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I'm a midwest girl with zero ties to Jersey, but I can't stand it when people yell either :(. Your FI's being a bit of an ass, imho. You obviously weren't okay, and he really should have mustered up some sensitivity :(.
I completely understand. I don't think it necessary the state, but my FILs are hispanic...which is quite different from my quiet southern white family. We do not yell at one another and yelling is how they talk to one another. I still have trouble being around my ILs especially right now when my fi is deployed. I cannot offer any help because I still do not know how to handle the difference in expectation and cultures, especially when they believe I should be more like them instead of accepting me for who I am even if that is the person that their son loves.
I actually had a panic attack (the whole hyperventiling, shaking, crying, feeling like I'm going to go crazy..full on panic attack. I haven't had panic attacks since high school which was five years ago. I was really high strung in hs and really stressed..but been able to handle things better now) this weekend at my ILs because people would not leave me alone about my fi's deployment and I was NOT ready to handle them. He left Wednesday and I do not "get over things quickly." It escalated because they did not know how to handle it correctly and well, them yelling at me to quite being a baby wasn't the right decision.
But, I thought I would let you know I completely understand. Maybe other bees could offer some good advice for the both of us :D
Edit to fix some typos and to add:
Maybe talking to someone in the family that is a little less rough around the edges...they may be able to offere advice about talking to your FFIL. Maybe you could talk to your FMIL and she could talk to your FFIL about keeping the yelling to a mild roar when speaking with you....
I think I need more clarification here, because I'm confused.
Are you in mourning because of something that happened that you don't want to discuss here? If that's the case, I'm sorry for whatever you're going through. Is that why you were crying? Or were the people in the diner making you cry? I just don't understand exactly what happened.
I do have to say that, while I was born in PA and live in Philly now, I lived in Jersey from age 10-23, and I never met a single person who was like the Sopranos or Jersey Shore. Most Jersey-ites are just like everyone else. I think that maybe you're projecting your in-laws personalities (and their friends' as well) onto the whole state.
@danadelphia: I am in mourning, and spent the weekend in NJ in an attempt to distract myself. I was stable (not crying, thinking of other things) until we went for breakfast and interacting with these people set me off.
I am no doubt using a HUGE generalization. I'm trying to reach out to people who understand the type of regional Italian-American culture that I'm discussing and is VERY prevalent in the area of New Jersey that I'm referring to.
On many levels, all humans are just like everyone else, and on many levels, folks from New Jersey are just like every other American. You're right. But, the attitude towards life in the NYC/NJ/Philly area is very unique.
And, as it happens when anyone travels, differences in culture are extremely clear to the tourist. Anyone who visits Texas who is not from there wil notice and be very amused by the cowboy culture. The same is true for me- I visit NJ and I think it's hilarious that the stereotypes are rooted in some amount of truth - the working-class Italian culture is alive and well.
Hoagie anyone?
None of this is here, nor there. I feel like what I experienced could happen ANYWHERE and even within the same culture. I could have come from a family of introverts and married into an extroverted family and they are just handling me way too roughly, in my opinion.
Okay, that makes sense. I just wanted to make sure that I understood. Again, I'm sorry for your loss and that they were rough on you.
well I doubt that all people from NJ are like that, that's a pretty big stereotype to project, but I will agree with you that there are major culture differences between north and south, or east to west, or between any region for that matter. It certainly takes some adjustment when you go from one to another.
The bigger issue here is why your FIL was being such an insensitive ass. He should not have lashed out at you at the restaurant when he knew you were already on edge. When people are in mourning, emotions are heightened and extremelly sensitive.
If I am understanding this correctly, it doesn't sound like your guy stood up for you very well in this situation. Why would you go there though if you needed to be in a calm environment when you know that his family is like this? Maybe I am missing something. Sorry but the story is a little confusing.
Eh, my FI does the same thing sorta, so I can see what you're saying (and he's from NJ). If we fight and I cry, he just gets mad because I'm "not acting like a grownup." He doesn't show his feelings too much, so he's better at talking things out and reasoning. I am emotional, like to cry my feelings out and thats just how I get through things. I feel the opposite about California, everyone's so happy and annoying, us New englanders are cold and angry just the way I like it :P
@ktisthatbees:Foolish, I guess. We had made plans, and I guess I stupidly thought that continuing on with life would help me stay busy and distracted. I didn't think I would be so unstable and would come undone so easily.
I'm very strong and my husband knows I can handle myself. I'm not upset that he didn't step in for me with his father because I probably would have made more headway alone, honestly.
It's strange.... maybe someone whose parent was like this can chime and help. My crying is an indication that I'm upset, but they react to that by yelling at me to stop. Almost like slapping me across the face to get a grip or something. My FIL genuinely said over and over while we argued later at home that he "meant no harm" but was trying to help me, because I was "acting like I had a stick up my ass."
Maybe he was upset that I couldn't get a grip... or perhaps he was angry that I was embrassing myself in public at the diner by crying - which I was, but not willingly. He did mention (while pantomiming me crying and wiping away tears) that I was crying but saying I was ok, so I was being foolish, and that he "cleared the air" by letting everyone know why I was crying and that "everyone was on the same page" as a result. Somehow, he felt that explaining everything to everyone was going to help. Like, suddenly I wouldn't have to hide anymore and could cry on the shoulders of these strangers. But, they were HIS friends, so ... maybe he thought that would work.
My family is Italian from Philly and I've lived and went to High School in Jersey. I'm not saying everyone is like all mafioso, but I do think people are rough around the edges.
It probably is a bit of a culture shock. I do not know anyone like the jersey shore people, but I do know my family is really loud and they do weird things like force new boyfriends to eat really hot peppers when they come over for dinner. They also scream a lot, and everybody talks with their hands and things are always flying around. It's a wonder I am so normal. I lived in the south for a few years and I was always like WTF why is everyone waving and being so friendly at 8AM. haha.
ok I understand. Well all I can say is that you need to be surrounded by support and kindness right now, sounds like your In-laws house is not the place to be. It sucks to be going through this, (I'm a sensitive person who had three roomates from Jersey in college) and I get how harsh their culture can seem sometimes. They don't see the big deal cause it's what they grew up with and they don't take offense to it and there I am about ready to cry when they yelled at me. But hey, at least they helped me get a thicker skin, and I could always count on them for their honesty :)
*HUGS
@floridabeachbride: Thank you for the extra advice and you have NO idea how much I wish I could take it - FIL is the only family there is, not a single female I could reach out to to understand. He himself has said that he wishes his mother were alive so that she could help me adjust to their way of being.
@flamingred: "they do weird things like force new boyfriends to eat really hot peppers when they come over for dinner" - That made me laugh SO HARD.
@flamingred: haha my roomates asked me the same thing! They were all from up north and they were like, "Why in the hell do people in GA always wave and smile at you when they don't even know who you are? It's weird!" I could see why they would think it was weird. If I waved and smiled at a stranger on the street in NYC, they would probably think I was a wacko :)
@coconutmellie: Aw I am so sorry! I so glad for my FMIL because she is the only reasonable person there that actually can understand what I am going through. She had her own trouble with being accepted into her husband's family.
@coconutmellie: Haha and when I come to work in the morning I need to tell all my "happy" friends to back off for an hour or two, I'm not ready for a full on smiley conversation at 9 in the morning :P
I think in this case you just need to see them for who they are, loveable but tough. Like you said, you know he didn't mean any harm, that's just how he handles things. I can see my FI getting tougher with me if I ended up crying in a restaurant but he would at least offer to take me somewhere else away from the people! Try not to let it bother you, we all grieve in different ways, just take a few days for yourself. Feel better!!
I know how you feel I'm born and raised in Maine, and most of my family are loud, like to curse, and will talk your ear off. FI's family are born and raised in Maine as well, and are loud, will talk your ear off, and usually think their way is the only way. That being said I am still sooo uncomfortable around his family. He is 100% confortable with how his family deals with things because it's how he was raised, so when I get upset at things they do he has a hard time explaining a lot of it or he doesn't exactly understand my side of the situation. However he does understand that I'm going to be his wife and that they need to treat me with respect and that the more they disrespect more the less we will be involved with them. I don't think your FI's was trying to disrespect you but I think they were just trying to help you through your problem. My family my be loud and like to talk but we tend to keep issues within the family, and wouldn't openly try to talk about what was bothering say my brothers FI, they would just say well if you want to go fishing and talk let me know. However FI's family likes to tell everyone that will listen every little problem no matter how personel it is.
What I have started doing is just taking what I think is an appropriate level of them being them and when they cross the line I say something, and if they still continue to act like a bunch of jerks I just stand up and walk out, its their loss and they learn pretty quick not to treat me like that again.
I grew up in New Jersey (the southern end, right outside of Philadelphia--and now I've been living in the south for the past four years) and trust me, not everyone from New Jersey is like your in-laws. I think with the Jersey Shore show everyone now thinks that all people in Jersey have fake tans, high hair, and bad attitudes, but that's just a rotten stereotype. (For the record, I hate that show--most of the cast aren't even actually from Jersey--but now it's made it cool to bash Jersey people). We have plenty of nice, normal people in New Jersey. True, we may be a little more "rough around the edges" than people in some other parts of the country, but the north is a fast paced place and you're forced to keep up.
I think your in-laws just sound like a bunch of jerks, but you can find those in any state! If you went to visit my mom in her Jersey town, she'd give you a big hug and invite you in for a cup of tea!
@danadelphia: HAHA! that would be my weirdo grandfather. Thank goodness all now husbands passed the tests.
@misslene: I've spent so much time in my life trying to get people to realize just how awesome Jersey is, it's one of my favorite places ever. All of my friends are from there, the venue we're getting married in is in lush mountains by a lake, it's not all Newark and guidos! Most of those "Jersey Shore" people are probably from Long Island anyway, I've yet to meet anyone who looks like those idiots.
I live in New Jersey and find what you are saying pretty offensive.
You are just perpetuating a stereotype about people you don't even know. If your in-laws are insensitive and spill your private business to everyone in their neighborhood, which upsets you, I am sorry about that. It sounds like you were not ready to be out in public with people asking you questions. But I don't see how that reflects on everyone from New Jersey. If you think we are all like the few people you've seen on television (who, FYI, are mostly from NY), you have a very narrow view of the world. Not everyone from NJ is a "guido" and not everyone from Texas is a "cowboy."
P.S. We don't call them hoagies.
I'm from NJ. I'm not offended. I don't know why your in-laws are blabbing your issues to strangers at diners (which is how I read your post). I don't think that is a NJ thing... that;s just strange.
But I do think people from NJ are a bit different in some ways. I think we can be a bit more upfront about our feelings perhaps... maybe even a bit more opinionated. I've always preferred this. I live in a different state now, and get a little confused about trying to read between the lines with people... like why can't they just tell me how they feel or what they think? hehe
Anyway, I am sorry for your loss. Maybe you just need to explain that you are a private person and don't appreciate your business being blabbed all over the place.
And FYI- it's a sub, not a hoagie :)
I kinda had it the opposite way. My husband's family does not yell while my family was very blunt and didn't mind a yell once in awhile. We definately had to adjust to one another. And I rarely yell now but my husband also knows to take some of my expressions with a grain of salt. When we were first working on it he told me he always thought that I didn't love him by the way I talked whereas I never thought I said anything like that. So.....it takes a bit of work and understanding one another on both sides. And at this point my dad I think is a little too blunt sometimes but I don't think I'm going to change him but I still love him.
I'm sorry you're grieving it must make the differences seem much bigger. But from what you've written it seems like your FIL does care about you. Perhaps an email might work to try and say why you were a bit thrown off, I'd just do it in a manner that gives him the benefit of the doubt that it's just his expression and not his actual concern for you that is rough around the edges.
It sounds like you are having a rough time, but I live in NJ and have all my life and I do not at all KNOW what you mean as you said in your original post. It sounds like you encountered some jerks, at a bad time in your life, and your in-laws didn't help but just so you know New Jersey is not all classless loudmouths, thank you very much. Hope you feel better soon.
@coconutmellie: It is a pretty big generalization to say all people from New Jersey are like that, but I know how you feel. FI's parents are both from New Jersey and I cringe when he tells me they are coming for a visit. They are both very nice and well intentioned people, but it comes out as very very harsh and sometimes mean, even when they are being nice. On the other hand, my mother who has never stepped foot outside of PA is the biggest blabbermouth on the face of the earth, but she says it in a nice way.
I'm sorry for what you are going through and that your FIL made you even more upset.
Yeah I get what you're talking about. I lived in Philly/Jersey area for a little bit and I'm from New England...I get the yelling thing (and esp. the Italian parental thing- my FI's family is the defination of it!)
It's a tough love thing. They think that by pulling yourself together and facing the day head on, it'll work out. They don't see how moping around is going to make you feel better. What they don't understand is that some people need sensitivity and patience when they are upset.
Unfortunately, you learned a hard lesson. That your FIL's house is no place to be unless you are in an emotionally stable place.
I don't know your situation or what's going on but I kinda see where your FIL's might have been trying to come from. They want you to be happy and to "distract" yourself, you really have to make an effort. So...sitting in a diner feeling bad for yourself (which other people noticed) isn't really you trying to distract yourself. Do you know what I mean?
No matter what, I think you should tell your FI how you felt in the situation so that moving forward, you and he are on the same page. And avoid your in-laws when you're in a sensitive place.
Good luck!
@Emerald and @Angela - They're absoluely called hoagies in the area of New Jersey where my in-laws are. I know that's the most insignificant part of both of your posts, but right now it's the only thing I can say I know for sure. I've tried to order subs at a dozen pizza joints and have been stared at, or bluntly corrected. Wawas are just one example of a main chain place that uses the word "hoagie" in all their print materials.
Anyway, I knew that posting this would offend people. Every post I've ever put up on wedding bee has offended someone. And I'm sorry, I am very sorry. Even if I would have been extra specific about what teeny tiny corner of New Jersey I'm talking about, someone would have still gotten upset. But, sadly, my experience has been the same every time I've been to that teeny tiny little area. Maybe it's a whole township full of insensitive loudmouth crass jerks... it kinda feels that way. Everyone looks the same, dresses the same, sounds the exact same. Or maybe I'm crazy. And for everyone from New Jersey: i've traveled to a few others places in the sate and no, nobody in those places looked or sounded anything like the idiots on Jersey Shore. I've had a wonderful time in Newark, at Rutgers, in Red Bank, Seaside Heights, Ocean City, Metuchen, Edison .... Edison itself looked like an Americana museum. I never saw homes so perfectly manicured and beautiful.
But the place where my in-laws live, the little township I'm talking about? Jersey Shore. That's what they look like, that's what they sound like, that's what they act like. As ridiculous and infuriating as it is on TV, it's worse in real life. So, I guess, there' a whole township in New Jersey perpetuating a miserable sterotype just like on TV.
new_jersey_where_the_weak_are_killed_a.jpg (29.7 KB, 3 downloads) 1 year old
And no matter whether you were offended or not, you all gave some very kind and needed insight and I appreciate it. MY DH has "got nothin'" because it's his culture and so on.
I ended up giving in to my urge and calling my FIL, who had little to say except a few gems. When I asked him why it was necessary to pantomime to my husband what I looked like crying, I got: "I wasn't making fun of you. I was just illustrating how stupid you looked." No joke.
@coconutmellie: Having learned from my East Coast Italian family, they can smell vulnerability. You just have to be tough and bury the emotion around them. It sucks and it's not an adequate solution, but it's reality.
I agree with full on avoidance if you are in a vulnerable spot. Hang in there!
Do you think he intentionally was being mean? Just wondering because you said they were very we intentioned. So do you think it's just tact as you said before?
"I wasn't making fun of you. I was just illustrating how stupid you looked."
It might be a mean thing but I can completely see someone in my family saying something like this, I even said stuff like this for a long time and then stared blankly when people got upset.
I could be completely off base since I dont' really know what happened but it just sounds like he wasn't doing the actions to try and get your husband to laugh at you or think badly of you but to show him why he felt like he had to explain when someones crying but saying 'I'm fine, I'm fine'. He probably just needs to understand your feelings on privacy more than anything.
@troubled: You're right, I know that he was well-intentioned at the time at the diner and afterwards with my husband. And when I spoke to him today, he said the same. I guess... the difference between being well-intentioned and helpful can be HUGE: ever see the movie Misery?
And sure, if it's not you and if it's not your feelings, in the moment you could easily see sarcastic family members saying stuff like that. One of my Russian coworkers tells me some of the things her husband and in-laws say and it's so sarcastic it's hysterical - but I can imagine myself wanting to hit them if I weren't in a good mood and it were aimed at me.
I guess I'm trying to get used to a lot of well-intentioned thoughts coming from their mouths in really, really harsh ways. My family is capable of having good thoughts and kind words and actions to go with them.
He says that people were staring at me because I was crying. I answered him back that they were probably staring because he had made me cry and proceeded to eat his breakfast like nothing happened and not say a word. He had a whole conversation with someone who sat on his other side for 20 minutes and was a million times nicer to that woman than me.
@coconutmellie: Oh geez! I'm sorry! That is ridiculous enough without being in a delicate frame of mind. I can't believe he said that! I hope things get better for you soon.
To everyone else who was offended, I didn't think it was harsh or insulting. I can imagine Jerseyites (did I just make that up?) are extra sensitive right now because of all the terrible shows but take it with a grain of salt. No one with common sense actually believes everyone from New Jersey acts like that. However, most stereotypes do have a speck of truth to them and I think it's safe to say that life over there is faster paced and everyone is a bit more brusque. If someone is used to a much different way of life, that could be really off putting if you're already easily upset.
Ok, let's clear one issue. In PARTS of Jersey (and southeast PA), subs are called Hoagies.
Yes they are, don't argue with me. :)
Anyway, I think your phone call with your FFIL just cements his opinion of the whole matter. The best thing to do now is to move on. Don't project your unhappiness onto him. No, he didn't behave in a kind manner towards you but what good is going to come of continuing to bring it up with him? Just remember this in future dealings with him and work on keeping your emotions in check when visiting them. Yes, it's hard and not the best solution but it is reality.
In South Jersey and Philly they are hoagies. You will get laughed out of town if you say sub. One time some guy pronounced it "hoe-ahh-gee". It was painful to watch. (And sprinkles are called jimmies)
And have you ever tried to order a cheesesteak from Pat's or Geno's? OMG talk about stressful. You get booted out of line if you order wrong! I have to practice before I order because it's so nerve wracking. "Cheese with" please! ;)
@flamingred: I have been living in New England for a while, so during one visit to NJ I went to the local shop around the corner and ordered a "steak sandwich with cheese" without thinking. Everyone eating in the shop froze like in a movie, "cheesesteaks" dangling from their mouths. The guy at the counter had the most disgusted look on his face when I looked up from my wallet.
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I am in mourning. Due to privacy, I can't say much more, but I am going through the stages of grieving more slowly than I'd like.
I visited DH's family in NJ, with the idea of distracting myself. I had good moments and what I would describe as OK moments. We stayed at home mostly, and didn't go out amongst the public.
My last day my FIL and myself went to a diner for breakfast, while DH slept in for the drive home. As SOON as we got there, he was recognized by many and I was PEPPERED with questions from very extroverted and very loud-mouthed (for lack of a nicer word) people. I have met them before, but since my face shows all my emotion they knew right away something was wrong with me.
But instead of leaving me alone, or listening to me when I said "I'm fine" and changed the subject, they just KEPT barraging me with questions.
FIL has APPARANTLY told these people everything about our lives (they're practically strangers to me) and so in front of all these people in a diner, the owner starts screaming:
WHAT'S THE MATTER? WHAT ARE YOU DOING HERE? WHEN ARE YOU LEAVING? HOW'S SCHOOL?! (I'm not in school.) WHERE'S YOUR HUSBAND? WHY DIDN'T HE COME? DOESN'T HE HAVE A JOB YET? (super sensitive subject.)
I was so embarassed. I had promised myself i wouldn't cry (I was in a happy mood before we got there), but this set me off right away.
She finally leaves, but comes back. There are tears going down my face but I'm trying to get a grip. I tell her I'm fine and she's about to leave when my FIL outs me and spills the beans on why I'm upset. (He thought that explaining why I'm upset will save the day or something) I'm then subjected to a bunch of hollow advice from someone who is well-intentioned but WAY TOO BLUNT/HARSH for me right now.
FIL is from NJ. When I protest that I couldn't believe this was going on and that I'm tired of the only topic of conversation being what's WRONG with EVERYTHING (it's too crowded, too much traffic, it's too hot)... he starts belittling me - "why did you come then? Welcome to New Jersey. You should have just stayed home and sit in a corner and be miserable. It's not everybody else, it's you."
I have never met such well-intentioned people, but with absolutely NO tact. It's like they have no feelings, no softness- they just bark at you. They are SO rough, and it's not just him- it's EVERYONE I've ever encountered there. 10 years of on and off visits and it's such a different attitude from any other place.
When we got home, DH asked how breakfast was and FIL says "MINE was FINE." Yeah, because I spent the entire time hyperventilating at the counter trying not to make a single noise. I couldn't leave because he was my ride. It was miserable.
Both DH, FIL, and everyone I've seen there have the same reaction to sad people too: they yell at you. I don't understand it at all. I live in New England now and it's actually very similar here as well: It's like they're trying to "talk sense into you", but ..... what?!
FIL justified all his actions saying that he was trying to "stop me from acting like an ass."
I fought him as much as I could while I was there. He walked away and I cried for a while, DH comforting me but with nothing to say and with no control over his FIL. Later, FIL happens to be in the same room with me and his version of an apology is "Are you still pissing and moaning about this?" My response was "Yes." and he reached out to hug me. At the time, I could do nothing but return the hug and sob, but... now a day later I'm actually regretful that I didn't put up more of a fight.
But it wouldn't have mattered at all, really. It would have been a waste of energy. I'm at work and I'm fighting the urge to call him now and say, "You know what, I'm NOT ok with this, I take it back.".....
I apologize to any people reading this from NJ. I don't really mean any harm.... I just don't understand the culture at ALL. You KNOW what I'm talking about - it's what everyone finds hilarious and adorable about the Sopranos and all that crap and people from Jersey LOVE their tough-gal and tough-guy personas, but ......... being so rough around the edges makes for a real hard time for someone who is not used to it.
Does anyone understand? I feel like I'm going insane, and trying to explain it to DH and FIL was equally impossible - ...
On second thought, maybe I should change the title of this post to: How Do I Teach my Italian In-Laws to Stop Yelling and Be Sensitive.
If I knew the answer, I'd write the book.