Post # 1
I found a very interesting article on Slate with basically some “science” proving that men these days are operating on “Why by the cow when you can get the milk for free?” It’s kind of scary because there’s basically nothing we can do about it unless almost every woman participates and in most cases the sex has already happened! I’m not blaming this on why my SO & I have been dating for 6 years, but it is interesting to wonder about…
What do you all think about the article?
Post # 3
You can’t seriously call this crap “science”, and it certainly does not prove anything. I have plenty of married friends and every single one of them lived with and slept with their husbands before the engagement.
In my opinion this is just another “scientific” article designed purely for the purpose of scaring women into staying virgins until marriage. Not healthy at all.
Post # 4
Tabloid science – about as accurate as tabloid gossip.
I think it’s perfectly healthy for a 20 year old to wonder about what their future holds – including whether marriage is part of that future.
Post # 5
it’d be better to get a man’s opinion on this. i do find that this article brought up some interesting points. however, considering the climate of the boards these days, i’m actually scared to say anything that will get flamed…
Post # 6
@BellsforHer: I think it’s more trying to say that women shouldn’t put out so easily. Whether or not THAT’S healthy, however, is similarly debatable.
Post # 7
@BellsforHer: I’m pretty sure the Slate is a liberal “news”/opinion site so I don’t think that’s the purpose of the article. I think the purpose may be to not have sex in the first 2 weeks of dating but wait a bit longer like until you’ve said “I love you” or something. I would have to agree with that, but if it is saying to stay a virgin until marriage then I would have to very much disagree.
Just a disclaimer, I’m not saying I totally believe this article or think it’s real science since one of the studies is so flawed it’s not even funny!
Post # 8
It also depends on the woman. I’d rather never get married than waste so many years when I could be having great sex. Priorities, I haz them.
Post # 9
@Beluga: That lady over there? That’s me, laughing and agreeing in the corner!LOL
Post # 10
My grandmother always said that to me (not about me – about women in general). I have to say that I agree with that saying. But I don’t think anyone is doing anything wrong either. It’s a personal decision.
Post # 11
@Beluga: Yeah, it’s called ‘needs’! I haz ’em too! Hahaha!
Post # 12
OMG you guys are cracking me up! I totally agree @Beluga! Actually that’s the reason I decided to not wait until marriage… What will be will be regardless
Post # 13
A Man’s Response
So I sent the link to the article to FI (we talk on AIM at work). I told him that the girls on WB were wondering what the male response to it was, and whether he had time to read it and tell me what he thought. Here’s what he said:
“I have to admit that there was a time when I was afraid to commit. This wasn’t because I was looking for someone better. It wasn’t because I wanted unrealistic fantasies. It was because I didn’t know what else was out there. I had no definite direction in my life and I had no security.
In a world were a man can support his family, he would be more likely to have a family. If he is working retail and hates most of his life, then giving up partying, non-committal relationships, and all those things that make him happy sounds pretty unappealing. If getting married adds to his sense of well-being and gives him meaning then he’ll do it.
A lot of men in their early twenties haven’t figured out the direction of their lives enough to know what they want from a committed relationship. This is something that the article doesn’t really address. These men, who are seeing their prospects for the future reduced, don’t have clear direction, don’t have meaning in their live, and don’t really feel like men. They are still boys, because life hasn’t given them the responsibilities of men. If you are talking about boys, not men, then it is easy to see why they are afraid to commit.
The article blames men’s lack of ambition on their access to sex. This, I think, is a gross misrepresentation. It seems to imply that the economy and greater changes in society are caused by men getting sex too freely. It think the contrary is true. If men weren’t having these problems in the work force then they may be more likely to commit.
Does this mean you need to push a man toward some sort of ambition in order to get him to commit? No. That would just piss him off. I don’t honestly know how you’d convince him to marry you if he is a long-time commitment-phobe. For me, it took a traumatic experience that made me realize how terrible my prospects would be if I wasn’t with her. Now, I don’t want that to sound like I’m settling. I’m not. In my opinion, I’m marrying up. It just took a while for me to realize which direction up was.”
Post # 14
“I found a very interesting article on Slate with basically some “science” proving that men these days are operating on “Why by the cow when you can get the milk for free?” It’s kind of scary because there’s basically nothing we can do about it unless almost every woman participates and in most cases the sex has already happened!“
Well I don’t know about all y’all, but this cow is capable of walking right out the door if the guy is not meeting my needs.
I have sex when it’s for my own enjoyment, not as a reward or ransom that I hold over a man’s head. It seems to have worked out alright for me!
Post # 16
omg, this is appropriate, because just last night, bf and I were talking about how our parents would react if we were to live together. The phrase, “Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free?” came up; he had never heard of that saying before. (He’s from a different country.)
But anyways, after reading that article, I think there are a lot of problems with this “research.” First of all, they are saying that more young men are ‘failing at life’ nowadays and then saying that more young people are living together, engaging in premarital sex, and delaying marriage. But do we know that it is these “failing men” that are actually getting more sex, or is it more common for “failing men” to be commitment-phobes? To me, there is no clear link.
Then, at the end, they interviewed a few young college girls about the uncertainty of their relationships. While I know that some people do get married and engaged at age 20/21, it is also not at all uncommon for a young man (or woman, for that matter) at that age to be uncertain about his future, and where marriage fits in with their future plans. Instead of letting some college girls whine about their “commitment-phobe” boyfriends, the researchers should have interviewed said boyfriends, to get a straight answer about where they were at with consideration to marriage.
I don’t know, overall I see very little actual science, and a whole lot of speculating and stereotyping going on in this article. I feel like they are trying to pull together very few pieces of information in order to perpetuate more old-fashioned ideals. Are some men commitment-phobes? Sure, but I think there are also plenty of people that engage in premarital sex and that live together before marriage, that end up getting married.