- Blog
- Bios
- Boards
- Classifieds
- DIY
- Gallery
- Vendor Reviews
- Shop Weddingbee
Weddingbee boards
I may just explode.
Don't get me wrong, it is something that is definitely worthy of discussion, but please, if you haven't read the bill, don't really know what's going and don't understand it, stop trying to make statements about it. There have been a small handful that are well informed and DO understand it. I will honestly admit I don't know and understand everything about it, but even if I did I don't think I'd post about it on my FB status. I got to see this lovely gem earlier today:
"Heartbroken that while I sit here and earn money to support my family, I'm also raising the amount the goverment will take to use for the murder of innocent babies, on my behalf. I'd rather be uncovered and uninsured the rest of my life than let confused women take the life of their child on my dime."
"There is nothing in the bill about abortion, it's a myth. Have you read it?"
"Of course not, but if it weren't in there, why would so many people be in such an uproar over it?"
Le sigh.
AHH! I know! I keep seeing "Socialism has won. The world as we know it has ended." and "Obama is robbing us blind - how stupid are people?"
It gets really old, really fast. Either get informed or shut up.
I must be lucky. I don't think I've seen any Status updates about the healthcare bill.
people would rather get their tail feathers ruffled than actually take time and do their own research. How about Stupak voting for the bill, after getting all that publicity about the abortion thing? just a stunt, but people don't really read past the headlines.
Agreed...it's funny b/c most of the status updates I see on FB are from people that in their own words "don't follow the political process"...ugh
I can't stand it. Seriously, people need to keep their political rantings off of Facebook. I'm sure most people (including myself!) are not fully informed about the bill and therefore shouldn't be b*tching about it on a social networking site. Ugh.
We discussed it a little last night at my FI's friend's house. His friend thinks that it's flat out "socialism". I honestly don't really watch the news and don't really care about politics.
Do you bees think this new health care is "Socialism" ?
Exactly! All the people I know that are very politically involved and informed haven't uttered a peep on facebook.
I just love how the girl I posted about basically said this: "Of course I haven't read it! But all these other morons that haven't read it are saying it's in there, so it has to be true!"
Geez. And yeah, I've seen several posts about socialism. :/
I haven't read that much of it, but I heard that our health care will be controlled by the IRS what's your opinion on that?
See, I can't honestly state my opinion. I'd like to read the bill (which won't happen anytime soon, thanks school) and do more research on it before I start spewing my opinion all over the interwebs. :)
I heard parts of Europe and Canada have a health care similar to the one that just got passed... Any one here from Europe or Canada? If so what's your opinion about this?
I would really appreciate it if all the people throwing around the word "socialism" would take some time to find out what it means. I can't have any respect for anyone that thinks that's what this is, because they clearly just don't know what the word means, heard it on Fox news, and are throwing it around and aggravating the problem. The Health Care Reform bill is not perfect, but it is not socialism, it's not even socialized medicine, it's regulation--which some people have a beef with, and that's totally legit. But I am SO with you, @mogget. Everyone needs to get informed or BE QUIET.
@thefutureMrsGibbs - Our health care will continue to be controlled largely by, well, US. The insurance companies will be more regulated, and we will be required to buy insurance (by 2014), but you can pick the insurance you want and the government will, in many cases, help you pay for it.
By (I think) 2011 or 2013 companies are going to be required to report to the IRS how much they spend on healthcare because certain kinds of plans will be taxed in new ways.
All the FB rantings I've seen are from people who are probably saying the same things out loud to anyone who will listen right now.
I finally posted something about it this morning, but it was more like "The gov't is totally screwed up anyway, and the new health care bill is just a symptom of how completely f'ed up the system is and will continue to be." IMO, any bill which exempts the lawmakers from compliance is probably a totally bogus initiative. Kinda like saying "Ok YOU all have to eat spaghetti for the rest of your lives, but we still get to eat steak." "Why?" "Because we make the rules, that's why!" Ugh.
I'm with the rest of you who are sick and tired of watching ill-informed people post ignorant comments about the bill on facebook. If you didn't read it, please don't comment about it from what you heard from the media.
@ thefuturemrsgibbs - I'm from Canada and have been following the bill (and accompanying debate) closely.
In terms of the similarities between the new American system and the system we have in Canada (as well as similar ones in Scandinavia, Australia and UK), our system is quite different and far more "socialist" than that of the U.S. Our system sees ALL Canadians covered by universal, public healthcare that is paid for by the government (i.e. taxes). As such, we don't have a two-tier system wherein some individuals are covered by private insurance and others are covered by Medicare/Medicaid; we are all covered by the government-funded public healthcare. We also pay much higher taxes as a %-age of our income.
This has become so ingrained in the Canadian identity that if the government ever so much as mentions the idea of two-tier healthcare, many Canadians get VERY up in arms, as free healthcare is now seen as our right as Canadians.
I don't necessarily think the Canadian way is the best way (it's led to long wait times for things like MRIs and elective surgery). It is amusing though to see so many Americans ranting about the new bill being "socialist" when, from a Canadian perspective, it's not even close to the socialism we have here! Having said that, Americans tend far more toward libertarianism and Canadians are far more okay with a socialist approach -- in fact, we've come to expect it!
Ack...sorry for being so long-winded!
@MightySapphire - The idea that Congress will be exempt from reforms in health care is a myth. The plans in which they are enrolled as government employees will be subject to the same changes as everyone else's, and if they have other insurance it will be regulated, too.
@futureMrs.Gibbs - Our new healthcare regime will be very different from what Canada and parts of Europe use.
Canada and the U.K. have what's called a single-payer system. The government covers the cost of its citizens health care through taxation. Medicare in the U.S. is similar, but applies to a limited set of individuals.
What we're doing is attempting to ensure that everyone has a payer of some kind. Either a private insruance company or Medicaid or Medicare. That is, we've increased the number of people who will be covered, but haven't changed the ways in which health care will be paid for very much.
Mightysapphire- Teaadntoast is right. Here's a source explaining more about that particular myth: http://www.whitehouse.gov/realitycheck/491
As to the abortion thing- I wonder if those people who are convinced (incorrectly) that this bill gives federal money to abortion have stopped to ask why so many pro-choice groups are upset at this bill? If it really did give money to abortion, wouldn't those groups be celebrating? But they aren't...
I have found these three links very helpful in understanding the new US healthcare reform:
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2010/03/21/us/health-care-reform.html
http://www.latimes.com/features/health/la-na-healthcare-passage22-2010mar22-g,0,7818440.graphic
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/03/21/AR2010032103485.html
@thefuturemrsgibbs - I live in England and from what I understand you lot in the US are not getting anything like what we have here - unfortunately for you! Our NHS is much more like Medicare in the US - you pay your regular taxes (which FYI are lower than what I would pay in the US, if I was still paying state and federal taxes), and that's it. You go to the doctor and it's free (and my GP's surgery has walk-in appointments every morning - if you arrive between 8 and 10am, they'll see you that morning). My prescriptions are a flat fee of £7 except for if you're elderly or poor or a student in which case they're free - ditto birth control (free for everyone). And no one goes bankrupt from medical emergencies, because you don't pay for anything out of pocket - it's called "single payer" (ie. you pay taxes and the government pays for your care) and the whole system is free at the point of care.
I lived in the US for 4 years and I left, mainly because the last year I got an ovarian cyst and was charged nearly £3,000 for an ambulance ride, and almost £2,000 a day for a 2-day hospital stay, each of which I had to pay 1/3 of as the co-payment. And then hundreds of dollars for some prescriptions, plus having to pay cash for birth control every month. And that was with super-fancy insurance that cost hundreds of dollars a month in premiums, which promptly increased once I left hospital - because once you've had one ovarian cyst, you're more likely to have another one (in the last 5 years I have not had another one but had I stayed in the US I would have been paying nearly double the premiums, just in case). I couldn't deal with it - or afford it - and came straight back to the UK.
@teaandtoast: Eventually. But government contracts are deliberately set up differently and with special provisions that they CANNOT change until the contract is to be renegotiated. So the government health care plan contract covering congress will not expire for another 6 years. Everyone in office now, even if reelected for another term, does not have to worry about ANY change in their health care for that length of time. And by then, the bill could be reversed.
But Mightysapphire, most of the changes are things that will affect the heath care companies as a whole- no individual people, even lawmakers, could get out of them if they wanted to. For example, the companies now have to spend a higher precentage of thier incoming money on actual heath services, rather than profits and overhead. They also have to offer families the option to keep kids on their parents plans through age 26. They are not longer allowed to refuse coverage for pre existing conditions. None of these changes are things that law makers could opt out of, even if they wanted to.
Plus- the people who voted to pass this bill did it because they intend for it to last. Even if the 6 year delay in the effects reaching members of congress was accurate (which I'm not convinced of), these people who voted for it certianly hope that the bill will be around in 6 years, and that they'll still have their jobs in 6 years. The situation that you are describing: that they somehow secretly think these chagnes are bad and set up a system that would put the changes on everyone else while protecting themselves, makes no sense whatsoever when you consider the fact that either now or in the next several years, they will feel the effects of this bill just like everyone else.
Honestly it all hurts my head. I've been very much trying to avoid it all and hold my tongue and keyboard. My FSIL called Congress "idiots" and half my friends are joining the "1 million against ObamaCare" and "Being Conservative" (guess what they're talking about?). The other half are super psyched and fending off attacks from conservative friends on their pages. Can't we all just get along?
...and then there was this, from a teacher I had:
I got mine..all through my own hard work! No luck, no fate, no genetics, and nobody e-v-e-r helped me...wink wink...now you get your own, you lazy bum. The current state of America. Jesus would be so proud of us:)
le sigh. I just want to talk about puppies and rainbows.
Cupcake- I find your teacher's claim that Jesus isn't proud of us when we try to help others amusing.
I can't even tell you how many people I have had to "Hide" from my news feed because I just can't take it anymore. I try never to talk on politics or religion in public venues (mostly because being an extremely liberal atheist is really out of vogue amongst my friends and colleagues - I might as well be a puppy-kicker) but no one else is doing me the same favors, that's for sure. I just don't understand what can be so bad about giving more people access to health care. ::sigh::
I have been reading the document and it is HUGE...a little over a thousand pages according to Adobe. My overall view is that it's a start. Just like laws are changed and revised over the years...so to will this bill. The fact of the matter is our current healthcare standards aren't working and we need to do something different. While this bill (from what I have read thus far) doesn't have EVERYTHING we need...I do think it has SOME of the things we need. We have to start somewhere.
I completely agree with everyone being sick of people posting lies and myths on FB! It's quite refreshing actually to come here and see what a factual, civilized discussion looks like. Props to the Bees for being informed/asking for more info!
There is actually a LOT of really great stuff for young women in the new legislation so I am excited about that. For example, being a victim of domestic violence or having a baby can no longer disqualify a woman from getting health insurance. And lower-income women will now have more choices about where they give birth (hospital or birth center) so that women can have safer births. That's good news for women!
@cupcake - Oh MAN to that teacher's Jesus away message. I always wonder about that from the religious/conservative opposition to stuff like this. I think, WWJD? What would Jesus do? He would help the less fortunate and heal the sick, no? I thought that was what it was all about? i'm agnostic, so what do i know about morals haha.
I know I am in the minority here, but I just feel like I need to say something. While I have not read the entirety of the bill yet I have been trying to plug through sections of it. I understand that we have a serious problem with health care in our country, but I believe that health care reform should be reserved to the state. I love the 10th amendment and I feel that this bill completely and utterly violates it -- and is therefore unconstitutional. Like @sage I need to hide my newsfeed, but from the opposite side. I am a conservative libertarian and many of my liberal friends refuse to respect my opinion and have actually made some hurtful comments. I am tired of seeing posts such as "screw the republicans" and how I am "selfish and greedy" just because I see things from a different perspective.
I wonder if people are copying and pasting that Jesus thing? I've seen a similar post on two of my friends' pages!
Krissy- that's an interesting position that I haven't actually encountered before. Are you saying that you would not be opposed to heath care reform as long as it was the state governments doing it rather than the federal? Can I ask why? I'm not trying to attack you, I'm genuinely curious.
I guess I've never really seen the point of federalism- to me, government is government whether it's called the United States or Pennsylvania, but I would be really interested to hear why someone might think otherwise.
@MightySapphire - Congressmembers, along with all other employees of the Fderal Govmt are insured via the FEHB, which is basically a collective of insurance companies. There is no contract, save whatever the insurance companies may negotiate with the government for the right to be included in the group. Those companies, and their offerings to federal employees, will be regulated in the same way your insruance or mine is, and at the same time.
Moreover, it seems a bit strange to assume that people who depend on the goodwill of the electorate to keep their jobs would, essentially, set themselves on fire by voting for bad policy and then deliberately exempting themselves from it.
Krissy, I appreciate your response and agree that it is an interesting perspective, even though I support the bill. I heard some conservatives argue that they disagree with the bill because they personally never had a bad health insurance experience, so they don't care that many others have been badly hurt by being denied coverage. That's when I think people are being "selfish." For the record, I don't think you are being selfish at all :)
Note- this is a generic "you."
I haven't read the whole thing but I don't think you should have to in order to get a summary of it and discuss it and have an opinion on it. You need to check your sources, but I don't think most people on WB have read it and we're not telling them to stop discussing. My opinion is if you view people as misinformed or uninformed, inform them rather than looking down on them because that's the information they have... on some issues you might be the misinformed one and not even know it.
The 10th amendment says that the powers not granted to the national government nor prohibited to the states by the constitution of the United States are reserved to the states or the people.
Each state should be allowed to create its own health care reform and should not be forced to adopt a plan pushed through by the federal government. Then the people would be given the freedom to say -- move to Texas if they liked their version of health care or to Massachusetts if they liked their version, etc.
The United States is unique in that we have the flexibility to move from state to state. Each state is unique in that it is allowed to create its own system and should never be dependent on the federal government.
Sidenote- I wonder if food might be the next thing.. I also wonder whether costs would be significantly lower if we didn't have such a big problem with obesity in the US... just because we're looking at ways to reduce medical costs...I know my current insurance gives discounts to gym membership for its members.
You must log in to post.
| Visit our sister sites | eHarmony Online Dating |
eHarmony Advice Dating Advice |
Project Wedding Wedding Songs |
JustMommies Pregnancy Calendar |
Create the honeymoon of your dreams.
| User | Posts Today |
|---|---|
| Lyndzo | 52 |
| Brielle | 39 |
| mypinkshoes | 32 |
| AshleyR83 | 30 |
| Cady | 29 |
| ndreighton | 27 |
| fivemonthsnotice | 27 |
| rebwana | 26 |
| funkymunky85 | 26 |
| fishbone | 26 |
| User | Posts Today |
|---|---|
| qwerty2k1 | 3 |
| serendipity9.8 | 3 |
| Miss T-Rex | 3 |
| NehaPrasad92 | 2 |
 happyface |
2 |
| vegempanada | 2 |
| vttp926 | 1 |
| SapphireSun | 1 |
| keepsmiling19 | 1 |
| Regina Phalange | 1 |
