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Lst. night we saw the movie Dear John. For me it triggered alot of feelings about the proposal or lack there of. In the movie for those who haven't seen it, the soldier is home for 2wks. falls in love goes back to Germany and promises to come back in 1 yr. After that year, 911 happens and he opts to reenlist thus making her wait ANOTHER 2yrs. on top of the 1yr. she's already waited. Needless to say she moves on with her life.
My point being perhaps if he proposed and made a "real"commitement she would of waited. So my SO and I got in a huge arguement which he basically said he's not giving up his 5yr. engagement idea (which I feel is ridiculous,either you want to or ya don't)even though it means he might lose me. I'm trying to comprimise and say lets set a 2.5yr date from time of engagement but he won't budge. He says it's financial and he's JUST NOT ready. I put an ad in the paper today for an apartment/roomate. I've had it. I cried myself to sleep last night and I'm devasted! Any advice bees???????
You might need some time apart to figure things out. I totally understand your frustration. You need to clear your head and figure out if you can become okay with the 5 year plan, if that means staying with BF. If you can't accept those terms, either you need to move on or he needs to compromise. But it's hard to figure all that out when you live together and see each other all the time.
Oh, I'm SO sorry that you're going through this. If you're done, you're done, and you need to do what's right for you. How long have y'all been together? Also, just for clarification--have you said to him something along the lines of: I'm really not willing to wait that long, so if we can't find some middle ground, I need to move on with my life? (I'm sorry if you've already given this info in previous posts, I just thought it might be easier to ask.) Lots of ((HUGS))
I am so so sorry you are going through this pain but ultimately you need to do what's best for you! What happens if 5 yrs down the road he's STILL not ready? I think that if you've explained to him how much it means to you to have a more solid commitment and he still does not want to compromise, I would move out and take some time to think. Clear your head and get out of the situation for a bit. He may change his mind or he may not. Either way you've made the decision that's best for YOU regardless of how hard and how much it hurts. You are so strong, so continue to be strong. You deserve someone who is so totally in love with you that they can't wait to marry you. Good luck!!
I'm so sorry, Sunshine... I remember your previous posts and I was hoping he had changed his mind. I think it's good for you that you're doing something proactive to make you feel better and I wish you all the best. ((((hugs))))
i really admire your strength. It takes a confident person to be able to step outside the relationship, look at it objectively, and think, "is this acceptable?". Good for you!
I think you are doing the right thing. HE goes from buying a ring to wanting 5 years? I think getting out on your own is the best thing you can do for you and your relationship right now. If he wants you back as his roommate, it should be as his wife.
I am sorry he's so unwilling to compromise! If I were you, i would make all the moves to move out (check out the craigslist in your area if you haven't already. I've found my last 3 super awesome places on there!). Explain to him that while you love him, you need commitment, forward momentum, and to know he wants to be with you as much as you want to be with him. If he is unwilling to move from his 5 year plan and compromise to keep you...well...that tells you everything you need to know about his stance on your relationship. In the meantime, start packing, spend mroe time away from your shared apartment, and have him sleep on the couch.
Good luck! *hugs*
That sucks! I'm sorry your going throught this! I second what msmdphd said, if you have already told him "if we can't compromise then I can't stay" and he said "I'm not compromising" then I think thats a good indicator that you both need time apart/move on. It's of course easier to say than do... But... There are other fish in the sea, one that has the same time frame as you maybe?
You are making the right decision. I wish you luck!!!! If he cant compromise and he knows hes running the risk of losing you... thats a big flag for me.
Ok, I remember now--sorry I'm a little slow. I take back my questions and just reassert--if he knows that without compromise you're gonna go, and he still won't compromise, it's time to go. You've got to take care of yourself, and you're strong, and you will be fine! ((HUGS))
I think it's definitely a good idea to take some time by yourself - you're very strong to do this!
you cannot make plans like that 5 years down the line - a lot of circumstances may change btwn then and now to influence someone's choices. I can see having a goal, like "let me finish my last year of grad school before we get married" but not "let's have another discussion at a random time 5 years in the future". Not a fair thing to say. Maybe a little time apart will make things more clear, either way. Good luck to you!
I think getting your own place is a great idea. Nothing like a little space to clear your head to make the best decision you can. I am not saying what I think the decision should be---only you know that---just that it will be easier to make it without all this tension hanging over your head. Good luck and I am proud of you for being so strong in doing this. Just take it one step at a time.
I'm sorry :(
How old are you two? Are you both done with school?
I agree with you that there is no reason (other than being very young and still in school) that there should ever be a 5 year engagement.
Are you two engaged yet and he wants to make the wedding date 5 years from now or is he saying if and when he ever does propose, he wouldn't want to get married for 5 years?
I don't know anything about your situation other than what you said, but in all honesty, it sounds like he doesn't want to make the commitment. Five years is so far down the road that it seems like he is stringing you along... and if you living together, why buy the cow when you already get the milk for free.
Sometimes the best answer is take a step back and reevaluate things. I was once in a relationship where we had been dating for 5 years and he had the ring for 7-9 months and didn't give it to me. I finally realized that he was NEVER going to give it to me. It was incredibly hard but I moved on with my life and soon after I found S and I am so glad I did not marry my previous boyfriend because he could never make me as happy as I am now. You need to figure out what you really want and make the right decision for you. Good luck!
@rchel - Not helpful.
I'm sreally sorry this is happening, sunshine, and agree with the previous posters that you're doing the right thing in making space for yourself. It sounds as though he's really confused, but it's not fair to you to keep changing his mind when so much is at stake.
Check out craigslist, find yourself a nice place with some big sunny windows and know that, whatever you decide, you're a very strong person!
I did the 5 year relationship thing. We got together towards the end of college, stayed together as we figured out our lives, then still nothing. We weren't the same people after 5 years (more like friends that fight, not lovers) and we broke up. Both of us are engaged now (4 years later) and I'm really happy we didn't stay at that stage any longer.
I'd say follow your gut on this one.
Honestly, there is never going to be a perfect time to get engagged or even married for that matter. 5 years can pass and there will probably be something else that comes up. I agree with some of the other ladies on here...figure out what you want for you. Trust me in the long run you will be glad you did. Do not rely on someone else to make you happy. You decided what makes you happy. Sidenote: Absence does make the hard grow fonder...it is then you will know how he truly feels about you. I wish you all the best.
I had a friend who got engaged, and they never set a date. The guy had no intentions on marrying her....needless to say, they broke up, finally after 4 years of barely even acting like a couple. Guys just try to buy some time I guess and if you are the girl he is going to marry, he is NOT going to let you get away. You are right to go with your gut....move on to a man who wants to marry you! Good luck...
I think the worst thing about this whole thing is that he's not open to compromise, which says a LOT about someone. Like, if he wants five years, and you're ready now, why not just set a date two years in advance if it's purely for financial reasons? I just don't get it. It's got to be something else with him.
I think you're brave to admit that it could be over. I hate saying it, but I think it's the right choice. I mean, if he's unwilling to compromise on this, what will things be like down the line?
I completely agree with Miss Chapstick. Sometimes things can get really tough and thats understandable but at the end of the day, a relationship is a two way deal. If hes not ready its okay, but to say lets talk about it in 5 years is not.
My boyfriend and i were going through something similar a few months back and i had to be brave, put my foot down and say, listen i will not be the girl to pressure you and i will not be that girl who is going to wait for the next 10 years. im not saying it has to be now, but we have to be on the same page, if not, then i think its time to move on.
it wasnt until i was ready to walk out that he said, give me a couple of months i promise.
This week we just finished picking out my ring for real this time and he has changed completely with me.
I commend you for making a bold choice!
Life is about compromise, on yours and his side. Sounds like you tried. No matter what though you can NEVER compromise your core feelings or beliefs. The 5 year thing sounds like BS (just my gut feeling).
Don't compromise yourself for his benefit!
Just wanted to say that I'm sorry that you are going through this. I can't imagine anything worse than loving someone, them telling you that they want to spend their life with you and then say...but you are going to have to wait half a decade for that to happen.
I don't have any words of wisdom, but I wanted to say that you should do whatever is right for you. He can take care of himself...make your decision based on what you need...and that's okay if you want to wait for him and it's okay if you decide that you can't.
Take care of you.
Oh wow. Yeah, I can see how upset you'd be. Honestly, if he isn't even considering to think about less than five years then he is not doing his part in a relationship to compromise. Also, why get engaged and wait that long? That's ridiculous. We are waiting 13 months from engagement to wedding date just because of the time of the year we wanted to get married and by month five we wanted to throw it all out the window and just get married. Honestly, I think the other women are right and you need to move on and tell him exactly why. I don't think he'll change if he won't even go halfway with 2.5 years. Plus, you don't want to be one of those women, after five years of being engaged you still haven't made official plans...or 10 years later, or more! I've seen that happen and really it's just the guy doesn't want to commit but wants her to stay around but won't make the effort.
I'm really sorry, but I think it's very good of you to realize that maybe this isn't the best and you need to move on with your life. Please let us know what you choose to do. ::hugs::
I’m so so sorry you’re going though this! I thought I’d share my story..
My SO proposed tome in the August 2007 right after we graduated from school. It was very informal and came out of a conversation while I was helping him move out of the city and he was asking me to come with him. I said yes! So then I planned to follow him to New York and live with him. However my parents (very old fashion and Catholic) didn’t allow the living together situation until we were married. We were just starting out so we needed a guarantor to get an apartment- which my parents and family friends refused to sign for us so we lost a couple hundreds for the broker fee and –what I thought was- our dream apartment.
I moved to New York and got a job later on but we lived separately and with long working hours, barely saw each other. I was so upset with my parents at first but looking back that separation (or not living together) was necessary.
When I first told my SO that we can't live together until we're married , I was hoping he’d say “Ok let’s do it then!” instead he said “Oh.. in that case we’ll have to live separately". A bit shocked here...And for the next half a year my SO was constantly back and forth about getting married, while for me after I said "yes" I never changed my mind. Every time he’d have doubts, I would be hurt and devastated and then we’d keep our space until he was sure again. That distance helped him make up his mind in 6 months and came back with a firm answer that he wanted to marry me. But now his concern was money and wanted the wedding to wait another 4 years from that date (that would have meant 2012-2013ish!).
My parents met in the middle with him and we had a civil marriage in the beginning of 2008 first so they’d feel a bit better about us moving in. And my parents and his parents talked him into letting them help us financially. But my SO still wanted to buy the ring on his own.
So I got my ring in September 2009 (that’s almost 2 years after the proposal) and had a little event for that with just the 2 families. We thought we’d be walking down the aisle around 2010 but SO is applying for school this year and stressed with that so we’re looking at summer 2011 before school starts (that’s almost 4 years from the day he proposed!).
In my SO’s case there was a period of “not being ready” emotionally then another period of “not being ready” financially. But when we sat down and talked about his worried about money we met in the middle.
I didn’t read you’re other posts but just a thought that maybe there is something that is making your SO want to wait for 5 years but he’s not explaining it well? Also I think that living separately for a while until you both are on the same page helps. Best of luck!
I think you need to evaluate your relationship. How long have you been together? Is there discussion on marriage? Is he open to it? I would have liked to get engaged two years before we did, but he simply wasn't ready. It took me a while to realize that it wasn't anything with me or that he had a commitment issue, and that he did want to marry me, he just wasn't ready. And then, all of the sudden he was. Looking back I am glad that we waited until we were both fully ready rather than me pushing him into something. It feels great to know that he is really in it 200%. And now he says, why didn't we get engaged sooner?
I agree with the other bees - take some time and then have a serious conversation about it. But remember compromise means you might have to sacrifice a little bit too, which is frustrating. But maybe in the end it will be the better thing.
My DH never specifically set a time frame but did mention on several occasions that it would be a long, long time (like 10 yrs.) before we would get married. We lived together etc and everyone would ask when it would happend there were arguments with family etc. We discussed it plenty of times and I knew for a fact that he wanted to marry me. My view was that because I loved him and knew he loved me that I would wait as long as it took because I wanted him to ask because he wanted to rather than because I pushed or our families pushed. We were happy so why mess it up. It took 5 years after moving in together for him to ask but he did and we're happily hitched. You definiely have to do what's right for you but I ust wanted to give food for thought. I dont know details about your situation but follow your heart. That's all. Good luck.
Good luck with however it turns out. I think you are really strong for considering to move out on your own and hold your ground. He should appreciate you and be more open minded in terms of his timeframe for the future. Just remember, everything happens for a reason, so no matter what decision you make, it will turn out for the best.
just to be fair, you're both giving each other ultimatums.. "propose or we're breaking up!" "wait five years or we're breaking up!" what ever happened to compromise, or waiting until the right time, or just enjoying being together?
@staceyreeves: reread her post.. she did write that she asked him to compromise (2.5 years instead of 5)
oh lord what do i say.to ask you to wait 5 yrs after already having your ring for 2.5 yrs is a bit rediculous and cruel.i think u mentioned that he was once married and got burned.he also says it finacial,maybe it partly is.i believe that he may want such a long egagement because during that five yrs period if u guys dont work out he wont have to go through the divource process again.i believeit is truly unfair.u also mentioned that he was a good man (which is so hard to find)so here lies ur dilema.living togther for the next five yrs wouldnt that be considered a commonlaw marriage?wouldnt u also be entitled if things went wrong to spousal support.u may not be thinking along those lines but u have to way the pros and cons of this relationship.if living togther after all that time and u have invested emotinonaly and finacially and u may still end up with nothing maybe you should think of having your own place so you wont totally feel like u need to get married.u also have to think of the example u are setting for your daugther.in the end u have to decide if staying togther in the same home will be more harmful to the relationship or not.i hope he comes around and if he doesnt i hope u make the right decision.maybe separate aboads might help but only u can kn how this would affect him men are different and it may do more harm than good to the relationship.good luck
Thankyou everyone for all your encouragement and words of wisdom. I truly hope this man comes to his senses and realizes what he has with me before it's too late. I deserve more than what he's offering not to mention I have a daughter to consider(who just got situated in a new school) and I run a business out of the house. I feel very cornered. Where am I supposed to go? My entire life is here as well as my income(I am a hairstylist and all my clients come here). It will be very difficult to do hair out of an apartment. Not to mention when we first bought the rings and I moved in this 5yr. plan was never spoken about until now. I moved in with the INTENTION OF A COMMITMENT. If I leave it will really be HIS choice not mine. Once I walk out that door it's already too late for him. Right now,it's just getting my "ducks in a row" time and biting my tongue. I hope he makes the right choice bees. If he lets me go I guess it wasn't meant to be. I have discussed in GREAT detail everything I feel with him,he knows exactly where I stand and what I want. I guess he wants a 5yr. cow with no strings, which is funny cuz I AIN'T NOBODY'S COW!! If you say you love me,and adore me,and want to grow old with me(which he says all the time by the way)put your money (in this case the ring!!)where your mouth is!!
I think you nailed it when you said you either want to or you dont. He should know whether he wants to marry you. I am so happy that you are staying strong. You deserve the best and if that means moving on then thats what you have to do, even if its just to clear your head!!!
Good luck Keep us posted!
I commend you on your strength sunshine...as most bees have said you are def doing the right thing for you...I really dont think he realizes that he is going to loose you and when he finally does realize it, it may be too late. Way to hold your ground on this one. Good luck with everything...and you always have the bees to talk to!
I think all i have to add is that I am sorry you are having to go through this. I can only imagine how hard a decision you are making and how painful this is. I send you positive thoughts and energy to know that you will make the best decision you can for yourself and you daughter. I agree that you deserve someone that can and will commit to you, for whatever reason that may not be him right now.
Hopefully he will see how strong you are and realize he is making a big mistake by being so dang stubborn. I think that if it's meant to be, he'll get his stuff together and compromise, if he is not willing to work with you on this, then what about the bigger things down the road that require working together on? Best of luck to you.. like the other bees said, you deserve someone who will be excited to marry you!
I am older so my wisdom may be hard to take but I have a 25 year old daughter and a 23 year old son and would write this to them if they were in your situation. I just hope you won't mind if I address the fact that your SO has been married before, that you have a child and that you live together. These facts could be having an impact on his decisions and yours as well. Please allow me to explain what I mean.
If your SO's marriage failed because he had an ex-wife with problems, then he may really not want to take another chance at marriage for awhile. If the marriage failed because your SO may have relationship issues then you may want to think long and hard before marrying him. Many times divorced people bring the same issues to a new relationship and ultimately to a new marriage. Unless you know first hand who was the problem, be cautious in believing everything he may have told you to defend his innocence. Your love for him may keep you from seeing his less than desireable traits and cause you to beieve what he tells you. When a couple gets engaged they are saying we are ready to marry. Finances and previous realtionships should not be part of his decision making after that. Right now you are both living and spending the same amount of money as a couple only without a marriage certificate. Is it going to cost your SO more money to have a wife then a live in girlfriend? Many times men are interested in keeping a relationship on their terms. It is selfish and unfair to their partners.
Secondly, you want to examine why you would consider staying in the relationship. Right now you are unhappy with or without a ring and a wedding date that he says will happen in 5 years. Sometimes women, young and old, tend to "settle" because of their individual circumstances. Whether it be that a woman is overweight, not the most beautiful or who comes as a package deal because of a child (children are blessings). Please don't think that you will never find someone that will want you. There could be someone else if you chose to date again. It would be better to wait for a more compatible partner or even remain single for awhile than to stay with someone who just doesn't see commitment the same as you do. How many other items do you not see eye to eye on? Be honest with yourself. As difficult as it is to not have an SO, it is more difficult living with someone who considers their needs first.
An ideal relationship should consist of the man working to make his woman happy while the woman works to please her man. That way, no person in the realtionship is neglected. However, if your man is working to make himself happy and you are working to please him then who is tending to your needs?
Lastly, I think living together is such a bad idea for anyone who hopes to get married one day. So many wonderful (and some not so wonderful) men may not end up marrying their girlfriends or fiances once they start living together. Why would they want to get married when in their minds they have the closest situation to a real marriage except that they can pack up and leave whenever they want with no strings attached. It's a perfect life for men of all ages where they "have their cake and eat it too." I always thought my father was so out of touch with the current ways. But he told me something as a man that I really beieve is universal among all men who live with girlfriends or fiances. He used to say "why would a man want to buy the cow when he can get the milk for free?"
Breaking up could be the best thing at this point. Your SO may learn that he doesn't want to be without you. This may or may not happen overnight. My friend's son lived with his girfriend for 5 years without giving her a committment. It was a year after she left him that he begged her to take him back. They married that same year.
A relationship should be working for both people. It should not be one sided. You will have to decide if you will continue being unhappy in the relationship hoping that you will get married or decide if you are strong enough to be unhappy temporarily while you get used to your new life without your SO. If you have ever been through a break up then you know the heartbreak passes. We cry, we grieve, we move on.
So get "your ducks in a row" be brave and try to stay in your home where you can continue to cut hair. Just focus on what will be best for you and your future.
Rox,
Why would a woman want to buy a pig when all she wants a little sausage?
I wouldn't have married men I dated because, well, all I wanted from them I was getting. But if they had played hard to get, I still wouldn't have married them - because I didn't want to marry them.
I'm not marrying my FI because he won't put out otherwise and he isn't marrying me for that reason either - we're living together and he had every reason to believe I'd keep living with him for years more - but he proposed anyway. Why? Because he wants a commitment from me, he wants to be married. Many men want to get married. I think it's very false to talk as if all men don't want marriage and this is just a natural and unavoidable part of maleness - that's not true at all. I think the OP deserves someone who will want to marry her.
I agree with you totally about settling and there always being other options. I even agree with you that a woman who wants marriage and is in love with a man that doesn't want to marry her should move out and break up. But I don't think living together has a thing to do with it. People should live together because they want to for as long as they want to. I wouldn't have married someone who refused to live together with me.
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