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I think a prenup protects your part of the assets in case your spouse gets sued, doesn't it? That's one reason to have it..
I say yay. It makes sense to protect yourself, just in case. It's hard to think of your relationship ever coming to an end, but it happens. And in that event, especially if there are children involved, i'd rather have a piece of paper that outlines the rules for the divorce than an emotionally-charged free for all.
What I don't like is when having/writing/discussing a prenup becomes a psychological battle between a soon-to-be-wed couple and one holds it over the other's head. That's no way to begin a marriage. But an open, honest conversation should be had about them, and if you agree that it's right for you, do it.
FWIW, I've asked my FI at least twice if he wants one, and he has said absolutely not both times. I'll bring it up once more, explain it again, and then let it go. But if he were to agree to one, I'd totally sign. (FI has historically made at least as much as I have, and until this year his savings were more than double mine. So it's not "my" money I'm worried about protecting, but "his".)
I am totally for pre-nups! I'm more for it in the pre-relationship aspect. For example, I am the "breadwinner" in my relationship. I worked my butt off to have what I have now. At one point I was working 3 jobs. Before FI and I got engaged I not only paid off a new car but I bought a condo. Plus I have finances secure for retirement. I am by no means rich. I pay the bills and save for retirement and have a lil' extra for fun. I am middle class, living comfortably. Mainly I would want a pre-nup to reassure that if something were to happen I would still have my retirement money...and my house. And he would have his retirement money all to himself. Neither of us would walk away with more than what we came into the relationship with.
As my lawyer puts it, a prenup gives you the opportunity to plan how you would split up your assets during a divorce while you still love each other. I have retirement savings, a condo, and some other assets that I worked hard for, he has a business that he's built from the ground up. I want both of us to keep the fruits of our labor.
It was a little stressful, there's still an adversarial tinge to it no matter how ok you both are with it. But I think a lot of people forget that marriage isn't just about love, it's a legal contract between people: the combination and protection of assets. When entering into a contract, you have to evaluate the implications for yourself and protect yourself in the case of unfortunate circumstances.
Another thing to remember is that a prenup doesn't just protect the assets you have now. If you stand to inherit from your parents (or anyone else), that is an important asset to protect.
nay...we are catholic and we just took our oath with the priest a few weeks ago for our marriage application paperwork...we had to promise not to make a pre-nup. the reason, i think, for no pre-nup is that it is kind of like you don't have full faith in your marriage...i think that's what the priest said. pre-nup or not is up to you...for us, we are pretty young and we just don't have any money or assets!
I don't think there's anything wrong with pre-nups.. My fiance and I are not having one though,
We both just graduated and are joining the air force as officers. I have a lot of student debt, but I was the bread winner/ student while we were both attending college (he was a sports scholarship and could not work). We've decided that if we did split, everything should be split evenly.
If you have something before the marriage, I can see why you would want a pre-nup. You never know. In our case, it would just be another expense. We're literally starting fresh and building up our finances.
no idea, i am all for it, but FH doesn't want one...but he's the one w/ all the money now...as i'm the one w/ a HUGE debt from student loans...however I have a WAYYYYYYYYY higher earning potential.... but he's smarter so he has a lot of potential too. It's a hard one since money's not that big of a deal (but then again that might be b/c i've never had/have any....).
We had no reason to have one, but I wouldn't have minded if my husband had wanted me to sign one. He would have been fair, I know that about him. I didn't work while we were dating for the most part, just working as a nanny, so all I brought into our marriage was my good looks and charm. I am 6 years younger than my husband, who was a year away from making partner at his law firm. Had he already been a partner, maybe it would have been different, but oh well. Now, I get it all! ;) So he better be nice to me! Our best friends have a pre-nup and she's a minister! LOL He came into the marriage with a LOT of family money and it was more about that than anything. They didn't want his parents or family businesses or money to become part of a divorce if it ever happen. They've been married for 15 years now and have two children, so it's void now anyway for the most part. It's not dooming your marriage to fail, it's just being smart. Now, if I was marrying somebody and they were being a total a$$ about it, I would think twice.
I definitely have a LOT more assets than my fiance, but I would never dream of a pre-nup! We are committing for life, no questions. I know people get divorced all the time, but we are not those people. I can't even think of a "just in case" circumstance that would cause us to split. If you can, then maybe you should reconsider your "commitment."
I have friends who call me naive for thinking this way; I think it's naive to make a lifetime commitment that you don't have 100% confidence in.
This is the way I look at it...a prenup is just a piece of paper that will collect dust because if you are so confident in your marriage, there will never be a use for it. Divorces do happen and people usually don't plan for them. You never know what will happen down the road. You may know for sure you will never leave your husband, but you honestly never know what others will do. It's just a way to protect you in the future like how you get insurance in case your home ever burns down, for example. No one plans for that, but life happens, so it's better to be prepared for anything. We are getting one and I couldn't care less, I'm confident in my marriage and know we'll never need it, but it's there to protect both of us in the end.
My husband and I did a co-habitation agreement when we bought our house (before we were engaged) which is basically a pre-nup for common-law people because we had significant assets that we wanted protected should something happen between us, and the house was purchased in his name even though I was paying the downpayment and half the payments (long story).
We are married now, and the co-habitation agreement is still in effect, but we probably wouldn't have done it for our marriage because divorce is not an option for us (we both believe that marriage is a lifetime commitment, and if it's not working, you get help, and make it work)
I think pre-nups are a good choice for some people. It depends on your situation. We aren't doing one because we are both starting out in about the same place with similar salaries. If we got divorced after having children, then I think our biggest issue for the divorce would be custody and child support, which is something that you can't plan for before you even have kids really.
TOTALLY FOR IT!
I've also learned I will never buy any kind of significant purchase with anyone. ie: A house. We have had legal documents drawn up as we are both paying on our home and have put an investment into it. Our pre-nup states should we ever split, each of us is entitled to 1/2 of the house. No questions asked.
Once you've signed your name on the dotted line, you are financially responsible for the debt of a home even if a divorce occurs and your divorce decree states you aren't and the other party is. And a quit claim deed only relieves you of the possession of the home. It does NOT relieve you from the debt so you can go on with your life and purchase another home. No, what it does is show that you still are financially responsible for a home that you have no legal right to should you want to sell, reside, etc. The bank can still come and seize your personal property/possesions should you or your spouse/significant other default on the home loan.
I'm witnessing this nightmare first hand, and it's a shame that 30 years into a marriage, the wife (or husband) can be left totally destroyed because they weren't legally informed and believed in "forever". "Forever" lasted 20 years. Then "Forever" was over and it's on to trying to rebuild a life after 20 years of marriage and 2 grown kids.
I personally believe people need to realize that even though you love your future spouse to death, things WILL and CAN happen. Maybe not tomorrow, next week or even next year. But it's not uncommon for people to get divorced 20 or 30 years later. IT HAPPENS.
The best advice is to think of it as insurance for the future. As it was stated above, it can gather dust and never be used. But just in case.. it's there to protect you. Even for people who believe divorce is not an option. You never know what can happen years down the line.
I think it totally depends on the couple and their circumstances. My fiance and I will not be getting a prenup because neither one of us has any assets, since he's a poor med. school student and I just graduated college. But I do understand where some couples, like celebrities, would need a prenup. I think if either one of you has any sort of assests before you get married, then you need a prenup just in case something were to happen. I know it's not romantic but it's better safe than sorry.
One other thing to consider is that a pre-nup not only protects your assets, but if your family has any type of trust or jointly shares assets, it protects all those involved as well. For example, my family has a family trust, in which we all hold percentages of several large investments. When the FI and I get married, he effectively becomes "part of the family", and has the right to claim ownership (in the case of a divorce, or death) to some of those percentages. So, a prenup in which he legally agrees not to claim any ownership to any percentages of the trust not only protects my portion (if and when the trust is liquidated), but also the other family members that own percentages.
So, if you jointly own any assets with anyone besides your FI, consider signing a prenup, if only for the other person!
If you have any other questions, consult a lawyer as early in the process as possible. They'll be able to give the best answer for your situation. Even if you don't "feel" that you need a prenup, there may be other reasons (besides the one I just laid out) that you should consider protecting your assets. Prenups are not necessarily about shielding your assets in case of a divorce, but any other people who are involved in those assets as well.
Hope that helps!
"I know people get divorced all the time, but we are not those people. I can't even think of a "just in case" circumstance that would cause us to split. If you can, then maybe you should reconsider your "commitment."
I have friends who call me naive for thinking this way..."
Ignorance is bliss...until it isn't.
I would reiterate two points. One I think that everyone should consult the law of the state where they are marrying and/or will reside as each state's laws on marital property differ. For example, many states (but not all) do not look to property acquired prior to marriage when disposing of property during divorce, so it really all depends on where you live. Secondly, if you are going to have a pre-nup drafted make sure both of you are represented by separate counsel or at least have each of you have an experienced family law attorney take a look at what has been drafted.
As for me personally, I'm not really into the idea of them, but each person is different.
100% for "prenups" (they are really called antenuptial agreements)--or any kind of premarital agreement. Really, it isn't so much about my or FI's assets--it's more that I've seen what happens to even the most amicable divorces (I'm a divorce attorney!) once you do the "I want this" and "you can't have that". Our agreement will simply state that in the event of a divorce we will under no circumstances go to litigation; rather we will engage in mediation or some other sort of alternative disupte resolution. Additionally, all inherited family assets/heirlooms will return to the family from which it came.
The reason we are doing this: if there was ever a time to determine how we split up, it is now, while we love each other, have no hurt feelings, and truly want what is fair. We are trying to save ourselves any unnecessary hurt & anguish that we may be too emotional to identify later.
I've come under alot of heat from my married friends for this, saying that this is a bad way to start a marriage, that it implies a lack of faith, blah blah... but surprisingly no heat from my or his family or our unmarried friends. Go figure.
Edited to add: Absolutely consult the laws in your state to learn what happens to your assets once you are married. In some states EVERYTHING is split 50-50 regardless of where it came from, before or after the marriage! In some states you only get what you put into it. And in other states it is somewhere in between.
One more thing, just to clairify my earlier post. We have a pre-nup for assets we both had before we were together and then a legal document for things we have / are purchasing together. Granted it may cost more up front for this type of "insurance" but is totally worth it in the long run should it ever be needed.
and "MissChickie"... your post is right on target. How I wish people would understand that some states say there is no such thing as "personal property" whether you paid for it all yourself (even down to a pair of shoes, YES.. a pair of shoes YOU purchased with YOUR money can be split because it's "marital property" according to some states) Everything can and does become "Marital Property" It really is no joke on how vicious and nasty divorces can get. It sounds funny but when someone is angry and upset things DO happen. Hence the phrase
"Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned" Sometimes it applies to men as well.
this is indeed a hot topic and very emotionally charged.
for us at this point in life, we dont believe its necessary. i understand the "insurance mentality" yet at the same time this does not marry with the "commitment mentality".
there are those who have assets, family inheritances, businesses, ect and in these situations i might consider the topic differently. for us, we have nothing and stand to inherit nothing, so we don't have these considerations. being at ground zero together with the "commitment mentality" we have no reason to pursue this.
if things were to go unexpectantly, we would simply split it evenly.
Amysue has a very good point - the prenup IS NOT just something that tells how property is divided in divorce. It also delineates how assets are owned during marriage. If you or your FI has your own company, or has aspirations of that, or works in a field where you might be likely to be sued, legal separation of assets can prevent both of you from losing everything in a lawsuit. This will be a huge advantage - regardless of divorce!! Think about it - if you're married, with kids, and no thought of getting divorced, and your spouse is sued, any assets you separately own are protected. It maked a lot of sense in that kind of case for you to separately own the house, the car, your own 401k...
As far as the laws concerning community property, they are different in every state. And the assets you wholely own before marriage can end up as community property, depending upon how you managed them, so it's worth understanding the law. As far as inheritance, it's completely possible for you parents or grandparents to leave you assets in a manner that keeps them as separate property, and if that is a concern, you should talk to your family about setting things up that way. My family owns quite a bit of property, and my dad has already set things up so that any inheritance is mine and my sister's alone, regardless of marital status. Obviously you need to consult a good attorney to make this happen, but I think the fee is worth the peace of mind.
I see a lot of people who are saying that they don't believe in divorce, marriage is forever, etc. The thing is that it's not. No matter what you hope, it just doesn't aways happen that way. My husband is divorced from his high school sweetheart, who he was married to for 7 years after going to college together and putting themselves through med school and law school and you know what...she decided that she likes women. After they were together for 16 years. My husband tried to make the marriage work and he didn't believe in divorce (still doesn't), but things do happen. So, just a thought. Nobody can predict the future...or apparently who is going to come out of the closet! We're all friends now and I bet we may be one of the few divorced couples with new spouses that hang out and send each other gifts! :)
I am for one however, I'm not getting one. I have more money than my fiancee but it is going to be a down payment on our house one da, which he will be working hard on, also there are so many loop holes and after 10 years I don't believe they're valid anyway so unless he wanted one I'm fine with it.
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yay or nay and why?
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