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Ok let me start off by saying..I really like this photographer's work. They are a husband and wife couple and their portfolio is to die for. I knew I wanted them for my wedding the moment I came across their website (and their rave reviews). But they are really starting to get on my nerves. Firstly, their packages comes with a comp E shoot.. my FI and I already did an E shoot locally ( we are having a DW wedding in Colorado) and so I asked the photographer if we could substitute for something else.. like a TTD or Boudoir shoot. They said no because they don't do substitutions. OK, thats fine...I mean.. I dont see what the big deal is.. but I am not in the wedding business so it might be a big deal that I am not aware of. Secondly, I checked their website about a week ago and saw that they have an early bird booking special...book now and save 400$ for certain dates. My wedding happens to fall under those dates. I then ask said photographer if the deal applies to us because we were VERRRRRRRRRRRRY early birds and she says NO because it is for new bookings only. But says that my wedding date is pretty popular (which I already know) and that if I had waited that the date would prob not be available any longer (which I totally believe). Come TODAY, FI and I are planning a very short (3 day) trip to Colorado. We are flying in XMAS day and leaving on the 28th (morning). SO we have been booking appointments to meet with all of our vendors (hair.makeup,cake,caterer,reception venue,church,musicians)...and none of them have issues with meeting us on the 26th or 27th BECAUSE THEY ARE BUISNESS DAYS. except, our photographer has an issue. I get this email today:
Hi Ms Neutrino,
I'm sorry, but we're closed from December 24th-26th. Will you be here either before the 23rd or after the 27th? We definitely try to work with couples who are in town over the holidays, but the days directly surrounding Christmas aren't available.
WHAT???? HOW IS THAT WORKING WITH COUPLES THAT ARE IN TOWN OVER THE HOLIDAYS?! FI and I will not be able to go back to CO until the wedding. We have work and school and a child in school AND we are LDR right now. ---oh god, someone just tell me what to do.
I'm sorry, but we're closed from December 24th-26th....but the days directly surrounding Christmas aren't available
i think everyone is entitled to have a few days over Christmas off and that includes your photographers - yes its their business and source of income but as a working couple they also need time for themselves/may have their own family christmas plans
well perhaps you could have a last minute meeting before you leave 28th morning?
@vmec: We leave on a 6am flight :-( and the meeting is for an Eshoot. What would you do vmec? You always have good advice
What is the nature of the meeting? If it's jist to set a date or something or give a deposit that can easily be done via the phone or email.
I am planning LD as well and the majority of my 'meetings' are pn the phone or email.
I think that they're entitled to those two days around Christmas... I'm a photographer and won't be meeting with clients around that time either.
@linz09: we already set a date with them and paid the deposit MONTHS ago over the internet/phone. They were really accomodating as far as the money goes. After we paid them we didn't have the need for any more meetings until now. We need to meet to get the Eshoot done. It is the absolutely only time that we will be able to go... I am in school.. FI has to work and save all of his leave for the wedding and honeymoon as well as our daughter is in school. There is just NO time between now and the wedding to go back.. as well as we don't really want to buy 3 plane tickets again seeing that we will be in town for that time!
What are you trying to meet with them about exactly? Could it maybe be done over Skype?
I don't think the Christmas holiday thing is so bad, but I do think it's a bit weird they won't substitute your e-shoot for a boudoir or something else. It's the same amount of work, isn't it?
Why can't they meet with you on the 27th again? They're closed the 24th-26th, but she said anytime AFTER the 27th? Why? Are they busy on the 27th?
Since you fly out early the 28th, I would ask if they could either fit you in on the 27th, and then if that doesn't work, you could possibly arrange a teleconference via Skype or something.
@piglet_625: I have no clue why she can't meet us on the 27th. I actually sent her this email and got a response (following)
Photographer,
We are flying in on Christmas day and flying out on December 28th. Due to work and school restrictions these are the only dates Mr Neutrino and I have off together and jumped at the opportunity to take the time to go to Colorado to meet with all of you. We have a three day time span in which we can meet with all of our vendors and see our venues. We did not think this would create a problem as they are business days and all other vendors have set appointments with us. We will not be able to come to Colorado again until the wedding. If you can pick a date and time and be a bit flexable with us we would really appreciate it. If we have to, we will move other appointments around but those are the only days we will be in town.
-Mrs Neutrino
Hi Ms Neutrino,
December 26th is not a business day--it is Christmas Day observed and a holiday for banks and most major businesses. To be totally honest I'm upset by your email and would like to talk over the phone--are you free this evening?
-Photographer
@piglet_625: That's what I was thinking. Why can't you see them on the 27th? I also don't think that it's wrong of them to take a couple of days for Christmas...
ETA: Posted at the same time as the OP, lol. I find it odd that the photog was upset by your email...
Phone her and tell her you know that the 26th is a holiday, but you would like to meet on the 27th if possible! I don't see why she is upset about your email either...it's not like you were nasty at all.
@MsFoxxy: me too , wtf?
@MademoiselleL: I will talk to her tomorrow.. I feel like right now I am just way too frustrated to speak with her and I don't want to burn any bridges. Especially since she has our money.
@MrsNeutrino: WTH? They're upset by your email? Because you asked if they could be flexible with the short time you have? Grrr. I'd be pissed too. Unless they were planning on being out of town, I don't see why they couldn't hop into the office to meet with you. If it's for e-pics (I think that's what you said) It didn't take more than 2 hours for ours. And quite frankly, you wouldn't be doing it if they would allow you to e-pics out for something else. Maybe you can tell them that? And say if they converted it to a print credit or something that you would be fine with not meeting with them? Obviously they are entitled to take days off and not allow flexibility with their packages but that's making things difficult for you.
@MrsNeutrino: Plus they are a private business which means they have the ability to determine their own schedule and not follow public holidays if they don't want.
Agree, admit you're wrong and apologize!!!
Say I'm sorry photog. I stand corrected about the holiday. Then just play the I'm very excited to work with you and have some pictures taken and I am most certainly willing to work around your time if there's a chance you can fit us in anytime during these 3 days...
We did not think this would create a problem
to me "did not" and "would" implies past tense/there was an earlier enquiry and response but otherwise i see OP's email as being flexible with the restricted time allowed and hoping for a option that works for both and i understand she is disappointed
I also say don't wait until tomorrow, speak with her tonight if you can... deep breaths and practice what you want to say...
Be careful not to alienate your photographer. You'll be spending all day with them on your wedding day and their attitude can make a world of difference.
That being said, I don't think it is unfair of them to have the 24, 25, & 26 of December off for the Christmas holiday.
Could you maybe offer to Skype them instead of a face to face meeting?
saying that their upset by your email is an extremely childish reaction. i'd want to tell them to grow the f*ck up and just pick a date and time but you should go with vmec's suggestion.
@mszebra: I believe OP is attempting to do their e-shoot (which is still lame that they wont switch it!) during this meeting
@mszebra: I don't think its unfair either. I asked them to pick a date between the 25-27. She could meet with me on the 27th, I even said I would move things around if need be. I wouldn't need a face to face with her if we didn't need to take our Epics.
@elliestan:LOL! yea I know. I also have no clue what part she was upset by.. the other vendors?
December 26th is not a business day--it is Christmas Day observed and a holiday for banks and most major businesses
WOW! I cannot believe that your photographer is making a big deal out of this. Yes, Dec 26th is observed as Christmas Day BUT IT IS NOT CHRISTMAS DAY! If they arent willing to be a bit more flexible and empathetic, then this may not be the photographer for you. Considering the fact that this may be your only chance to meet them prior to the wedding. And the fact that she was upset by your email is BEYOND me. Good Luck and Keep us posted!
@MrsNeutrino: Whoops my bad. I didn't realize the meeting included e-pics. I know it's a shot in hell but perhaps you could see if they are travelling to LA in the time before your wedding? If you can't do the e-pics perhaps they'll offer you a Trash the Dress session or couples session after the wedding instead.
@Kamazing: I would agree.
I totally understand about the holidays, but saying that she's upset about a simple request to meet with you on a non-holiday when she already specified they were not closed, is, to me, unprofessional. The 27th is not a holiday, so therefore there should be no problem accommodating you, especially on your time crunch.
If they cannot accommodate you, I honestly would request my money back and take my business elsewhere.
When you talk to the photographer on the phone, ask specifically about the 27th. If that's not possible, I suppose you could see if it's possible to change to a later flight and meet with them early on the 28th? (That last idea may not be possible or you may not be willing to change flights, which is fine-just trying to think of options). I'd apologize about the 26th, as they may well have family plans. While not ideal to take e-pics, would it be possible to meet with them a few days prior to your wedding? Or if your honeymoon is in the area, would they be willing to do an engagement shoot after the wedding? (yes, I know you are no longer engaged, but it's still nice to have more casual couple/family photos.)
@MrsNeutrino: Oh boy. You really are in a pickle. Hey, at least you figured out how to comment on an iphone, I'm still trying to figure that out. 
Anyways, I agree you should call her and see about the 27th or very early 28th. She might be defensive because she's reading your email tone incorrectly. If she knows you're just very excited and willing to work around the tight schedule perhaps she'll be more open.
I think you should cut the photog's a break. They are entitled to have a few days off for Christmas if that's what they were planning. You should get on the phone and see if you can schedule on the 27th or if the e-pics won't work, ask again about substituting for maybe an album or extra prints.
I would also call and start with an apology. To me, your email seems forceful and and unfair by insinuating they aren't being flexible which is probably why photog felt offended.
Is there no way you can stay an extra day?
Hi Ms Neutrino,
I'm sorry, but we're closed from December 24th-26th. Will you be here either before the 23rd or after the 27th? We definitely try to work with couples who are in town over the holidays, but the days directly surrounding Christmas aren't available.
I'm sorry i'm with the photographers on this one. Whether or not the 27th isn't a holiday is irrelevant. THey like alot of people schedule vacations and time with family around a major holiday like Christmas. They are totally entitled to setting their time off as they see fit. They don't owe anyone an explaination as to what they are doing on their day off. None. She made her availablity clear as day in her first email, so there wouldn't be any miscommuncation. Frankly, I'd be pissed off if someone threw their other appointments with vendors in my face in an attempt to get me to schedule on day I've already said is not open. Trying to work with a schedule doesn't mean having to give into a pushy bride. I'm not saying your pushy because I understand your anixety but cut them some slack.
Well that's frustrating.
My dad is also a photographer and if he is going out of town, he tells people "I'll be out of town these dates". I kind of feel that that's the only excuse your photographer's should have for being so difficult about this...I mean sure it's Christmas and we all want time with our family, but at the same time...
But that's just me. I'm rather accomodating (sp?) and would totally try to fit you in somewhere.
@soon2bhis: I agree.
I'm surprised that most people are completely siding with the photographer! I do think the photographer should be allowed to take days off, of course. But, by saying that they are closed Dec 24-26 and not addressing Dec 27 at all, AND by saying that she is upset by the email, it seems like she is being a little difficult.
@MrsNeutrino: I would call her either tonight or tomorrow. Clearly she is misreading your emails. I wouldn't apologize for trying to meet with her around Christmas - that's ridiculous. I would just say that since they are closed the 26th and there's no way you can meet, can you meet with her when they re-open on the 27th? I wonder if there is a particular reason they won't substitute the e-pics. Maybe they aren't comfortable with boudoir, and maybe they have issues with TTD sessions (maybe?). If that's the case, maybe you can see if they would do a 1-year anniversary photo shoot instead.
I think you are right in being upset. Yes, they said they would not be available around Christmas, but if that is the only time you are going to be in that state they should at least work with you about giving you a print credit or TTD session or something. I mean really what is the difference between taking pics of you for 2 hours in a dress vs. in normal clothes? Just say you want to take your e-pics after the wedding in your dress ;) lol.
Also, I don't think they should be upset about your email. It didn't come off rude at all. As a professional who owns a business, they should be used to getting different requests or dealing with difficult situations. She should have just put that she thinks you guys are misunderstanding eachother and she would like to talk to you over the phone to make sure everything gets worked out and everyone feels comfortable going forward.
AND... I honestly think the way she put the dates is confusing. She says they're closed the 24-26 but then says can you meet after the 27? Why won't they meet on the 27th? She stated they were only closed the 24-26 but is saying she wont meet on the 27th... I don't know I would be pretty upset, I don't think you are being unreasonable.
i don't get the "cut them some slack" comments when OP has been polite and professional. OP has to meet with the photogs because they refuse to cut HER some slack and are not doing any substitutions so she's having to get pictures that she already has retaken on what will be for her an extremely busy trip. she is contacting them months in advance and giving them multiple days to chose from, including the 27th which is not a day that they told her they'd be closed, unless we're reading her mind and assuming she meant the 26th as christmas (even though when someone says christmas i think the first thought is the 25th). since there's room for interpretation, i don't consider that clear as day.
i don't care if they're visiting family or picking lint out of each other's bellybuttons for xmas - they can do what they want. she gave them the limited range of dates that they're available and it doesn't matter if it's a holiday or not. if they're unavailable at any time on any day that OP gave them, then they need to be as flexible as they say they are and either adjust their schedule or provide their client with a service they DO want at a later date.
but, they are the ones who are being pushy pains in the ass by refusing to work with their client's needs (by providing them with a set of e-pics that they don't really want as opposed to other portraits they'd rather have) which is what's causing the current problems. if they can't work it out with their schedule, i'd again ask to do a different type of session - bridals a few days before or a day after shoot or something and if they say no i'd keep pressing them on specifics for why that's such an insane thought!
Thank you bees for all of the support. I don't know what really upset the photog. There must be some sort of misscommunication on both of our parts I guess. Either way, I feel that as a paying customer that I deserve some customer service if nothing else. I am really frustrated with them seeing that we were really excited to work with them. I never expected photographers to be this difficult! I seriously feel like I am bending over backwards trying to accomodate them instead of the other way around. It might just be what I am used to in S FLA, but vendors are JUMPING at the opportunity to provide you a service. They will shoot on weekends and holidays , nights and early morning. Maybe it is just different in Colorado? I know that so far...our photographers are the only CO natives. Most other vendors are from Cali!
@krobbie: They do boudoir and TTD shoots, they just didn't want to substitute anything..they wanted E shoot ONLY. It kinda sucks but hey, what am I gunna do right?
@elliestan: OK I know I am not crazy now. Everything you just wrote is everything that I am feeling. thank you.
Here is the last email I sent before I went to dinner...she hasn't responded"
Photographer,
Don't be upset! I didn't mean to offend you in any way. Mr Neutrino and I are really excited to work with you and we just don't feel like you have been at all flexible with us. I am free to talk all day tomorrow. Give me a call when you are available. If we are able to change our tickets until later in the day on the 28th, would that be ok? (as far as lighting and stuff goes? )
-Ms Neutrino
@bklynbridetobe: I totally agree with you on this. They are taking three days off around Christmas. That is NOT unreasonable. I read the OP's email as a bit condescending and manipulative.
OP, I would probably be upset if I were in your photographer's position, too. They laid out very clear boundaries for you, and you continued to push the subject with them. What bearing does the office hours of other businesses have on the situation? There are no "universal business days" that all businesses are obligated to operate by. This is a husband and wife operation. Are they not supposed to go on any vacations because it might inconvenience a bride? I understand the difficulty of your situation, but try to look at it from their perspective.
It's not the photographer's fault that the only time you're available before your wedding is the 3 days around Christmas. You say that you're "bending over backwards" to work with them, but it doesn't seem like that from my perspective. It seems like you gave them a very narrow date range right around a major holiday, and said "this is all we can do. Make it work." You have no idea what their holiday plans are and I don't think you have a right to guilt them into scheduling a shoot for you when they have made it clear that they are unavailable. Why should your photographers be at fault for the fact that you are unavailable every other day of the year? Furthermore, why should your photographers be at fault for the fact that you want to replace an e-pic session with something else? They made it clear that there were no substitutions and you signed the contract anyway. You could've found someone who would be more flexible on this, but you didn't. I don't think you can hold that against them, since they were very forthcoming about the fact that they would not replace the e-pics session with anything else.
On a sidenote, didn't you mention already having E-pics done? Could you just forego these e-pics if scheduling is causing this much headache?
@mckernae: It is no one's fault. But at least they can be flexable.. either with when the shoot is taken or what type of shoot is taken. Personally, I would much rather forgo the Eshoot and do another type AFTER the wedding. Just because of timing and so I asked to do so because I forsaw a problem like this occuring. But they refused. I then passed on the Eshoot that we did in Florida with hopes that we would be able to schedule a shoot with our wedding photographers because we had no other choice (why pay twice?). I was pretty sure that universal buisness days are days that aren't government holidays? And I am not trying to guilt anyone. I am trying to schedule a service that I have already paid for.
Reading the emails in succession, I can kind of see why the photographer would have been put off by your email - it souded a bit entitled, like you were miffed that they weren't available certain days. While I agree they should be as flexible and reasonable as possible, it really isn't their problem that you only have a three-day window at Christmastime to meet with all your vendors. And I also don't think they are under an obligation to explain why they're not available the 27th - sure, it would be nice, but on the other hand you didn't just ask about it in a straightforward way, i.e., "Is there any way possible that we can meet on the 27th, or do you have other firm commitments? Here's our dilemma..." Or you could have approached it from the point of clarifying the dates, since they said they were closed the 24th-26th and wanted to know if you could meet after the 27th - that was admittedly vague, and you could have stated you were confused by that and wanted to make sure you understood correctly. Instead, you sort of confronted them with the fact that their availability isn't like that of your other vendors, and I don't think that was quite fair. I think you started escalating the situation when it wasn't necessary to do so.
@MrsNeutrino: Ah, I didn't realize that you hadn't already gotten e-pics done.
I get where you're coming from--it's a tough situation. But I can also see where they're coming from, which is why I felt compelled to respond. It just doesn't seem to me like saying "We're available these 4 days and only these 4 days from now until our wedding" is being flexible to me, particularly when the days are around a major holiday. I get that your schedule is insane and this is a huge inconvenience. But IMO you can't fault them for taking a couple of days off and write them off as being "inflexible" because they aren't willing to budge. This could be the only vacation they take all year--you have no idea what their schedules are like.
As for the business days thing--businesses are entitled to set their own schedules. Only government offices have to abide by what the government sets aside as a "business day." So, while some business will in fact coincide with what government holidays are, many will not. My office, for example, is closed the week between Christmas and New Year. Many offices are closed for three or four days surrounding Christmas. It is not at all uncommon. Other businesses will remain open on Christmas day. There is no "law" for this, and there is even more variation among small businesses. I would personally would be shocked if someone had the audacity to demand our office be opened up the day before or after Christmas just to accommadate her, and then cited other businesses that remained open those days as though that would make me change my mind. I get that small businesses are different from offices, but I would venture a guess that your photographers take fewer vacations than people working office jobs do. Running a small business is a huge amount of work.
Anyway, I wish you the best of luck and hope that you're able to work something out with the photographers.
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