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I'd show him a few options ranging in price and package options. $1200 seems like a good rate to me, ours is ridiculously expensive. I do think you can get a lot of good photo's in 2 hours, given that there aren't a lot of guests. Maybe the CD option is the best one for you guys? That way you'll have the CD to make prints with whenever you can comfortably do so. I'm thinking, maybe your FI is just not aware of what the going rate is for a photographer. Also, explain to him how important these images will be. He should realize it will be the only thing you have left, when the day is over. Obviously you still have memories, but I've been told that they fade. And there will be moments you might miss, but the photographer gets. I hope he realizes its important!
Mr. Twista said the same thing to me when we were looking for photographers. He didn't understand what an AMAZING deal my favorite one was offering. Most places around here are a MINIMUM of $2000 and ours is so cheaper! But he still said it was ridiculous to spend so much money. Instead of fighting about it I said that I would pay for it entirely out of my pocket and that was that. He didn't think we should pay for anyone. He said that when his sister got married his uncle took all the pictures. Well I've seen them and you can obviously tell that his untrained uncle took all the pictures. It's really important to me that I have good professional pictures of our wedding and if paying for it myself is what I have to do then I'll do it.
Is there any way that you can save up for this? I think it is really important to have a professional taking your pictures so you don't have to worry about someone missing the important shots or bad cropping. It sounds like a really good deal to have the edited pictures for that price. Is there something else that you could compromise on?
I know we're going to need to talk about this some more. But, I want to wait until this photographer emails me back. I'm hoping she's available. I know that I could deal with having her for 4 hours, getting the CD, and getting our prints where we want. This is how we did our engagement pics. But, we had those done locally, and only for $100 for one hour.
I know this is bad, but I also want to see what FMIL says this weekend. She is going to be in town. We are getting married in her hometown, and she has made most of our other recommendations for vendors, so I'm hoping she will see my side on this. Also, FI is kind of a momma's boy (in a good way) and listens to most everything she says. So, keeping my fingers crossed that we can settle this soon....
I had the same discussion with my FI... Basically I looked for photogs and couldn't find anyone under $1,000 so the FI took over. We ended up with a super awesome photographer who is just getting started for about half that price! And she was giving away free engagement shoots all through April! If you can find a way to pay for a more expensive photographer... go for it! But, there are cheaper ones out there- you just have to look a little harder :)
I had the same sticker shock with photogs that ur FI is having. I just cant see spending that kind of money i think photogs who charge rates like that are greedy.
I ended up looking on CL and found someone who charges $400 for as long as we want including a disc and if we want anything else its extra. She is kinda starting out she had 5-6 weddings on her site and has a nother 5-10 booked this summer so by the time mine comes around she'll have tons of experience!
Her shots were really good already and it turns out i knew her SO & SIL!
I understand where your coming from. We will have a relatived small wedding as well. (about 70 people). And our photographer is about 1400 with cds and albums. They are really expensive. Did you and your husband come up with a budget? I would look and see what you are willing to give up for the price of the photographer..or you can hire a college student to do photos, a lot of them are trying to beef up their own book to start a business, you might want to take that route. I tried to do that by hiring a girl i went to high school with, but she ended up being non responsive, so i went with a company. I dont know alot of people in the city i live in now, so I dont have a lot of options. Good luck on your plans, and hopefully it gets better. When it comes down to it, you have to sit down with your fiance and discuss how you feel. If it means alot to you, im sure he will try to compromise, and if not. Do it anyways! I dont know how you do things...but i make things happen when my fiance says no. Later on he jumps on the wagon and joins. lol.
Mishelleez, I just wanted to respond to your comment about photographers who charge over $1000 being greedy, because as a photographer (who charges over that), gah--that one hurt. And I understand that it's nothing personal, but it is rough that the perception is out there and there are so few times when photographers get to actually address that issue that I wanted to try.
The first and most important thing to know is that photography is VERY expensive, not just for the brides, but also for the photographers. Cameras and lenses are astronomical, and more so the better they get. When I was starting out, I worked a full-time job and did photography, and put every penny I made back into the business, often taking the fee for an entire wedding to buy a single pro-grade lens (and yes, the difference is noticeable!). And there are a ton of other hidden costs to the brides that, if you're running your own business, you have to take into account as overhead, like the kind of computers that can support all the editing programs you have to run, software, external hard drives to store massively sized photos, insurance, education, etc. And way down on the list, the photographer (probably) would like to be paid themselves. :)
And listen, I totally get when people are able to charge less--I did it, we all start out there. Maybe they're still in the learning/getting experience phase, or they have other means of supporting themselves, but eventually, if a photographer wants to both make a career of it and give their brides the best possible pics via the best possible equipment and editing, they HAVE to charge more. It's just not optional. So I totally respect that every bride is on a budget and every budget is different, and I also respect that new photographers have to start somewhere and often, beginning photogs and brides who find each other share very happy results, and that's awesome. I just want to try to clear up any bad feelings or misconceptions about photographers can't or don't charge the minimum--I promise you, it's business--not greed.
@SarahBrownDowntown I totally agree! People don't realize that you aren't JUST PAYING for the 4 or 8 hours the photographer is phsically at your wedding. You're paying for the 20-30 hours of post-processing that a good photographer does on weddings. Have many people out there looked at how much the professional Adobe Creative Suite costs? Around $1600. Lightroom? $300. Multiple camera bodies? $2500 a pop. Lenses? $350-$2000 each. And these need to be upgraded and serviced regularly. Photographers that are *worth* the money invest a ton of time and resources into your wedding. It isn't a scheme to milk you for money. Even photographers who charge a lot often don't make more than $60,000-70,000 a year, and the average is much lower. Do your research before slamming photographers.
Thanks for your comment @SarahBrownDowntown. I absolutely agree with you. I'm not a professional photographer, but my wedding photographer is a friend of mine. FI and I are paying her $5500 for photography, and some people here may think that's ridiculous or exorbitant, but she's worth every penny. You get what you pay for people. I know she works her butt off to make every photo beautiful and you're right-- all the overhead and equipment costs have to be factored in. I should add that for that price, we're getting all-day wedding coverage, an e-session, 650 prints, all images on CD, second photog, online proofing, and an album. I think we're actually getting a lot for our money.
Thanks for the support, guys, and ddubzz, I TOTALLY forgot to mention second photog. I hope mine never reads this--he will be PISSED! :) I think that mostly it's an issue of people not really knowing what all goes into it, and it's so hard for photographers to get that information out there. But thank you and crayfish for helping. :)
Of course it’s nothing about you personally! Maybe ridiculously over priced is a better phrase for my feelings towards it. I understand it is expensive to run a business (that’s what I do for work) but when you look at most small business owners they don’t pay themselves and their profit margin is VERY small. With photog prices around or over 1k for 4 hours is just out of controll. Personally I wouldn’t pay anything that type of money to do anything.
Im not trying to offend anyone its just how i feel.
My FI freaked out about photographer prices when I said that the one I would love to hire starts at $4,000 which is way out of our budget. I thought this would help put things in perspective when I told him that I was looking in the $2,000-$2,500 range but no dice. He said that he doesn't even want to discuss it because he will never understand and I should just go ahead and book whoever I want. Really? Would never have guessed our first wedding fight would be about the photos. Luckily our moms and his sister are being supportive of my decisions!
Mishelleez, I know you weren't trying to offend anyone and I absolutely understand that it's a lot of money. And I have no problem with brides (or anyone) being on a budget. I just hope to help people understand that even if someone is out of your budget, doesn't necessarily mean they're "overpriced".
Lo, good luck--I know it's hard. Maybe he'll come around eventually--I know when I get frustrated, I sometimes need a cooling off period before I can have a rational discussion. Keep on keepin on!
I know it's hard to get guys to see the past the bottom line of what a photographer is costing you and I feel for you :(
However, just because you're having a small wedding doesn't make your day any less special. I know that a lot of times smaller wedding = smaller budget but you're still getting married and that fact wouldn't change even if you had a million guests.
You'll want pictures of the day you married your best friend, and you'll want good ones. Yes, as a photographer, I can admit that I'm biased about such things, but the truth is, after the wedding day is over, all you'll have left is your pictures.
I cannot tell you how many people I've met who have been married for a few years and told me how much they hated their wedding pictures (just to clarify, I was NOT their photographer!) and how they wished they would have chosen someone else to take their pictures.
It's really easy to get caught up in the numbers that keep adding up and it is scary. I think if you calmly explain to him that this should really be one of your priorities and that it is important to YOU, he'll understand.
Remind him that just because it's a small wedding it doesn't diminish the importance of your wedding day and that you're marrying each other!!
As a point of reference, this is a small destination wedding I did a few weeks ago. There were 45 people there. It was still a beautiful day and they were so thrilled to be marrying each other :)
Stick to your guns on this one. Eventually he'll realize that he's being stubborn and you're right :)
Photography was something that was really important to us so we agreed to splurge on it. I mean after the wedding is over it's pretty much ALL you have left. The food will be eaten, the party is over, you won't wear the dress again - why NOT pay a pro to document the day.
If you both agree that photography isn't important then find somene really cheap, but I can BET that one of the #1 regrets in wedding planning is not having a good photograher.
I'm also in the camp that does NOT think that photographers are greedy. You can look at the work of my photog (who is mid-range as far as price goes) and her pics are SO, SO much better than someone who is super cheap. You are not only paying for their time (which isn't JUST on your wedding day, someone above mentioned post processing), but you're paying for their talent as well.
When FI and I started looking at photographers, he about passed out from sticker shock. However, we shopped around, interviewed photographers, and looked at many different rates. He then saw what is typical for wedding photographers. Unfortunatly, they're expensive. However, we managed to find an amazing photographer who will be there all day for $2400. So it does take a lot of research. Another thing you can do is look for college students or those who are trying to make a name for themselves in the business. My FSIL paid $800 for new photographer for all day and her pictures turned out beautiful :)
When we started searching for a photog, we found several who we loved who were waaaay out of our price range, and it was really hard for us to let go. What I did was to email one and explain that I loved her artistic style but that she wasn't in our budget. I said that I respected her art too much to expect her to adjust her prices for us, but wondered whether she could recommend an up-and-coming photographer in a lower price range for us. She did just that and I fell in love with our photog. She's amazing, but hasn't done hundreds of weddings yet, so we got a great deal with her. It works out well for everyone - we got a good deal on the package we wanted, she gets to photograph us (I like to think we're a valuable addition to her profile since we're a varied-skin-tone couple), plus I am planning to promote the heck out of her on the WB local and vendor sections (plus I'll probably hit up the Knot, WeddingWire, etc.) once the wedding is over and I can give her glowing reviews. :)
@soon2bS don't cry! I just started a thread about this not too long ago because FI and I really can't pay more than $1000. Well the advice I got was to look on craigslist, the Knot or other wedding websites for photographers who are still trying to make their name in the wedding industry. Well in a short time we have found a few photographers whose work we think is very good who are charging $1000 for 8 hours, all prints processed and provided on a DVD. Don't worry it can be done! Good luck!
I'm having this one too, but i will not budge.
Our wedding will prob cost about 15k all in, the photog is about 1300 (I know, not a bad price) of that, and we get him for 12 whole hours, menaing we can do a fauxtobooth nicely too. FI is freaking and dragging heels, but I will. not. budge. He can make faces all he wants: I am not looking at crappy pics for the rest of my days.
That said, if you can find someone starting out who has obvious talent, go for it.
As a side note, not trying to put pressure on you, but my brother's wedding photog was so talented, but a total cow! She bullied everyone the whole time she was there, and we were all delighted when she went! Photos were fine, but the whole thing was soured a little. Try find someone nice! Go with recommendations if you can.
Best of luck!
If we could afford it I would probably pay 10,000 for photography. I think it's an art and it's in high demand so why not!
$1000 for a PRO is an AMAZING price.
On the other hand..
$1000 for an AMATUER with zero formal training [other than self-taught technique] not so amazing. I know there are a LOT of really good amatuers out there, but I really do NOT think that they are justified charging the same amounts as pros.
I don't know what your final decision would be, but I would definitely get quotes from other pro's out there, even the reaaaaaaaally pricey ones, just to show your FI the comparable range; when he sees quotes for upwards of 10,000$ he may change his tune about budgeting an extra thousand dollars.
My sister got married last year and now I'm getting married next year and my BIL told me that you spend a lot of money on one night and you barely remember it. Which is why it may be worth it to spend the money on something that allows you to remember your wedding day forever. Pictures! I think compromise on other things, but not your pictures!
mishelleez - Another factor not mentioned is Taxes. Around 40% give or take of the price goes straight to uncle sam. And I'm not sure what kind of business you work for, but if the owner is not getting paid or barely breaking even I would start looking for a new job.
While not "personal" it is. I'm a wedding photographer/bride and so trust me, I totally get how fast wedding costs add up! However, I'm not going to mock any business for their prices. I can buy particle wood furniture from target for a decent price, but it may fall apart in a year... or if a spill happens it will warp.... OR, I could spend a few grand and get solid wood handmade Amish furniture that will last ages. You can get a "steak" at IHOP... but the one from Ruth's Chris will be a better evening and better tasting. There will always be a level of goods and prices.... it's up to the buyer to determine what best fits their needs.
However, it does become "personal" when one does not take into consideration what it takes at even a base cost to get those goods.... Or expects a business to loose money to provide a good or service and then ridicule their price that's already loosing money.
4 hours at a wedding equates to roughly 20+ hours of work. If on a saturday, likely that's the only wedding they will be able to book that week and therefore, it's like working "part time." One reason short weddings are still "expensive" for an experienced photographer is because if on a Saturday, it needs to feed their family for that week. An 8 hr wedding is equal to 40+ hrs of work for the week. If your work said this week you only get half pay because we just don't need you that long it would be a really hard week for you, I bet. You would find a job that can work you the whole week and pay you full....
So, $1000 for 4 hrs. (which is the number used to be "ridiculously over priced" and "out of control.")
50% to uncle sam = $500 towards the business for the week
$500 / 20 hrs = $25/ hr
Sounds good?
Camera Equipment: I have over $20k in equipment I bring to each wedding
Computers, education, etc.... has already been discussed.... Upkeep of equipment for most pro's is about 10K a year.
No employer contributions = nothing towards my 401K so i have to contribute to that.
Medical Insurance - again, no employer help = $40 for the week for my CRAP policy
Mortgage = $500 / wk - based on $2000 average mortgage in my area
Car Insurance, business insurance, etc...
This doesn't include food, future baby necessities, or the ability to see Iron Man this weekend :-)
Basically, I'm already in massive debt based on the above scenario... and most pro's cant mentally work EVERY weekend of the year because weddings are so grueling and tiring. On top of that, not many people get married in the winter, so a mere 40 weddings a year equates to an extremely busy schedule. Most pro's do between 20-30.
Please don't take this personally towards you, but like mentioned, it's not often there's a way to break down why is costs so much money. Buyers have choices, and just like I don't hold it personally against the best quality items, I hope you don't hold photography costs personally against photogs trying to make a living and feed their family. Everyone has choices, sometimes, I make the choice to spend top dollar and get the best product, like I did for my own photographer.... sometimes, I don't need to spend top dollar. Bust, just because I don't, doesn't mean the top dollar item is wrong for existing or "over the top."
This is also why normally, photographers will be more willing to work with your budget on a non-saturday.
janicegiraldo - your BIL is right! So many of my friends have photographer regret! I also get a lot of photographer regret people as clients for shoots after the fact, and that breaks my heart!
We rearranged our budget to put more money twords photography. The way I look at it, at the end of the night, we have each other, our wedding rings, a dress hanging in a closet, and the pictures to cherish for a lifetime.
I hope your FI understands and you are able to hire the photographer you want!
Just because you can't afford a photographer does not mean photographers are greedy. I can't afford a videographer, and I'm not blaming the videographers of the world because my wedding budget is what it is. AND the photographer who charges $400 because they are just starting out WILL start charging more as he/she upgrades equipment and such, becomes better at their craft, and becomes more in demand. It has nothing to do with greed. Also saying they are overpriced is really subjective. my photographer is charging $5500 plus tax and I think she is worth every penny and I totally $100% know that she deserves what we are paying her. We just had to save for the past year to afford it. that's one good thing about being engaged for 17 months.
Photography was something that was really important to me but my FI had severe sticker shock over the price. He thought it would only cost a couple hundred dollars for a photographer and that anything over that was overpriced. I have a friend from my hometown who is a photographer and I love her style so I knew she's who I wanted. Her prices were extremely reasonable for this area ($1100 + travel expenses) for 7 hours of shooting and all of the photos on a disk. He still thought that was outrageous but thankfully my parents offered to pay the cost of the photography as my grad school graduation gift. I think I've finally worn my FI down on the issue and he gets why it's so important to me but he still makes comments about why we couldn't just get his grandmother to take pictures!
@KLP- thanks for explaining that. I do wedding photography on the side and have had a few couples who do not understand cost. We just don't show up and take some photos- there are hours of editing after we take the photos.
For our wedding I was pretty inexperienced- we paid a professional photog $1600 for 7 hours of coverage. Our photos came back and were good composition wise (though I felt our photog could have directed us a little better...)- but there were no edits. The difference between an edited and unedited photo is HUGE.
I just want to note that while I don't think $1,500 is remotely overpriced or ridiculous some popular professional photographers make very good money. In the rush to point out all the work that goes into good photography and the expenses of life (both of which is totally true) I don't want people to overlook the fact that plenty of pro photographers have envy worthy incomes.
Nothing wrong with that, no reason talented people with good marketing shouldn't enjoy a happy income but lets not pretend that award winning featured in Martha Steward photogs are scrapping by.
1000-1500 is cheap. that is that! i had a fabulous photographer email me back about my info request and tell me that destination weddings START at $15K...and yes, that is thousand, not hundred (and we are talking california to colorado destination, not the arctic circle or something)! if there is anything worth investing in, it is photography, imo. however, reality does play a role, and budget constraints are always going to be there. i just saw a wedding that was pulled off for $3k total, and posted on another blog, and they essentially had a great potluck with adorable handmade decor, and put almost all their budget into their photographer. the result was amazing!
I agree. I think $1000-1500 is totally reasonable. I have a friend spending $15,000 on her photography - that might be more of a definition of excessive to me - but I'm sure they'll be spectacular. OUr photography is around that range without albums. We decided it made more sense to put our limited photography budget into the actual pictures. I think I'll try to make albums first and if I don't like them I can hire my photographers later to make them (and after the wedding itself is paid for!) My FI totally had sticker shock but after meeting with several photographers and understanding how important it was to me, we found room in our budget. good luck!
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I just want to cry. I have been upset all night. Last night I started looking to reserve a photographer, as we're now only 4 months out & still don't have one. Well, when I was looking, FI was loving the photos on the galleries. But, when I asked which one I should contact first, he wanted to know about the price. So, it looks like most of them are going to be at least $1,100 - $1,200 for 4 hours.
FI said "absolutely not". WTH??? He said there is no way we can afford that, and he's not willing to spend that much. He then went on to say he doesn't think we need someone for 4 hours to take just a few pics of us, us & kids, us & parents. Ummm.....ok....??? Granted, we're having a very small (30 people) wedding, and it's very informal. But, honestly, I don't think 4 hours is even enough time, but I'm willing to try to make-do with that to save on the budget.
I did find one photographer that I just emailed who notes she has a 'flexible' plan where you can pay for $250 an hour, with a 2 hour minimum, and you receive an edited CD of all photos and full copyrights. No album, no prints, just the CD. I guess I'll be fine with that, but even so, to get 4 hours is going to be $1,000. Really, is that much of a savings?
What do I do?