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Isn't that the beauty (hah) of bureaucracy? Sorry they're such jackasses!
Two words: epic fail. Sorry you two have to go through this! Ain't that America.
I think the government truly enjoys making extra paperwork for itself whenever it has an opportunity to do so.
@MightySapphire: "Don't ask, don't tell" applies only to the military, and only to its actual employees (not their families). It does not apply to other agencies that require security clearances (like the one my son is joining).
Yeah, sorry that was meant to be a little sarcastic. I'm exasperated for you. It seems like a double standard, and it's craptastic.
Ugh, this garbage makes my blood boil. Let's take it to the White House!!
yes, it sucks but its for a good reason - you cant get a clearance if you are directly related to a foreign national - kinda defeats the purpose of a clearance.
dont worry its a PITA for everyone else too, so hey yay for equal opportunity!
@spaganya: Actually, my son is directly related to several foreign nationals (an uncle who is Mexican, cousins who are Israeli, etc.). That is not a complete bar to a security clearance.
However, the only way in which my son is "directly related" to my wife (who is a foreign national) is if you consider my wife and me married. And since the federal government has laws specifically saying that it will not treat us as married, I don't see why it should suddenly treat us as married only for purposes of complicating his security clearance.
The last time he got a security clearance, they did not ask for my wife's papers, because she was only my girlfriend at that time. So the only justification for asking for them this time is that we are married--a fact they otherwise refuse to recognize.
I am a HUGE proponent of same sex marriage rights, and I feel for you that you're having to deal with this, but I am genuinely curious...
if someone going through the same security clearance your son is going through had a parent who was in a heterosexual dating relationship, would that person be required to submit the parent's significant other on their security check? Or would it be the same thing, where the significant other wouldn't need to go through the check until after marriage? (does that make sense? I feel like it's a confusing question.)
@daydreamwanderer: Apparently, they are much less interested in someone dating a parent (opposite-sex or same-sex) than in someone married to a parent. The last time my son went through the security check, he disclosed that I was living with NotFroofy and that we were a couple. But the guy who came by our house to talk about the security clearance with me showed absolutely no interest in any information about NotFroofy.
Interesting. I guess they have to draw a line somewhere, and the 'legal line' is already drawn.
I'm glad they ARE recognizing your marriage though! I suppose DC is one place where it's currently a right. I wonder if they would treat it differently if you lived in a state where gay marriage still isn't allowed. Hmm.
Small steps, but at least they're in the right direction, right?
@daydreamwanderer: We don't actually live in DC. In Maryland, where we live, same-sex marriages cannot be performed, but the Attorney General has issued an opinion saying that state law would recognize same-sex marriages performed elsewhere. However, even in states where same-sex marriage is permitted, the federal government is prevented by the Defense of Marriage Act from recognizing them.
I am not sure if I understand?
My boyfriend is in the Air Force and I am not recognized by them due to me being just a girlfriend. When it came to security clearance he had to give them all my info because we live together but not because we are in a relationship. He had to do the same thing a few years ago when he lived with a friend of ours. If we were married he would have to show them my appropriate information.
I don’t mean any of this in a snarky way I am just a little confused.
@pasquel: I have no idea how far out they go in terms of relatives. (E.g., they would look at your boyfriend, but would they look at a parent's or sibling's bf/gf?) What is getting to me in this instances is that they didn't feel the need to get any information on NotFroofy when my son got a security clearance before we were married. So this time, it is apparently only the marriage that causes them to ask for the information--even though the marriage is otherwise not recognized by the federal government.
To be honest, I was a bit taken aback that they didn't ask for any information on NotFroofy the first time. Her immigration status was much less settled back then than it is now. (At the time, she had only a temporary student visa, not a green card.) So I would have fully understood if they had wanted the information from her then. What I don't understand is why the information was considered not worth asking for when we were living together, but worth asking for based on our marriage--yet the government won't recognize our marriage for any other purpose.
@2dBride: I understand your annoyance. You are denied the benefits of marriage and now this...your marriage shouldn't be a consideration, period, if it's "not recognized" by the agency doing the considering.
For example, it would be similar (?) if FI and I were treated as a "household" and negatively impacted once we are married. For the purpose of student financial aid, for example. I don't know what they will do actually in that department once we are married (and will we have to put "married" on our FAFSA?) but if they DO want us to be treated as married and it impacts us negatively I'll be pissed. They just can't have it both ways.
Okay maybe that was a bad analogy... but either way I get what you're saying!
@MsInterpret: Well, the "good" news is that you won't have to put that you are married on the FAFSA. But you're right--I would be thrilled if they would treat us as married for all purposes. It's treating us as married only when it's to our detriment that bothers me.
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For the nearly a decade that NotFroofy has been in this country, the federal government has declined to recognize the possibility that she and I might get married. We've been disadvantaged by this on everything from immigration rights to in-state tuition.
My son is just finishing up getting his security clearance, and he tells me today that he needs a copy of NotFroofy's green card faxed to the relevant authorities. I ask him why he needs this, since it was not requested the last time he got a security clearance. He responds, "Oh, but you weren't married then."
So let me get this straight: Any time being married could possibly benefit us, the federal government will not recognize our marriage. However, when our being married creates extra nuisance requirements, it is recognized?