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I would wait to make any decision until you have heard from the Bishop. How does your parish priest feel about doing the ceremony at this venue, many times the Bishop will go with the parish priest and let them make the call.
@tksjewelry: I hope you are right! The Priest is a close personal friend of my parents and would have no problem performing the ceremony at the venue
I don't believe that Catholic masses (or ceremonies to be considered valid by the church) can be performed outside unless it's on holy ground.
I wish I could be more helpful, but a convalidation is more meant to bring couples back into the church if they did not marry in the church initially, it really isn't there to make it so people can marry outside of the church and then get their Catholic wedding. We've had bees (such as Mrs. Socks) who have been married first (not necessarily in the Catholic church) and then had a wedding ceremony later. If you went with option #1, the civil ceremony can be flexible with wording. I don't know how your family will act, but I will guess that they will have wished to have gone to the sacramental ceremony, but will be happy to celebrate your marriage.
Your venue looks lovely though and I wish you the best of luck.
I voted for option 1 because that's what I'm doing. Actually I'm having the church wedding in the morning the day before, with immediate family and a few close friends in the wedding party. I'm worried about the same thing as you - that I won't feel like a "bride" for my outdoor venue because I will already have been officially married, per the state and per the church. But I figure my wedding is what I make of it. My friend pointed out there are many instances of situations like this. For example, many people have a religious/legal pre-wedding before going on their destination wedding. Also, in some cultures, it's typical for the religious leader to marry the couple first, in a private ceremony, then the big public ceremony takes place. These are the things I remind myself about to feel better about it! I considered convalidation, but my family much preferred to have everything done by the reception.
Tough choice, but I would strongly urge you not to do either. I had a civil ceremony a few months before the catholic one (with the big reception) and felt the civil ceremony was far more special. It could be that we felt we were settled/already married, and may be different for you since it will only have been a few hours, but in my opinion, nothing can replace saying your vows for the first time. I would do the ceremony in the church and then just enjoy your reception at the beautiful venue.
Also, if you do the civil at your venue, and do the church later, it'll be something hanging over your head to do after the wedding. For me, I just wanted to get on with being married. Just my opinion!
Beautiful venue!! It's a tough situation. I would go with option 1.
I voted for option 1 because it is the best of the three choices, but I think you should consider having your wedding in the church and then a beautiful reception at that venue. In my opinion, a venue is just a venue, but a church is where sacraments happen. It's also where possible future children will be baptised. You can have a ritual which is special to your and your FI or proclaim special vows you wrote for each other at the reception. I just think that a ceremony at church is important.
I agree with some of the previous posts. Being a catholic bride, I'd prefer to do the ceremony in the church and have the reception in the hacienda.
But if that's not gonna work for you and for some reason, you really want to have a ceremony in the hacienda, I would go with option one.
Good luck!
I'm cathoic and getting married outside as well. Go to rentapriest.com
They have real catholic priests that left for reasons like they wanted to get married. Plus the catholic church charges an arm and a leg for the ceremony in the church. You have to try and convince your local priest to come and do your ceremony if you're not having the ceremony at your local church (and of course pay him more) and you have the hassle of pre-cana. I'm taking the easy route out. No classes and no limo coordination.
We thoroughly enjoyed my pre-cana classes. It is also very important to me that someone who i have a relationship with perform the actual marriage.
I am having a "just vows" ceremony at the church with immediate family on Thursday evening. We are then having a "for show" ceremony followed by the reception at an outdoor venue on Saturday.
Is having only the reception at your desired venue an option? That way you could have the "best of both worlds" by getting married in the Church but having the brunch at the Hacienda.
@kitchenkoala: That's what I was going to suggest.
We had our civil ceremony and a week later had the convalidation in the church. To be perfectly honest, it was my favorite (and I'm not the Catholic one!). If I had it do over again, I'd do the chuch, then the reception.
If you absolutely can't....I dunno. Just do what you're planning on doing now with the wedding in the church and then the ceremony the next day. You can't please everyone here.
In regards to @posh_princess: suggestion, I would strongly discourage this. Rentapriest.com will not provide you with a recognized Catholic wedding or sacrament... it would be no different than getting a JOP to do the ceremony. Your marriage would not be recognized by the church and you would not be able to receive communion until you went through a convalidation anyways.
^ That is true.
Some people will tell you "once a priest always a priest," and that's not true (I'll explain in the next post). But what is never true is that a former priest can validly marry you in the eyes of the Catholic Church.
You might say "So what? I don't care if the Church recognizes my marriage." And that's fine if you're no longer Catholic. But if you're Catholic, it means that your invalid marriage puts you in an irregular state and you can not approach the sacraments until it is resolved by a convalidation. Besides, if you don't care about the Catholic Church's belief, why get married by a former priest? Having a former priest is just as valid as having a protestant minister, Justice of the Peace, or your uncle marry you.
You might say "Well, I'm not going to tell the Church. How would they know?" There are two problems there. First, you won't be able to have a Catholic sacramental record produced as the former priest can't register your marriage. Second, lying like this would be a sin.
Getting back to the issue that "once a priest always a priest" is not true. There are two seperate states related to clergy: ordination and clerical state. Most people think they're the same, but they are not. Ordination is necesary to be a clergy, but it is not sufficient, meaning other things are necessary.
Ordination can never be undone as it places an indelible mark on your soul. However, being a cleric (i.e. being a deacon or priest) can easily be undone, and Canon Law says:
Can. 292 A cleric who loses the clerical state according to the norm of law loses with it the rights proper to the clerical state and is no longer bound by any obligations of the clerical state, without prejudice to the prescript of ⇒ can. 291. He is prohibited from exercising the power of orders, without prejudice to the prescript of ⇒ can. 976. By the loss of the clerical state, he is deprived of all offices, functions, and any delegated power.
Which means that a former priest (a cleric that loses the clerical state) cannot perform any sacraments including marriage (exercise the power of orders). The only exceptions are in Can. 976 which says that under threat of imminent death, a former priest can hear Confession.
The best example I can think of is a lawyer. Passing the bar is necesary to be a lawyer, but it's not the only thing that's necessary. To be able to practice law, you have to maintain good standing with your states' bar. If you leave the bar (either honorably by withdrawing or dishonrably by being disbarred), you can call yourself a former lawyer, and you do not forget the information you learned in law school, but you cannot practice law. Any legal work you attempt to file for a client will be declined and you will end up with serious legal issues because, despite being a former lawyer, you do not have the facility to exercise law. Any of your client's documents that required certification by a lawyer will be invalid.
Me and my fiance are doing the same thing! We are doing your option #1 Our Venue is gorgeous. We are having a informal mass at church with just his best man and my MOH.... then proceed to our rehersal dinner (not tell anyone we got married) and then head to the venue to that night (apart from my fiance) then the next day will be the whole big Shebang! :o)
Here is a link to our venue http://www.buhlmansion.com
We enjoyed our Pre-Cana classes.
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Hey Hive!
I have found the venue of my dreams for my morning ceremony & brunch reception, its a beautiful 19th century Hacienda with gorgeous architecture and grounds. Only one problem, as a Catholic Bride (and Groom) if I am to have my ceremony at this venue the Catholic Church will not recognize the marriage. I have already moved gears towards receiving a Dispense from the Bishop but in case that it gets rejected I am contemplating the following 2 options:
1) Receive the Catholic Sacrament of marriage on Friday Night in casual dress with only our parents as witnesses and then have a formal civil ceremony at the venue Saturday Morning
2) Have the formal civil ceremony as planned (at the venue) and plan to receive a convalidation of the marriage at a later date
I am afraid Option 1 will make the formal ceremony meaningless since we will already be married and are just putting on a show for other people and Option 2 will be frowned upon by our conservative catholic Puerto Rican families who will consider a civil ceremony a great offense and some will probably refuse to attend.
What do you think? Have any brides been in a similar situation?
I have included photos of the venue which has made this decision so difficult.