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Why are you stuck? You know what you need to do.
Put yourself FIRST sweetheart :). Leave the guy! Find the one who is meant for you. And don't buy any more of this guys bullshit. Life is waaaay too short!!
You can't change people. He is who he is.
im sorry you are going through this :( Hugs. i hesitate to give you advice so i will just give you my opinion... if the guy i was living with expected every date to be dutch and was actually making an effort to keep our lives separate, id assume that our relationship was not headed to marriage. it sounds like you guys are casually dating, but youre living together. it sounds like he is way too comfortable.
the problem with an ultimatum is that you have to be prepared to follow through. so are you prepared to pack up and move for good until you get and engagement? do you even want and engagement? honestly, it doesnt sound like you two have a very happy relationship. what would marriage change?
Marriage isn't going to change this. A ring isn't going to change this- I would move out and stay gone because he is OBVIOUSLY showing you the guy he really is. Who wants to be married to that? It would be a marriage completely one sided.
I agree with the other posters who have said that there are deeper issues here than just the ring. You left, he wooed you back, and now you're in the same position you were before you left. Clearly he's not going to change. If you want marriage, he's not the guy for you.
So you guys are engaged? Are you actively planning the wedding?
The fact that your daughter noticed should be another red flag. Who needs a man who makes empty promises, cops and attitude, and makes you feel sad? Seriously, you can do better!
I'm so sorry. It is very hard when you love someone to see the light sometimes, we hope so hard that things will change.
I was in a similar situation- not with a ring, but I was with someone for 6 years who had poor parenting skills (which affected my life tremendously), different backgrounds, different approaches to life. I stayed, because I loved him. After 6 years (two of which I spent seeing him through a severe illness), he had a midlife crisis and dumped me for another woman. In hindsight, it was the best thing that ever happened to me, but it was hard and it hurt like hell.
IMO, you cannot "make it" with someone who has kids and doesn't parent them in the same way you would. It is just too damned difficult. You will always be in disagreement and if kids live with you, your life will be hell. If he is doing things he knows irritate you, that's another strike, and if he won't even take a step forward, that is strike 3 (4, and 5)!
He doesn't want to marry you, but he wants you to want him. That's what it sounds like to me. And you can do better. Trust me. I did.
And by the way, I wasted those years trying to change the man I was with. Those were my reproductive years. By the time I met FI, it was too late for me. Who knows what else I missed out on, spending all that time hoping someone else would change for me.
I would leave. I can't tell you what to do... but there are just too many things going awry. I know that there are hiccups in every relationship... no one is exempt from problems. But these problems seem too deep to be rectified. I wouldn't have moved back in.... if he really wanted to get married, he wouldn't have tested your boundaries to the point of you moving out in the first place. It sounds like he just wants to keep you on "reserve" but not really commit. And it's very childish of him to do things to purposely irritate you (the shorts & flip flops). He's obviously not ready.
Also, your first priority has to be your daughter. She is watching all this, and as you said, noticing it. Don't let her see you being taken for a fool, or putting up with crap. She will think that's normal, and end up in the same crappy situation. If you don't have the strength to get out for you, get out for her.
You do not agree on 3 very big things: parenting, finances, and religion. Three HUGE red flags to me.
Marriage is not going to make this better. Get out now and stop wasting your time. He's doing things on purpose because he knows you hate it? sounds like an immature douche.
@Sunflower--girl: I think you hit the nail on the head! The sad thing is he led me to believe he was on the same track with ALL those things and decided after I moved in that in fact he isn't. I'm having trouble accepting it,but know I have to. I'm thinking that I wished he hadn't proposed(although I can't say it was a real legitimate proposal!) I ended up with the ring at the end of the night but it was only because I corned him. It was either propose or I wasn't moving back home. Stupid on my part. He might as well not even proposed because he never speaks about anything to do with a wedding and at this point do I really want to marry this guy?? Just disheartening.......
Basically it sounds like he gave you a shut up ring since he won't even speak of the wedding now. I really would cut your losses and move on- this isn't a promising situation. Put it like this- you want to give a good example for your daughter and you don't want to be here a year later writing a similar post.You never know- once you leave, maybe the guy you are suppose to marry will come into your life. I hear that story a lot from other women who were just plain old fed up.
Good luck to you and keep us posted.
@sunshine8: Okay, it happened. You came to the realization that things are not going to change. It does hurt. Give yourself time to grieve but start planning for your future. This can be exciting. You get a fresh start. You know the saying "Fake it until you make it". .. You learned something about yourself during all this drama. Use it!
Oh my - I'm so sorry you're going through this. So sad. I know it's hard to hear but I have to agree that you should get out of this relationship. Nothing will change once you're married and your issues are way way too big to ignore. Especially parenting.
I see no need for you to keep wasting your time - you deserve better!!!!!!
I'm just more mad than anything. Imagine a man having the audacity to say and do all the right things only to say SURPRISE......undo all of it after you've uprooted you and your daughter and moved in with him. I feel like I've had a really bad dream but can't wake up. Talk is cheap,actions speak louder than words! At this point though I feel like we're beating a dead horse and all I get labeled is a nag when I bring up the issues. Why waste any more time or energy at this point. I'm pretty much numb. I think you can love someone but it doesn't necessarily mean you belong together. Maybe he was just brought to me to help me learn life lessons! If it's too good to be true,it probably is! Now what? Move out again? The area I live in is expensive and renting an apartment is not feasible(I've checked into it). I have a huge guilt about having to move my 13yr. daughter outta school away from her friends AGAIN! What to do ='( I just feel like a failure and a pathetic mother. I'm embarassed of the whole situation,shoulda never came back here. I'll never make this mistake again. Don't EVER live with a man before a commitment first. Make sure you have the same morals,values,financial plans,and religion. Do not listen to talk, look at his actions!
@sunshine8: it sounds like you're on the right track. just keep checking out places and wait til something comes up, hopefully in your area. you've gotta do what you can to get out of that situation, for both of your sakes. if that means moving somewhere less desirable for a while, that's just what it's going to have to take in my opinion.
You are not a failure or a bad mother. You are trying to make postivie changes. In my opinion, only failures or bad parents are people that see the situation as unhealthy but don't take the necessary steps to get out. We all make mistakes or find ourselves in bad situations - it's how we deal with them that makes all the difference.
You aren't a failure if you realize the problem and work on getting out- don't ever think that. Things WILL be OK- and like I said before, you never know WHO is around the corner. Cheesy the cliche but every cloud has a silver lining.... you just don't know how much your silver will be until you make the step to move forward and leave the cloud behind. Good luck and keep us posted.
I'm trying to figure out why you want this guy at all--what you describe is not a very nice man.
From what I read you have realized your situation is not the best but you are scared to make the first move. You want to leave, but the area is too expensive and your daughter will have to go to a new school. I know it is not going to be easy for you, but you can do it. Start planning and saving up, talk to your daughter about moving. Your daughter is a teenager she might understand and be on board with leaving. I hope you find the strength and courage to execute your plans. I wish you well.
I hate to give advice on this sort of thing as well, but this is what I would do if it were me...
First of all, I would have a red flag if my SO kept wanting to separate stuff if we were engaged or even serious. We are all about sharing and making things "ours" not "his and mine". The commitment phobia would be a problem if you were wanting to get married.
What happened in his past marriage to make him resent commitment so much?
UPDATE......
So he asked for another chance to "prove" himself. He put me on his cell phone contract. However I have to pay for my "half" of the bill,so really is it even worth it???? He's been extra complimentary and lovey so I hesitantly gave him another chance only to be really let down tonight. It's my daughter's bday and she has a friend over. They wanted to watch a movie on the big screen TV we have downstairs. My SO told her "NO" she couldn't watch TV down there because HIS son(who's 21) would be home soon. First of all his "son" has a TV in his own room! When I confronted my SO about this he said my daughter should ask his permission,uhhhhh permission to watch a TV,ARE YOU KIDDING ME???!!!! I'm so furious right now I want to scream! He also said that everything in that particular room was purchased by his son,which is not true at all! Needless to say he is downstairs as I write sleeping in the recliner with his son and I'm upstairs not getting a bit of sleep because I'm so upset. It just isn't gonna end with this guy! How dare he inconvenience my daughter for his son on her birthday! Once again here we go with the dividedness. I'm supposed to leave for Key West on Thur and what I really wanna tell him is shove it.
It sounds like this guy has some serious issues. Especially concerning his money. He is not proving anything by putting you on his phone bill other than wanting to get a discount for a family plan. If his son isn't even home why does he need to have the TV saved for him. Sounds like in his order of important things in life your not listing within the top two.
As a former divorcee it is his responsibility to clean up and prepare himself emotionally for another relationship. Don't excuse his behavior or commitment phobia from his divorce trauma.
And yes, I echo the sentiments of the previous posters. I think this guy is no bueno.
What are you doing with him? LEAVE. You're setting a terrible example for your daughter at the moment, and I know you don't want that! You don't want her growing up and thinking it's acceptable for people to treat her like a doormat.
I know this is hard. I'm a single mum too, and had to make a tough choice. Ended up living with my mum yeah ;) Haha! The things we do eh?
You can do this. Be strong. Women have been fighting battles bigger than this for thousands of years and you can do this. Do the right thing for you and your daughter. Especially when she's at such and impressionable age.
Changing schools or moving across the country isn't as bad as a future full of men treating her and her mother like shit. And don't forget to talk to her, she's 13 and maybe you could talk to her?
Big hugs and kisses to you, and I'm sending you lots of strong thoughts. xoxox
I'm sorry, but you do need to leave. If you don't agree w/99% of him then leave. You can find something. Yes it would suck to move your daughter but you have to look in the long run of things. Also, you say your a christian...remember the verse that states "Do not be UNYOKED". Well if he's not a christian then your unyoked. Listen to your heart and gut and what God is telling you to do...You are writing it all down already!
God has bigger and better things for you trust in that.
We have daughters almost the same age and I could tell you this- if a man ever treated my daughter like that, the relationship would be over so fast, his head would spin. NO MAN comes before ANY of my CHILDREN and no man would ever get the chance to treat my kids like that.
I do not understand why you aren't making plans to leave. Saving money, looking for another place, reaching out to family and friends, etc. I am a person who doesn't like it when someone "cries wolf"... yuo keep coming here to complain about him but you aren't making any moves to get yourself and MORE IMPORTANTLY your child out of this situation. What are you really seeking?
My dear woman, why on earth do you want to marry this man?! I am baffled. I hope you will forgive my bluntness - move on with your life. Immediately, right now, today. He is saying exactly what you want to hear and you keep falling for it. A PP said it beautifully - it is his responsibility to prepare himself for future relationships and get rid of his baggage from old ones. Stop making excuses for this guy.
I have been in similar circumstances and my best friend had the guts to look me in the face and tell me she was ashamed of how I was letting my ex manipulate me, that I was stronger and smarter and had more self-respect than I was showing. Is this how you would like your daughter to be treated in her future relationships? Because you are teaching her that men are allowed to be disrespectful, abusive and selfish. Every day you stay, the lesson gets implanted a little more firmly.
Absolutely get out of there now! IThis is not someone who you want to marry. You're going to be going through a marriage with the exact same problems. Quit giving him additional chances when all he does is screw them up. He's doing this to you b/c you're allowing it to happen. Move out, and don't allow him to do anything to you anymore!
If you're with this guy because you don't feel you can do any better for yourself & your daughter, then counseling is definitely in order.
As a student in grad school for counseling doing my internship, this makes me nervous and afraid for your future if you stay with him. You are teaching him to mistreat you (and your daughter) emotionally every time you take him back or let him get away with something horrible. He's learned he can give you half-hearted and empty promises and you'll come back to him. Don't let him have that power over you, you deserve much more than that!
@sunshine8: Please come back and let us know how you're doing and what you're doing to move onto brighter and happier places.
Oh my - you must get out. This will get even worse if you marry him. Trust me, I've been married before. You deserve SO much better and you are not a failure. He's a failure at a committed relationship and in general a failure at being "decent" - these things are just mean.
Please check in and let us know if you are doing ok
This is too much.
1. Dutch dating is ridiculous.
2. I hate to break it to you but he is not seriously considering marrying you. 2015 is way too far away. Gimmie a break. He just said that to calm you down.
3. Life is too short to be miserable. Since you are engaged, request premarital counseling and if he says no or you can't fix it, run.
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I convinced myself I was done writing on this board,but here I am,back again. My story is kinda long but after stringing me along for 2 1/2 yrs locking my ring in a safe I finally gave my SO an ultimatum mistake#1. Moved out in August for 2wks. He asked me to dinner and gave me a lame proposal and promised the sun moon and stars. I moved back in mistake#2! Now here we are 5mths later with nothing different that when I left. He is divorced and has a severe phobia of commitment and sharing things as a couple,it's "yours and mine"which isn't how I want it at all. He's dad the friend not Dad the Dad to his kids and his parenting skills are very different than mine. So with that said he never opened a joint savings for the wedding like he said,he still continues to divide things(I pay my half when we go out to eat,all my bills are seperate from his). He used to go to church with me every sun and now refuses to because he used to be Jahovah witness and doesn't believe in the same things as the christian church. I am having second thoughts because it seems like he said all the right things to "get" me and now his true colors are coming out and it's not working. I just don't know what to do anymore. Christmas was awful this year,he had an attitude and my daughter noticed. Our Christmas party involved my center isle in the kitchen filled with alcohol and his 21yr. old son drinks to get drunk at every party we have. He purposely wore shorts and flip flops because he knows that really irritates me when he doesn't look nice when we have company. I've spoken to him about the issues and he says he wants to work on it but then nothing happens. He hasn't come through with one thing he promised since I moved back in. I feel stuck and sad.