Post # 1
So I watch the view. Last week Jeff bridges AKA The dude talked about how his wife gave him an ultimatum for marriage. He didn’t want to lose her (or marry her) but decided he wanted to lose her less so he agreed.
He said after 3 years of marriage and pouting he realized this was the best thing that had ever happened to him. Just a thought, perhaps we should force them to marry us and just be awesome at it =0)
The interview at ABC’s site. It was great and made my waiting day. http://theview.abc.go.com/video/jeff-bridges-dude-and-zen-master
Post # 3
I think that kind of decision depends on who you are as a person, and who you are as a couple. I can’t imagine giving an ultimatum. It’s just something I would never, ever, ever do. But I guess it works for some people. Some guys need that push out of their own heads. If that’s your guy… then that’s your decision. It would definitely kill the romance for me, but maybe not others. It’s impossible to make an across-the-board conclusion.
Post # 4
There isn’t much in my mind that can make ultimatums an appropriate or acceptable social method.
Ultimatums are supposed to be used to save somebody’s life. Quit smoking, quit drinking, quit self harm. If it will protect somebody’s life, yes. Ultimatums are necessary.
Marriage is not necessary for life. It is very important and should be treated like it is important. Ultimatums cheapen what marriage is. “Marry me or I leave!” is one of the most petty comments I have ever heard.
If it works for some people, that’s fine. If you’re a fan of ultimatums, that’s fine.
To me, emotional blackmail is never the answer, and if you have to resort to that, you’re in it for the wrong reasons.
If you and your SO are not on the same page, leave them and find somebody who is. Forcing someone to marry someone else isn’t what marriage is about, and isn’t a good way to start one.
Getting off my soapbox now.
Post # 5
Personally, I don’t think a man should be given an ultimatum. Why?
Because he should want (not be coerced) to marry the woman he is in love with.
And if he doesn’t want to marry the woman he is in love with, then he doesn’t really love her because a man who wants to marry the woman he loves will move heaven and earth to do so…without an ultimatum!
Post # 6
@Hyperventilate: Couldn’t have said it better myself!
Post # 7
Hey! So updating the OP with a video link to the interview. I think he brings up some interesting points from the male POV
Post # 8
I think it is wonderful it worked for him.
I also think that though it may work for some people, a blanket statement approving ultimatums is dangerous. You shouldn’t do them in the first place. People just do NOT like being pushed against the wall and it can end poorly if you do it to the wrong person.
With that said, my parents have been married 35+ years and got engaged because my mother told my father he needed to shit or get off the pot. At which point he promptly proposed. I know, what a romantic proposal. 😛
Post # 9
It’s been discussed here before, but it really depends entirely on the couple. It’s absolutely fine if you have time to wait and don’t mind waiting for as long as it takes (perhaps years) for your SO to decide to propose, however it is just as fine if you are not willing to wait for an indefinite period of time. I am almost 36, waiting more than two years to be engaged is not going to happen and I told my SO that after we had been together for a year. Fertility is already declining and beyond that waiting around forever is just not something I want to do. When I was in my 20s I felt differently, I’m not in my 20s anymore.
Some men, and people in general, procrastinate or get comfortable with the status quo and need a nudge. Yes, it is about being compatible but no couple magically meshes together, there is compromise and open discussions along the way, so long as your goals are the same and you have a strong love for each other then you move forward. I don’t think it means a man does not want to be with the woman just because she tells him, I love you and I want to be with you but I can’t wait forever, I really need for us to be engaged by x date, any more than it means a man who takes years to decide on his own to finally propose therefore loves his woman any less because he didn’t do it sooner.
An ultimatum is just as much about what the woman wants as it is the man. It’s not for everyone, but then again nothing is 🙂
Post # 10
@Hyperventilate: I agree, an ultimatum should be used to protect a life. That being said, one could argue that having children by a particular age could protect that that child from certain risks. This is where the line gets fuzzy.
I personally would never give an ultimatum. I think a large part of this is due to the fact that I never plan on having children, and therefore, I’m not on any sort of a schedule or time line. The other reason is that I would always feel the relationship was forced. Women that want to have families, might see it in another way.
EDIT: And seriously, someone doesn’t know who ‘The Dude’ is? Please, whoever you are, go rent ‘the big lebowski’ it’s hilarious.
Post # 11
Post # 12
I may get some flack for this, but I see so many posts from Waiting Bees that say they are sad and depressed and tired of waiting and how they have had the talk with their SO many times. Often times, Bees are ENCOURAGING her to give him an ultimatum. “Tell him if he doesn’t have a ring by this time then you need to rethink your relationship.” MANY are guilty of it on the Bee boards.
I disagree with ultimatums. I feel that, like a PP said, they cheapen a marriage. You are forcing someone into a situation they don’t want to get into yet. BUT if you really want to get married and you know your SO isn’t going to do that then its up to you to give an ultimatum and that’s on you. Maybe its the best for your situation if you’re that unhappy anyway, but marriage isn’t going to automatically make butterflies pop out of rainbows in your world.
Post # 13
I would never want to marry someone under the threat of an ultimatum.
Marriage has never been the “goal” for me, and I was always more interested in whether we were committed and the relationship was working for me/us, but I can’t imagine any situation where I would ever feel a marriage ultimatum was a good idea, either given or received.
Marriage out to be freely entered into by both parties, as both parties want it. Not because they fear losing the other person, or because they have been coerced or pressured into it. Duress and coercion are not two words I want to have associated at all with my marriage.
If it worked out for Jeff, great, but I still do not agree in giving ultimatums for marriage. I have also seen plenty of examples in my real life where ultimatums or “deadlines” were applied and I can’t say the ending has been exactly a happy one in any of those cases. A lot less thinking it was the best thing that ever happened to them going on. Not to say it does not happen, but I’d say the odds are not in the ultimatum-giver’s favour.
Post # 14
Depends on the couple. I gave my DH an ultimatum. He later thanked me for it.
Why? Because, if used wrong it can be petty but my DH is VERY out of sight, out of mind and marriage wasn’t exactly on his list of things to consider for that very reason. We were 2 years in and in a conversation I let him know that I’m not the type to wait around for years and years hoping that my partner will one day figure out they want to marry me. I’m going to move on and find someone who is on the same page. It wasn’t a threat. It was making him aware that while he has the right to never propose, I have the right to leave.
After we were married he randomly told me he was happy that I gave him the push. He said, he didn’t know why he hadn’t thought about making it actually happen despite the fact that he felt he wanted to. He wasn’t really sure why he hadn’t done anything sooner. He said that me giving him that push made him realize that I was serious about him and our relationship and it inspired him to put his notions into action.
So, while ultimatums get a bad wrap because they’re frequently misused and abused, there are times and places for them in the right relationship and with the right personality types.
Post # 15
It may have worked for him, but it didn’t work for me.
My ex H never wanted to marry. We had been together for nearly 7 years, and after spending 3 months abroad with my mother, constantly bombarded with her questioning about why he didn’t want to marry, that I made it clear that I wasn’t willing to continue as just his ‘girlfriend’ any longer.
6 months later I proposed – as I had been joking/threatening to do for awhile – on February 29th (leap year). He agreed, saying he still didn’t want to marry but would do it because I wanted it. He refused to get me an engagement ring, saying they were a waste of money. It took him nearly a year to tell his parents we had got engaged. He also refused to wear a wedding ring. We didn’t have a honeymoon, and his mother paid for our wedding reception. As I’ve posted on here before, his behavour the day of our wedding made it clear to me that it was a mistake.
I never felt like he was committed to our marriage, and he never made me feel like he valued it.
Like @Tangled said, it completely killed the romance, and actually prolonged a relationship that should have ended. We didn’t want the same things, and he never changed his mind.
Post # 16
I agree. I guess it’s not true love unless the woman is willing to wait while putting her wants on a shelf and it’s only the man gets to determine when to get engaged. If a couple is fine without getting engaged or married that’s fine, if they don’t care when that’s fine, I just don’t understand why when a woman speaks up and if marriage and/or a family is important to her and she says something it’s automatically putting unfair pressure on the man and how dare she have a say in her own future.
“It was making him aware that while he has the right to never propose, I have the right to leave.”
Exactly. If my SO decides not to propose, I have a right to find someone who wants what I want, I’m not forcing him to marry me. He can easily say I don’t want to get married, it’s over. I have a right to expect this decision within a reasonable amount of time into the relationship and not spend years thinking it is going to happen only to find out it won’t. There are plenty of relationships that last years and don’t turn into marriage, some just stay together because it’s comfortable, easier than moving on, because someone doesn’t want to hurt the other one etc. just because you stay with someone a long time doesn’t automatically mean you have a future with the same wants.