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We aren't engaged, but SO has made it clear to me he wants to have kids with me and be committed to me. He has just made excuses as to why he hasn't proposed, but he keeps coming back to .. he just doesn't agree with the institution of marriage. And for the first time, I am kind of feeling okay with that. So, I guess we'll just be life partners that have children but never get married.
He said tonight, "we could have had a 2 year old by now". Yep... buttt I wasn't quite ready for that then. 2.5 years later, I'm feeling more ready for a child. We'll be in a decent enough financial state by the time we'd actually have a baby.
We talked about TTC in March, and hope to get pregnant by July. If it doesn't happen, we'll wait til the next March to try again. I am hoping to be a full time photographer and SAHM, and getting preggo from March-July would mean having a baby in the off season. I wanna have the winter to spend with our baby :)
Of course, if I could have it my way, we'd get married in May, 7 months from now, preggo or not. But... he didn't commit to that and I cannot get my hopes up for it.
Right now, I'll just be ok with the fact he does want a life with me, and he's 100% on board with TTC in March..
He claims his health insurance would cover the mother of his child. I asked him if he was 100% sure and he said no... soo... yeah. I didn't think most insurance policies would do that?
Would you be on board with that or not and why?
no. i would not be on board. As delicatly as I can say this...if you are ok with having a baby with him and not being married, that's very ok. Many women make thihs choice and are fab moms. It is your own perogative. And i trust youve put thought into it. I just say make sure you are independent. Meaning. you could do this own your own if you had too. then GREAT cause he is there for you too! But please all i ask is have YOUR ducks in a row before getting preggers. And i plead with you to know I totally wouldn't judge whatever you decide to do. I get passionate about this sort of thing cause this sounds like what my sons dad said to me, and I never in a million years thought that how it went down would have went down. go with your gut hun.
i also want to say I know lots of good long term relationships that work out without marriage.
Right now, I have both a full time job and a full time business and could fully support myself... so I've got that going for me :) But... I really wanted to quit my full time and do photos fuill time when we had a baby. I have no clue at this point how much I would be making, so... that's a little scary because you are right, you never truly know, no one can tell the future.
I'm so sorry about how things turned out w/ your son's dad... sounds like it wasn't good at all :/ hugs!
Mostly votes for never.. I'm just curious to know why?
Not because I don't agree with you.. because believe me I am making a sacrifice by not getting married! i'd love to.
Hubs tried to pull this one on me before we were engaged. I said "no." It just doesn't make sense to me to choose to have kids before getting married. How can he not commit to you but say that he will commit to a family? You don't have to have a big wedding.
I said I would not do this. It's mostly because of my religious background - I just can't get away from the feeling that it would be somehow wrong. Also, my parents would absolutely flip and I want my first baby to be a totally positive experience.
@JoJo Bananas: Agreed. We've gone back and forth on this.. a lot. And I wouldn't and wouldn't budge. He would have had kids last year! I am trying to be sympathetic to him, becasue he's told me he WILL get married to me, but just because I want it... wellllll... I don't wanna get married to him for that reason! I'd rather it be mutual or not do it at all. I couldn't go into it knowing he didn't really want that. :/
No offense, but your guy is being a total douche. So he loves you enough to knock you up but not enough to give you his last name. I think his attitude stinks and you obviously want to be married, or you wouldn't even be on this board. Please do not settle for a lifetime of being referred to as his Baby Mama instead of his wife. You deserve better. You deserve to be part of a LEGALLY committed couple and to have legitimate children. You deserve security, and true, everlasting commitment with a rock steady guy who would be proud to call you his wife. Unless your guy does an about face, I don't know that he is it.
@gocubbies: Well for one thing, most insurances would not cover the mother of his child. Also, when you're takling life insurance and other legal aspects, being married just makes all that so much easier. I'm curious as to what he disagrees with?
Also, my cousin thought she was in a long term, life partner relationship once. They had a daughter and he left. She moved on, found another guy, a life partner- together for about 11 years, had 3 kids together. Then they split and she's been with another guy for a year. I think relationships can work without marriage, don't take this the wrong way. But it's a lot easier to give up and stop trying and just walk away when that religious and/or legal commitment just isn't there.
@JoJo Bananas: And I agree with this.
Probably going to sound like a bitch, but he can't exactly have babies by himself... if he wants children with you, and being married is very important to you, he should take that into serious consideration. Now if you're fine not being married, then it's okay.
@gocubbies:you are a sweetie and sound like a smart independent woman:) If you can support yourself then it is a matter of preference. I can say from experience it isnt money that raises a child it is support. extended strong support systems.
Also agree with what the other Bees are saying. Even if he doesn't agree with marriage, it will make your lives SO MUCH EASIER if you are.
my answer is no but i also wouldnt live with my guy before we were married either - not for religious reasons but im a all or nothing kinda gal
i do have friends that are unmarried and parents - they are very committed but the pregnancies were also unplanned
His view on marriage.. He thinks love/committment should not have to be proven with a "meaningless" piece of paper.. we were put on this earth to procreate, not be be instutionally, legally married...we want to be together and that should be enough for us. etc.
But it's a lot easier to give up and stop trying and just walk away when that religious and/or legal commitment just isn't there. Yes. So true, and i think deep down that's part of his reason.
@Orion: I really want to TTC in March and get married in May... I have not yet decided if I'm holding strong to the marriage part or not. i don't know which is more important to me right now and it's just tough.
Religious views aside, I wouldn't have children with a guy who didn't want to get married because I want to be married. To me, it would be like this man teling me that his desires came first - that they mattered more than mine. And having a child with someone like that would just put me in a position where I had to depend on someone who was looking out for themselves. Personally, I would just end up resenting the guy and it would be unhealthy for me and my self-confidence, in addition to being a poor situation for my child. So, if I were in that position, I would end the relationship and find someone whi was both excited to marry me and have children together.
I think it would be sad if you had to settle on this issue, because obviously its really important to you. I hope whatever you decide makes you genuinely and truly happy.
@SandyThePoet: You deserve security, and true, everlasting commitment with a rock steady guy who would be proud to call you his wife. Yes, you are soooo right in saying this. sadfce.
@Ginger123: I think I am just going to cross that bridge when it comes. If March rolls around and we don't have a wedding planned for May, I am not yet sure if I will want to TTC or not... ?
I wouldn't have children with a guy who didn't want to get married because I want to be married
excellent choice of words - why should OP's wants be less important than her guys
@gocubbies: So is he religious if "we were put on this earth"? Because marriage is also huge in religion, it's a lot more than a piece of paper. And if he's not religious then I'm not sure that he can claim any specific reason for us being on this earth. That's how I see it anyway. Besides, the legal side of it can be romantic- you can take his name easier (if you choose), be together on insurance, combining funds and houses is just simpler, leaving things to each other if you die, etc. Intimate and special in a different kind of way.
@Ginger123: And I agree with this- he wants kids soon, you want to be married soon. Why should one of your desires be put first? You should both be happy with your decisions.
I think you should do what your heart tells you. You know your guy, your relationship and YOURSELF more than anyone else. If marriage before a child is important to you, wait. If you don't care about having the piece of paper, don't.
Bottom line, people have children either way and sometimes marriages work and sometimes they don't. Considering that at least 50% of marriages end in divorce presently (I think that number may have gone up recently, but I am unsure) I would definitely NOT say that having a child in wedlock is that all that more secure than not.
You still have a few months to go. If you want to see how it goes, continue to talk to him about your feelings and maybe by that time, he'll have changed his mind. That, or you'll either be okay with it or decide it's time to move on. You'll be okay, either way! Good luck!
I would never give my guy a baby before marriage. For lots of reasons. Like my beliefs, plus the fact both his and my fsmily would gossip about it for YEARS, and a baby is a LIFETIME commitment. Hes willing to get me preggos but hes not willing to marry me? Heck no.
And I would never want to be known as the baby momma. Your guy is sounding selfish.It sounds like he wants a baby momma and not a wife. Please be careful what you decide. Ive heard so many stories of couples getting pregnant when they werent married and when the girl got pregnant the guy ran away fast.
Hope for the best for you.
@Ginger123: +1
I wouldn't do this. Like others have said, it just seems like it's a total disregard for what you want out of the relationship. I'm not saying that what he wants isn't important, though. if it were me, it would just be a sign to move on-- I want someone who wants the same things in life as I do... for the big things anyway. I know that two people will not agree on EVERYTHING that comes along, but you've got to have standards. If marriage isn't that important to YOU, then that's fine, but don't give up something important. You'll end up being resentful and/or having regrets.
@gocubbies: His reasons sound like he's afraid of commitment, and Ginger123 put it very well, I would not want to have children with someone who put his needs above mine. If he feels that it's just a scrap of paper, then it shouldn't be a huge deal for him to do that for you, since it means a lot to you. I don't think you should back down on this. If he continues to flat out refuse, he's pretty much saying you don't matter enough for him to make sacrifices...
I sit on the fence on this issue normally - in places like Australia, de facto couples are recognised as being in a legal committed relationship and are accorded the same rights as married couples. If that were the case in the US, I wouldn't really see a huge issue with a couple choosing not to get married. This doesn't really apply to your situation as it's an individual who doesn't want to get married, not the couple.
The issue I have with your particular situation is that your SO KNOWS marriage is very important to you and his reasoning for not wanting to get married sounds rather immature IMO. Going back pretty much to the start of time, people have found partners and stayed with them, sometimes to a greater extent than others. If his rationale of "we're put on this earth to procreate" was accurate, we'd all be out there having babies with every Tom, Dick, and Harry we came across. It really sounds as though he wants to have the benefits of being a father without the legal obligation to work through any hardships that could come about during the course of the relationship.
Hmm, this just doesn't sound right to me. Do you mind me asking how old your SO is?
@Ree723:As far as I know, thats not legal here. You have to marry to get the benefits(rights) of everything a legal marriage brings.
I wouldn't. A marriage licencse/certificate isn't just some piece of paper that legitimizes your relationship, it's a legal document that protects both of you and any children you have. There are thousands of laws that give different rights to married and unmarried couples!
Having and raising a child together is a MUCH bigger committment than getting married. It seems odd that he wants to jump straight in the ocean without first trying out a pool.
Besides, if he really wants to spend his life with you and be a family (with or without kids), he should take your desires into consideration too.
He's using biology as his reason? That's the kind of douche move that would let a guy justify cheating to himself. Maybe you should point out to him that biologically, it's in your interest to have sex with as many guys as possible because it gives you a better chance for healthy children.
Bah. This kind of reasoning bothers me. It perverts science and degrades the wonderful advances that humanity has made to rise above our baser animal urges.
Well, for my own religious/moral beliefs, no, I would never have a baby before I was married. And I guess I just don't get why not get married if you plan on being together forever. I also don't see why he is willing to make the committment of a child but not of a marriage. This may sound crass but a marriage is MUCH easier to get rid of if something doesn't work out than a child. Not that I think one should committ to either without serious consideration and thought.
No because it's hard to TTC when you're waiting til youre married to sleep together. :p
Sorry, but unless it was an unplanned pregnancy, I would never do that, and even if I did have an unplanned pregnancy, we would get married at least in a civilian ceremony until we had the baby. I refuse to have a different last name than my children, and I believe that being married entitles you to certain tax cuts and benefits. You usually canNOT take his insurance unless you're married, and if you're going to be a SAHM you might need the financial security that marriage provides.
I've heard of a commitment/partnership kind of certificate you can legally sign... I'm not sure if this would apply to you...
Even if he doesn't believe in marriage, it's obviously important to you. Plus, a lot of excuses can be made for this. All of his rationalizations sound like just rationalizations - nothing more. He seems afraid of commitment. Have you guys tried couples' counseling?
Whenever I'm about to take a major decision like this, I ask myself two questions:
1. What would my mother/grandmother advise me?
2. What would I advise my own daughter if she were in my shoes?
That might give you some perspective. Especially the 2nd question is oh so important to me. And remember to listen to your heart.
@Ginger123: I agree 100% with what you said.
OP, you deserve to have what you want in life.
Yea I dont see how he wants to make one commitment without the other. If he thinks he can be committed enough to the relationship then he should get married. I think deep down you sound like you agree and you really do want a wedding. If its something you really want (and for more reasons than having a party) then he needs to be on board with you on that before you try to have kids.
I believe that a child is an ever bigger, life changing event than marriage. You can't legally end parenthood (well except for some extreme cases) like you can a marriage when things get rough. I also believe that marriage is the foundation on which a family should be built. So, for me marriage has to come first, if a man is ready to commit to having children with you, he should be ready to commit to you through marriage
Look, you both have needs/wants here.
You would like the marriage. He would like the children.
Surely a compromise of sorts is fair?
Hubby & I were TTC before our wedding, but that was for fertility reasons - and we haven't had any luck with that, so essentially my opinion sort of doesn't have any basis on that. But still, it's got to be a decision that feels right to you.
@Ginger123: Agreed.
No, I wouldn't do it. For the reasons she stated and more. Just research the legal benefits of marriage.
Personally, I would absolutely want to get married before having kids. I want the commitment of marriage and the legal rights immediately given to my husband to our children because I think it is important for him to have these rights.
That said, tons of people in Switzerland never get married and have kids. It is totally a personal choice. As long as you want to stick together and provide a good home to the kids, I don't see why it's bad to not get married if you don't like marriage. Lots of people don't get married here because it increases your tax burden. Some people only get married after years of dating because they are pregnant and want to give the father's rights to the kids.
BUT if you are still on the fence about getting married to someone and you decide to have kids knowing that the institution of marriage might be a deal breaker later on, I think it can turn out really badly sometimes. I had a German friend that really wanted her boyfriend to propose to her after like 10 years of dating and they had a five year old. He never wanted to propose or get married so she started cheating on him and left him… now she won't let him see their daughter and he has really very few rights to his child in this country. It is incredibly sad. But that can happen when people marry too.
Whatever works for you!
I agree with the PPs, I would not do this for many of the reasons others have already eloquently stated. Curious how old you are? The only reason I could see making an exception personally was if I was in my late 30s and my long term bf had no signs of committing and I wanted a baby, I might have one with him, but knowing full well there is no guarantee he would stay and would need to be fully prepared mentally and financially to do things on my own.
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