous resolution does not occur after watchful waiting and if the physician is 100% certain that there are no twins. At this point, the embryo in the fallopian tube is likely to be dead and, even if not, the death is unavoidable and unintentional, and the procedure is necessary to save the life of the mother.” http://www.prolifephysicians.org/rarecases.htm

ETA: These are not my personal views. I’m sorry you find yourself in this difficult situation. I hope you can find peace to make the best decision for yourself and your family. I really hope that you don’t have any negative health impacts.

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