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Whoah!! That's intense! Talk about a slap in the face. How inappropriate of them. It's completely uncalled for for parents to be meddling in such private matters. I would be so offended! I would probably resent the new car if we were to get it, and would never want to even drive it because of what it represents.
You don't believe in divorce, therefore, it's probably also against your values to be signing something like a prenup. That's a decision to be made solely by you and FH, no one else. And it sounds like signing it is not a choice you'd ever be making on your own. Don't do it.
Are they that wealthy in which they are worried about the financial situation in the future?
Also.....Have you asked his parents WHY they want the pre-nup? Maybe if you understand their reasoning behind it you may be a little more understanding? I don't think them bribing him w/ a new car is at all appropriate though...
that was very low class of them to bribe him like that, what a slap in the face?? I am shocked that your future hubby would even consider this. That was so inappropiate of them and it is none of their business if u and your hubby get a prenup or not! I would be livid if this went down with me---To be honest for them to push this it is almost like they are telling their son that you are up for his money or that it will not last. Your future hubby needs to be on your side and do you both see eye to eye on this? usually couples discuss this b4 marriage as it can be a deal breaker for some. If he honestly does not want it then he needs to put his parents in check krespectfully.
First of all: To those that have said its not the IL's business "at all" I have to completely disagree. They may have a family business or large inheritance that they are planning on giving their son. It is their business to ensure that this is safe and in the family and if something were to happen it would be documented how it would be split up.
I agree with @MrsJKH2be: You should try to understand why they want you to sign this.
Remember a pre-nup can also be for future assets and can be just as important as documenting who gets what.
Obviously a car is nice, but it is a bribe. It shouldn't sway your decision. However, I do believe that you need to understand better what their thoughts are and why they are pushing for this so hard.
You also do need to get your own laywer!
Remember, a pre-nup could actually end up being a very good thing, if for whatever reason something did happen in the relationship.
The in-laws are out of line with the bribe. Even if they have reasons for wanting the pre-nup, that's pretty low.
Having said that, I have to say I don't think the pre-nup is a big deal. I know you're offended by what it represents, and I totally understand why. But on the other hand, if you don't believe in divorce then it's a meaningless document and signing it will shut everyone up. Plus at this point, it'll shut them up and get you a second car.
It sucks and you don't want your in-laws thinking of you that way. But in time they'll see you're in it for the long haul and they worried about nothing. And you'll be laughing in your car when they do.
I agree that the in-laws may just be trying to protect large assets that they don't want to leave the family and I think that's a fair position for them to have (although the bribe was totally not cool). As long as you have your own lawyer look over the doc and it protects your interests as well I don't think it's a big deal. As a child of what you called a messy divorce I would think that you would have an understanding that some times unexpected things happen (you can't just not believe in divorce.. I'm quite sure there are things that could happen that would make you change your position. Cheating? Abuse?) and it's good to be prepared for them. Perhaps your parents divorce would have been a lot less messy if they hada prenup in place.
What's the big deal? In today's day and age...I think a pre-nup could be good. There are alot of people that try to take things that don't belong to them just out of spite. The things you aquire as a couple, need to be split. But if one party goes into it with tons of money, property or what ever...then that should be theirs IF they split up. The other party had nothing to do with it before you were together. Also, if it is something that was handed down from generation to generation, it is best to keep it that way. I'd take the car and sign the pre-nup. If you don't plan to get a divorce...what's the big deal? I'd think it was a bigger deal if you planned to get a divorce and take everything. IMO
I don't know much about prenups, but if your parents had a messy divorce, wouldnt it have been made easier with a prenup that already detailed how things would be divided? Obviously no one goes into a marriage believing that it could fail, maybe even people who 'dont believe in divorce'. There's always some people that get surprised and end up having one, whether they believe in it or not. Thats still not to say that if you two don't want it, that you should get one anyways, but I could understand why the ILs may want one. There's always taht .00001% just in case. Hell, I'd probably take the car, get a good laywer, and then prove to them there was no need to sign that prenup... but that's just the side of me wanting the car. I thought I saw that inheritance and stuff arent considered marital property and is not part of divorce settlements anyways so what are they worried about?
The "bribe" aspect *is* kind of tasteless, I agree.
But I'm really pro pre-nup, so I don't get what's so offensive about the idea of signing one. If you're sure you're never going to need it, then sign it, stick it in a safe deposit box somewhere, and never give it another thought.
I don't think they're unromantic at all, or that it means the two of you aren't committed to your marriage--I think it's kind of sweet: you both sign something that says "I love you so much I'm willing to sign away my ability to be an a$$hole."
Can you draft the prenup to give you the car if you get divorced? That would be a slap in the face to them. And I guess I can understand their concern if they have a lot of assets that will be passed down to their son, but I still can't wrap my head around these things. I know divorce is ugly, everyone in my parents generation in our families have been divorced at least once. But it still says to me that you think it's a possibility for us and I just don't like that.
And BTW, I am the one to receive a large inheritance and my parents never once mentioned the word to me. It's a combination of them leaving those thoughts to me and having a LOT of faith in my realtionship with DH.
Bribary in any situation is foolish and inconsiderate (but you already knew that). In the case of a pre-nup it's ironic, because it technically adds to the question of distribution of assets.
I'm absolutely in favor of prenuptial agreements when and if they are necessary. For family business, trusts or estates, and caretaker agreements (i.e. potential future offspring's welfare) I think they're essential and can be written to protect the interests of everyone involved.
I'm currently on the fence, because I *should* take my own advice and have one drawn up, but like many others my emotional distaste for anything involving divorce is getting in the way.
When I'm thinking rationally and logistically, I understand that pre-up does not equal divorce. Most people get them and never, ever use them or even think about it. But remember, marriage is legally binding, and if there are good reasons for your future in-laws to ask for one, I would consider it. I do agree that you need solid legal representation and a review of the document.
I hear this a lot, that someone "doesn't believe in divorce" and it drives me crazy but I usually stay quite because whatever its none of my business. So sorry for the off topic explosion.
But seriously, divorce isn't like elves - it exists its not something that needs to be believed in.
Are you saying that if your husband was hurting your children you would stay with him? That if he cheated and refused to stop cheating and swore he loved someone else you would stay with him? Not to mention that in most states you probably can not stop him from obtaining a divorce whether or not you want to give it to him.
Yes, of course your guy would never do any of those things - but human beings are unpredictable and you can only control yourself not the person you are marrying.
On the other hand - bribery sucks. Depending on their reasons I would ignore his parents. I might draft a pre nup anyways and keep it a secret from them but I'm spiteful like that.
I think the bribery aspect...and the aspect that the wedding is only 2 months out is pretty underhanded. So what happens if you choose not to sign one? Is the wedding off? Are your FIs parents going to object? Did his parents JUST NOW decide they wanted him to have a pre-nup or did they wait this long to try and "force" you to sign since it's only 8 weeks until your wedding?
My advice...bring YOUR parents into the mix as well. It's not fair that his parents are making demands and your family has no say. Get yourself a good lawyer and refuse to be intimidated into signing something you aren't comfortable with. If there is going to be a pre-nup, it should protect BOTH of you...not just your FI.
I'm a big fan of pre-nups. Of course, I'm also a lawyer. :) To me, they just make sense. When people refuse to sign a pre-nup because they "don't believe in divorce" I think they're making a very foolish mistake. Like another poster put very humorously above, divorces are not like elves, they are real things that happen to even those who least expect them. Nothing in life is absolute (except death and taxes of course), refusing to protect yourself out of some stubborn refusal to acknowledge that fact is very immature and illogical.
If you honestly believe you will never get divorced, then why refuse to sign a pre-nup? If you're never going to get divorced it's pretty much a non-issue then, isn't it? Have a lawyer review it, sign it and forget about it. No harm, no foul.
And like someone else said above, make sure you put in the pre-nup that the bribery car goes to you as a "f you" to the in-laws. ;)
Ok, so if you agree to sign a pre-nup, do they want to have a say in what exactly the contract states???
I would draw a prenup that basically says that should you end up separating, you will divide assets according to the law (basically like not having a prenup at all), sign it and take the free car. :)
Whether or not you sign a prenup is not the biggest issue I see here, but it's more about how much control will you allow people to have in your personal life? I think that they are stepping over the line, and if they have assets that they want to protect as others have implied, well they can simply adjust their own will - not try to control how you live your married life and would divide things if anything should happen.
Thank you all for your opinions. My future in-laws have been wanting a prenup for the past year that we've been engaged, but every time it's been brought up only between my fiance and his parents. He's stood by my side and my feelings on it. All I know about the inheritance is that his brother and he are to split everything 50/50.
Honestly, if I was cheated on we'd go to counselling we'd work through it. I don't believe that divorce is an option for me. A prenup wouldn't have helped my parents..lawyers got in the way. Claiming she wasn't employable and a bunch of other crap.
Yes, I could just sign a silly sheet of paper, but it feels dirty to me. It would be great for us to become a two car family. It would make a lot of things easier, but I'd be going against my own feelings, morals, and beliefs.
I'm with Moose and Caszos, and most of the PPs that think you should be a bit more open to a prenup. His parents trying to bribe you both is lame though, of course.
Regarding the "not believing in divorce" debate: no one is questioning whether or not divorce exists like a mythical creature, for goodness' sakes. Obviously it does. But people have the right to see divorce as something that is against their beliefs, i.e., something they don't believe in. For me it's partly religious -- in the Bible, which I believe in, Christians are instructed to not end a marriage for any reason other than infidelity or if your spouse deserts you. I am personally opposed to divorce from a religious and moral standpoint. People also have the right to be morally opposed to a pre-nup.
OP, like you said, going through with this would be going against your morals and beliefs. Nothing is more important than your own personal values -- they make you who you are. I'm not saying pre-nups are evil or not okay for anyone, but if it violates your beliefs, it's not something you should do IMO.
Your religion itself contemplates divorce in the case of infidelity, so it doesn't make sense to say you don't believe in divorce from a religious standpoint.
Please don't take this the wrong way. I'm not judging you at all, your post was just a bit inconsistent.
As far as the "believing in divorce" comments, I don't think anyone was making that claim the literal sense. People arguing against that position (or maybe just me) are asserting that there are no absolutes in life. No one gets married intending for it not to work out. If that were the case, why would you get married in the first place? Point being, sometimes things just happen. To make a claim such as "I don't believe in divorce" indicates the person making that statement would not get a divorce under any circumstances, a claim I don't think anyone can honestly make. Is divorce a last resort? Sure. But to say you it's not even an option, no matter what the circumstances? That's just not being realistic.
If you don't feel the need for a pre-nup (in my case, my only assets are my two cats so it's not necessary right now) that's one thing. But if you have assets that need protection and you refuse to provide that protection based on an unrealistic belief, you are being fiscally irresponsible.
You know, even if things do happen that lead to divorce, a prenup is not always necessary. Depending on where you live, the law might be just enough. The laws are there to protect every citizen and are mostly fair, so I kinda have a problem with saying that a prenup is important if you want to be realistic.
As for Littlemissmango's comment on not believing in divorce, it is not inconsistent. The Bible teaches that divorce is to be contemplated only in cases of adultery/abuse. It also teaches that you shall not commit adultery. If both partners abide by those rules and are true with their beliefs, the divorce will not happen. I do not see it as inconsistent.
To the OP - the best thing you can do is to decide with your FI and whatever you decide, both of you need to stick to it and show a united front.
@lezlers: I suppose you could assume that saying one doesn't believe in divorce would imply that they do not believe in it under any circumstances, but I thought I made it pretty clear in my statement that I am opposed to divorce as my religion states -- meaning without those two qualifying circumstances (infidelity or being deserted by your spouse). If either of those things happened to me, I would be free to divorce, but I still am opposed to it. As I mentioned, I didn't say that it would not be an option for me, or anyone else who doesn't believe in it, under any circumstances.
I definitely agree that no one gets married intending for it to not work out, and so for people to say that they don't forsee a divorce happening as they enter into a new, happy marriage is kind of redundant. Yeah, of course you don't see yourself divorcing the man you're currently in love with. And I also agree that life doesn't always go as planned, and that bad things happen to good people, and that marriages can fail regardless of what you believe. So for those who want to err on the side of caution when serious assets are on the line, a pre-nup might be in their best interest. I just don't think that you should compromise your beliefs for it. Like egb pointed out, if you don't have one, it doesn't necessarily mean you're screwed if you end up in a divorce court.
In OP's case, she feels morally opposed to both a divorce and a pre-nup, so for her I don't think it's appropriate to bend to the will of the overbearing parents in this situation.
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My fiancé's parents are really pushing for us to sign a prenup. I always said I'd never sign one, it would just feel like a when we get divorced this is what you get. I don't really believe in divorce. My parents had a very messy divorce and I said I'd never do it.
Tonight my fiancé went to dinner with his parents after work, and they offered him a bribe if we had one...a new car. We're a one car household and could benefit from a 2nd car, but I don't want to give into what I believe just to make everyone happy.
My fiance would only being doing it to make his parents happy about it as well. We're less then two month from our wedding and I know my father wouldn't let me sign it without having a lawyer go over it with a fine tooth comb.
Edit: this probably doesn't really need a post, but we're both in shock over the bribe and I could tell he was really thinking about it, and I needed to get it off my chest.