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If abuse or infidelity is not involved, I don't believe in throwing in the towel, period, unless it's very clear that things will never get better.
Divorce is not much of an option for me... I would have to get an annulment from the Catholic Church. Which is not easy to get. Basically a decree that the marriage never "took." Granted there are certain circumstances (abuse etc) where it is really better to get a civil divorce and get the heck out of there. The Bible doesn't say you have to LIVE with the person.
Of course a lot of people do not have a religious issue. In which case, I think it really has to be one of the big A's (Abuse, Addiction, Adultery) to give up on a marriage before the 12 month mark. I think in most circumstances you should try at least a year's worth of counseling before throwing in the towel. Overall I think divorces are too easy to get, although there would be a lot of suffering if they were too HARD to get...
I happen to know a couple who is seperating after 2 short years of marriage where neither abuse or infidelity took place and they are still great friends.. yes, to each their own but I just can't understand it.
About a year ago I was around when someone asked her what made her know her husband was "the one" and her reply was "when he asked to marry me i couldn't see breaking up with him anytime soon so I said yes"... so i mean that doesnt sound too enthusiastic.
Marriage is no game, people!
@snake: ugh I hate that... marriage as "you stuck around long enough so I guess we should get married, since that's the next thing to do." ugh ugh ugh!!! I wonder how many divorces spring directly from relationships like that!
Well, I was married previously for 10 months, but he was physically and mentally abusive. I should have left a lot sooner than I did, but I was determined to "make it work."
This time around, as long as it's not abuse, I will stick it out through anything. I think I would even stick it out through adultery.
Just as an FYI-- the Catholic Church, does grant annulments for a variety of reasons, and certainly for "the big A's (Abuse, Addiction, Adultery)", because those reasons are generally considered proof that there was a "defect in the consent exchanged between the partners".
No one should feel trapped in an abusive relationship because of religion.
There are actually laws in some countries that require you to stay married for a certain length of time before you can be granted a divorce. I think Australia is one of them (one of my friends was subject to this a long time ago), but I'm not certain. I happen to agree with @StatuatoryGrape on this as well, but I am definately more of a traditionalist. Did anyone catch on the last crazy Bridezilla episode one girl saying she needed everything perfect because it was her first wedding? Yes, she actually said first. My FI was like "WTH did she just say? Yikes!".
@Magdalena: Some sociologists have dubbed this "sliding," and it can help to explain some of the high divorce statistics. Couples are "sliding" into long term commitment, rather than seriously reflecting and deciding that it is right for them. The momentum of the relationship and (American, at least) culture expect long term relationships to culminate in marriage, so it makes sense for these couples.
Excluding "the big A's", what happens in a relationship that so drastically changes your view of another person in such a short amount of time (ie, loving someone so much that you marry them to divorcing so soon)? Is it that people just don't take marriage seriously enough?
For me, I'm with @statutory grape.
I have a friend who was separated and getting a divorce in about two months. He married a girl in a Latin rite mass at a Catholic church the Saturday following Thanksgiving. They were separated and getting a divorce by Valentine's day. She left him. I think she wanted to be a bride, but didn't want to be married. The wedding ceremony had a very negative tone to it, and looking back on the event, I think that the priest knew that it wasn't a good situation, and was hoping that someone would run at the altar. My friend was an honorable guy, I'm not sure if it was the fact that he had made the proposal or possibly that he had been in a physical relationship with her, and felt that he was honor bound to the committment, but I know that he seemed terribly nervous during the ceremony. I thought that was awfully fast to get a divorce, but understood that he wasn't the one who left. I think in some ways my friend was fortunate that she didn't waste more of his time. I think that the interesting part of this is that when I look at the photos of this wedding... he is never smiling when she is in the photo... He looks stressed and/ or nervous whenever she is in the frame of the photo. There are only two photos that his natural smile shines through... one with me and his best man, and another when he is with his parents. (We've been lifelong friends who are more like brother and sister than anything else.) At his second wedding, I knew things were very good when I saw his smile shine brightly as he talked about his beautiful bride, and especially when they smiled for a photo! The second wedding was also in a Catholic church, and it was lovely.
I think everyone has their own story that we might not understand b/c we haven't been there. For me, it would take a lot to divorce. But that doesn't mean they haven't gone through a lot in a short time.
I agree with Grape's statement.
I also agree with art bee's statement! I do think that no one can fully understand another person's circumstances and story unless they are living it themselves.
That said, I have a college friend who got married right out college. She pushed and pushed to have her college BF propose and get married right after college. She kicked him out after 2 years of marriage. I do not agree with her decision. There was no abuse, she simply did not like the person that he was (and he was always that person...very quiet and introverted).
I have since learned that she did not want to try marriage counseling and at my wedding she was telling everyone how she hopes her current boyfriend proposes soon. She has been officially divorced 3 weeks and kicked her husband out just last October. Sorry to ramble, but I do think that she didn't try hard enough to make her marriage work.
Sorry for the rant! :)
I know a divorced couple that did everything the "right" way, statistically speaking; they dated for a few years, got good jobs, got engaged, bought a house, and married in their mid-twenties. The girl then spent all her time working overseas (voluntarily, mind you), and the guy didn't want to leave his job, family, and country to follow her around. She refused to come home or get counseling, found someone else, and sent him separation papers within a year.
That story changed my views on divorce a bit. I'm more sympathetic to how hard it can be, and how complicated. It's still not an option for me, though, much less that quickly. It just highlights how important it is to know well and understand the person you're with. You can learn to deal with pretty much anyone, but that doesn't make them the right person to marry.
I'm not a fan of divorce, but it happens. I don't think outside parties can judge because the only people that really knows what's going on are the involved couple.
After my first marriage, things started going bad after about 6 months, but it took me 2 more years for me to seperate from him, and another year until we decided to get divorced.
Looking back, it was a bunch of wasted time and stress. (He was a cheating asshole. By the time I moved out, there had been times when I'd been so depressed that I lived on saltine crackers & water for 1-2 months at a time. It was bad not only on my emotional/mental health, but also my physical health. And I had no idea what STDs he might bring home to me too!)
I have been married before so obviously I believe in divorcing, but for the right reasons. My ex was verbally and mentally abusive, not to mention his drug and alcohol addictions. I was young, he was my high school sweetheart and I thought that if I would just love him enough or care enough he would stop. It never did, and I wasted alot of my youth on him.
With my new soon to be, It would take a hell of a lot to get me to divorce him. That is unless he picked up a drug and alcohol addiction, started abusing me and sleeping around.... thank God I dont see that happening in my future EVER. He is a totally different kinda man and our relationship has been amazing thus far.
I believe that when you marry someone it has to be a serious reason for divorce, not just because it just isn't working out.
Any time before death do us part is too soon, unless there is abuse involved or habitual infidelity.
My ex was emotionally abusive and cheated on me. But it wasn't until he raised his hand to me in front of our son (7 years into our marriage) that my heart broke and I put a stop to it. No one should have to stay in that kind of situation. I don't necessarily understand divorcing for other reasons.
One of my college roommates was in a long tem relationship w/ her BF throughout college. Upon graduation, they got engaged shortly after. Within one year of graduation, they were married in a hasty marriage. 5 months later she left him and they were divored - he had turned abusive as soon as the wedding dress came off. I just don't understand why some people change SOOOOO drastically after marriage? Other friends of ours were married after dating 7 years, a year after their small marriage ceremony they had a more elaborate ceremony/recpetion. 7 m,onths later they were going through a nasty divorce!
Could it be because people are marrying too young? That they don't know any better? I was in a 6 year relationship throughout college and after college - we talked about getting married but our relationship was horrible at times. Had he proposed, we would be married (unhappily) right now. I am so glad that I had the courage to break out of the relationship when my gut told me to.
Two friends of mine split up within a year of marriage (after 9 years of dating)--no abuse, no infidelity, just a realization that life is too short to spend it with someone you've fallen out of love with. Maybe in that sense it wasn't "too soon;" the realization was too late.
I've learned there's no way I can judge any other relationship. Although it's easy for me to say I can't imagine throwing in the towel unless there was abuse involved, I really don't know what it's like to be in the kind of relationship that I needed to get out of. Ultimately, I think if a couple realizes they are not happy with one another, and realizes they never can be happy together, that it's best for them to move on. Life is too short to be miserable.
imo, fi an i have been together for almost 4 years... if a few months after we get married we feel as though we need to get a divorce there is something deeper going on there. i do not believe in divorce unless... all avenues have been explored (i.e. counseling, talking it out, listening to one another etc.) or as statutory grape said... there is abuse of some sort. my parents divorced after 16 years of marriage, but my mom told me she had been unhappy for the last 8 years (so i do think it is possible to fall out of love or follow different paths). its hard because i believe in quality of life over quantity, and that goes for my marriage too! so im pretty sure if i was that unhappy i would leave (after the counseling and talking and whatnot of course)
I'm with Statutory Grape on that one. Divorce can be a good thing. My Mom divorced her abusive ex-husband and inevitably became a stronger person. Then she met my Dad, so I'm certainly grateful that divorce is available.
As a side note, I thought I'd share a little story on how it can be relatively pleasant. A co-worker of mine has been married once before, and she and her ex had been together since high school. They'd always been close. After they'd been married for a few years, he looked at her and said "you still want to be married?" "No. You?" "Not particularly." So they divorced, but consider each other to be best friends. She's actually the godmother to his son. A rare and unusual story, but an interesting one.
June (09) i went to a wedding where it was apparent that the parents had footed the bill. My mother is best friends with the bride's mother, so i got told later that the wedding cost $70 000.
I just heard the couple is getting a divorce. Just a year later! This is hard to swallow, IMO. And am i wrong to say ... 'her poor parents!'
I don't know what happened in that situation but dayyyaammmm, it's cause for gossip.
I am NOT into tradition for tradition sake but i firmly believe in commitment.
@AEMalmostK: it can also take a very long time to be granted an annulment... and in most cases there had to be a problem -before- the marriage took place (ie there had to be abuse that scared you into marriage, or one of you was drunk at the wedding, etc etc.) many times you cannot get an annulment just because your husband says mean things and is mentally abusive. i know my aunts annulment took over 2 and a half years... and she got pulled through the ringer (even though her ex was physically abusive). its alot more difficult to get one than some think.
I know a couple, much older than myself, that once their kids were grown and out of the house asked each other if they wanted to keep going or end it. They ended up staying together, but he said it was like getting to know each other all over again and deciding if you still loved who the other person had become.
I've never considered divorce an option. Maybe if something was seriously wrong. My older sister is trying to finalize her divorce. They have been married almost 4 years. She said she just fell out of love, felt like his mom, and didn't want to do anything with him anymore.
I have been married before, so I definitely believe in divorce (annulment, in my case). I was in an emotionally/mentally abusive relationship that was starting to get physical, and it ended EXTREMELY quickly after we got married -- partly for his citizenship -- and things took a turn for the worse. And by quickly I mean just over two months! So I'm not one to judge! However, I would say that there are certainly other reasons besides adultery, addiction, and abuse. Everyone has their own situation, and I don't think anyone should stay in a marriage that they've put time and effort into, and nothing helps.
Too soon for me is under 5 yrs. I've never been married or divorced, so I am just speaking from the outside. Under 5 yrs, not including abuse etc,DUH, that's a problem that SHOULD have been fixed before you got married. Otherwise, you saw the problem and decided to do it anyway.
It's unfortunate but a lot of us who are divorced don't believe in it either. It's just something that happened to us and there wasn't much to be done about it.
Having said that, I will tell you I was the one to leave. I would also suggest that in addition to the big As (which are all reasons I'd go) I had to learn that there was one more. Felony. Turns out, stealing massive amounts of money from one's job will also make me leave you. And I firmly believe that it was the right thing to do.
Still, that doesn't mean I took the committment of marriage lightly. Actually, after my divorce I was ashamed and mortified that it had happened. I was embarrassed to tell people and I spent a good long time beating myself up over it simply because I swore that I would never get divorced. I guess my point is to have a bit of compassion. Not everyone who is divorced is so very proud of the fact.
As for celebrity marriages and divorces? I believe that is a whole different ball of wax. They rush in and rush out like it's no big deal. And I think there are very few celebrities who have taken the committment of a marriage seriously.
@MsMamaBear: That's a wee bit of an unfair judgement. Sometimes an absuive spouse was not in fact abusive until they were a spouse.
This ties into what I was saying before. It's easy to speak in absolutes without understanding what can happen. I don't think any of us can set a time limit on how long a marriage should last at a minimum. I've learned that we can never really understand what is going on between a couple. So even when people make choices we might not agree with, we are in no position to judge or declare it right or wrong. Maybe it's because I have no moral high ground to stand on, but I've learned to be accepting and supportive of those around me. And to let it be at that.
Each situation is unique.
I agree that divorce should be somewhat of a "final straw" and not used as a "breakup" if things just "aren't working" - I believe all avenues should be explored and a marriage shouldn't just be "shrugged off" - except if it is on the grounds of the hot subjects above.
That being said, divorces exist for a variety of reasons, and I also believe that divorces can be absolutely for the best.
If there are children involved, as nice and ideal as it may be to "stay together for the kids", let's be honest - that's not necessarily promoting the best example. Staying together in misery for the sake of your children carries massive side-effects and children are a lot more perceptive than people tend to realize. In other words, if you "stay together for the kids" and there is massive tension between you, wjhat type of loving, happy relationship is that painting a picture of?
On the side note of celebrity marriages (way back in the OP) and how so few actually last in comparison to how many take place - I actually believe that celebrities become so caught up in their careers, characters, etc. that they tend to forget who they "really are" and they almost consider marriage to be just another role they are playing - bride, groom, husband, wife; and it tends to decrease their attention span. Just my opinion. Again - every situation is unique.
I would say that anything less than a year (excluding the extremes of abuse and repeated cheating) is not giving your marriage a chance. While personally I hope I do not get a divorce, I agree with the sentiment that there's a reason why you can end your marriage contact, and that you should end your marriage if it would make you happier. I obviously don't think people should just jump into marriage with anyone, but I do think that if both parties would be happier, long-term, if they separated- then why not go for it?
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After reading about Elisabeth Moss' (Mad Men) & Fred Armisen's (SNL) seperation after 7 short months (and some reports say it was only 4 or so months) of marriage it got me thinking...
How soon is too soon for a divorce?
Not that its anyones place to put judgement on anyone's choices.. but personally what do you think?
Are anullments completely fine?
How about these quick celebrity nuptuials and seperation?
How long would you work at a less than perfect relationship (not talking abuse or infidelity) before throwing in the towel?
Is Divorce even an option in your opinion?