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I've let it go for over a year, but honestly this is making me CRAZY. I hate it when people act like the only reason to not go medicated is pain. Do you really think I WANTED that pain? I had a 8lb8oz bigged baby, lol, and I had a previous back injury. Saying things like "you don't get a badge at the end for going med free" is honestly insulting.
If someone said something so flippant about other mama choices, it would be considered snarky and reported. I know there are some people on this board that did their research and still wanted an epi. That is fine. I don't diss my friends that used pain meds. However, do your research and show some respect for women who choose this route. I honestly used to think home birthers were nutty & that I'd have an epidural UNTIL I got pregnant and realized it wasn't just about pain vs. no pain. Plus, after one hospital birth and a horrible tear, I would definitely consider doing home birth next time. We are lucky to live right by a hospital, and I would make sure a qualified nurse midwife was there.
I am not going to say it, but think of what the flip side is to this argument and know that someone stating that as anti-medication would be seen as rude. I have been called "crazy" by people for not getting an epi (not here), but yet people I know that had unnecessary interventions leading to an emergency c-section are given sympathy [edit for clarity: by the same people calling me "crazy"]. I know most people don't think about it that way when they make such statements, so consider this your PSA. :)
/end rant
edit: add'l bolding for clarity
I dont get it either when people make comments like that "you don't get a badge at the end for going med free" as though we are all in this huge motherhood competition and we trying to get trophies and badges. I think people just get defensive if they are going a different route and feel the need to be snarky to people who would like to go natural
@cannotwait: I understand what you're saying. It is very rude to call someone crazy for choosing an unmedicated child birth. However, isn't it presumptuous to assume that everyone's interventions are "unnecessary" and are the cause of emergency c-sections? I feel like a lot of women get judgment regardless of what they choose. We don't know the circumstances of everyone's lives and I think it hurts others feelings to be told that their "interventions" weren't necessary or that if they made better decisions they wouldn't have a c-section. C-sections are needed, maybe not 1/3 in births but it's still up to the mother and the doctor and any judgment on each side should stop.
I'm saying people that I *know* where this was the case. She wanted her kid to have a certain birthday and there was no medical reason. So, maybe I am judgy, but this is someone I personally KNOW not a generalization.
For what it is worth, my sister's kids were both c-sections, and I think it totally made sense due to MEDICAL reasons.
@cannotwait: I'm curious as to what you mean by "unnecessary" interventions that led to emergency c-sections?
I could care less if someone goes med-free or not. I went with meds with my son, still thought my leg was going to break. (Think of a green twig when you bend it and it won't break. THAT was my leg and how it felt to me. And I have an abnormally HIGH threshold for pain. And that's coming from a er tech as well as nurses and a doctor or two.)
@beekiss: agreed. Every person's situation is different. I had to have a c-section with my son because a joint was out of place, preventing a natural birth. My daughter was a c-section by choice, but no pain meds and no pain.... and ended up with bruised ribs when they did the c-section.
Two different kids, two completely different scenarios and end results.
Does it REALLY matter how the child was born? As long as it was born and cared for afterwards? Throwing around accusations, opinions towards one way or another, etc isn't going to make a difference towards what happened.
This is as productive as arguing between bottle and breastfeeding (to each their own, in my opinion) and working moms vs stay at home moms.
I agree there's lots of good reasons to have a non-medicated birth. I got an epidural and my contractions stopped and my little girls heart did respond different to contractions when I was on pitocin. But it all worked out just fine, I got mine when I was pretty far along but still had hours to go, and it was a personal choice not because it was necessary. Though the pitocin I didn't want, just got tired of dealing with the dr pestering and ended up taking the chances, and it worked out for us, but I can see why not everyone would make that choice.
@cannotwait: Isn't having that opinion the same as what you were ranting about?
Sometimes, there CAN be a medical reason even without the person saying it.
child is too big (or they think it will be too big)
mother's body isn't "designed" for a vaginal birth
baby isn't positioning itself correctly
infections
Those are just SOME of the reasons. It's possible the person didn't want to tell the REAL reason and picked one that was less personal. MAYBE. It's possible she just wanted a specific date, but unless you know what that office/doctor's policy is on c-sections, you can't know for 100% certain. Each office and state and insurance has different policies regarding c-sections.
on the flip side of your argument I dont like when people think that the onlyl reason to go medicated is to get out of the pain part of labor and delivery. My cousin has a heart condition and due to that they wanted her to have meds so that her labor and delivery were as stress free on her body as possible. At least that she was aware of. Obviously your body goes through the same process whether you feel it or not but her reaction is what they were trying to control. I had meds with my son simply because I have no pain tolerance. The smallest amount of pain freaks me out. I did do my research and all that and I chose what I wanted for myself. You mentioned someone who chose to have her child on a certain day for a reason that it sounds like you didnt think was good enough. Bottom line is, its no one's business or place to judge when it comes to something like the birth of your own child. Did it really affect your life that she chose a c-section to get a certain birth date? not really. Did it affect anyone else besides me and my child what I chose for my birth and delivery? nope. I guess I just feel like you are doing the very thing that you say drives you crazy, making assumptions based on someones choice.I could be wrong here so forgive me if i am. there are pro's and cons to both having meds and not having meds. the choice is for each person to decide on thier own, the reason really shouldnt concern anyone else.
I don't really have a personal experience to share but I think having a baby no matter what way you do it is pretty amazing. I realize its a fact of life that women have babies but it's still amazing! When I think about having kids the part that scares me is how I'm gonna get the thing out of me! Pain or no pain, c-section or not, you are still popping something out of somewhere and I'll show respect to any women who does that!
The difference is I don't go around saying that GENERALLY or to people that make that decision. I don't say all c-sections are unnecessary. How do you know that this person's was necessary? I've had people bring it up to me, without knowing I am pro-med-free, that they did c-section out of convenience. The person that I know that was induced is very blunt and is family. She said that nothing was medically wrong. Her same doctor later got herself induced 2 weeks before the due date for convenience. These are their words, brought up by THEM, not me.
May I ask, when do you feel c-sections are necessary? I really want to ask other women what their opinion on this is. The answer is, no one knows but the patient and the doctor and I'm a-okay with that.
Be proud that you gave birth without medication, but not everyone wants that. I think doctors and midwives should be trusted and I feel a huge disconnect between certain groups of women b/c they don't trust their doctor, or they're not comfortable approaching their doctor with what they want which is why I really love Doulas b/c they can help with that.
Yes, I would like to give birth without augmentation and medication. It would be great, but at the end of the day, I'm going to go with my intuition and that is to trust my doctor or midwife's advice. I probably wouldn't start discussing inductions until after 41 weeks and closer to 42 weeks. I would labor at home as long as possible, and drive to the hospital in transition. But water breaking before 36 weeks and being in labor for more than a day at home, running a fever, are things that would encourage me to go to a hospital immediately.
I think a better rant would be that many women do not do research and that's legitimate. And I agree with @Zinzerena: in that these are debates I've seen on blogs and message boards about SAHM v. WOHM, Bottlefeeding v. Breastfeeding, etc aren't always productive. I think we should all respect what others want.
I have to say that I love that most women have a choice in how they can birth, and I don't support any legislation that opposes any choice whether that be outlawing homebirths or taking the option of elective c-section away. Women should have a choice.
Usually if it is an emergency c section, it is absolutely necessary. Otherwise it would be called a sceduled c section.
I see what you mean, by natural, and the comments. But I don't think people mean it like you are actually crazy. Just more like, you must have a great pain tolerance, superwoman kind of crazy. Because really, I didn't want the epidural, or demerol. But I couldn't handle the pain like I thought I would be able to. I literally felt like I was going to die, so I took the epidural about 18 hours into my labour.
So when I learn that woman were able to go completely natural, I do think they are crazy (tough, strong, superwoman) , in a good way, definitely not in a bad way.
@stardustintheeyes: Thank you for saying it so succinctly and politely.
OP, you are doing the very thing you say you hate others doing. I respect your frustration and desire to vent about others' comments about your own med-free birth, but my sympathies evaporated when you pushed on with judging others' choices. It doesn't matter that the person openly talks about how it was not medically necessary; that is completely irrelevant. It is your tone of disdain and clear judgment against her that I think people are focusing on.
I don't see why its anybody's business why any woman chooses to birth the way she does. Who cares WHY she does it??? Its her body and her baby, and its f'ed up that anyone would judge her for what she did, regardless. As long as it doesn't put either life in danger, its no ones business
@Ryna I think you hit the nail on the head when you said it doesn't matter how the child is born. I think that is ultimately what the OP was trying to get at. I read that she feels that people are looking at her as "crazy" for doing it pain free. They are making her feel less important than someone elses decision. I agree with her that that isn't right. We are all allowed to make our own choices and shouldn't be looked down upon as long as the result is accomplished (if you NEED a C-Section and refuse an epidural then that is a problem).
I did a pain medication free labor and delivery as well. I hate needles and I couldn't imagine having one near me. So there was no hope for an epidural.
I never said all c-sections were bad or that no one should get an epidural. I encourage people to re-read my post. This post is not pro-natural. It is anti-comments like "there is no reason to be in pain...you are crazy to go med free...no badge"...etc. The only reason I brought up the c-section of this ONE lady was in CONTRAST. Yes, obviously the c-section was an emergency...but usually after being on pitocin for 24+ hrs isn't this usually the case? I've never heard of someone being on pitocin for more than about 24 hrs without either giving birth vaginally or needing a c-section. Granted, I don't know if there is a "rule" about it, but I'm guessing it falls into the "deliver within 24 hours of your water breaking" rule of most hospitals.
While everyone has the right to choose how they want to have their child and that choice should be respected, things don't actually work out that way.
And I agree with the OP that it is very annoying when people make comments about how you want a "badge of honor" or a "trophey" for going med-free. That isn't why people choose that route and to insinuate that it is is insulting.
I think it's a very personal decision and everyone should live and let live. I will say that going natural is very trendy right now and I feel women are guilted into it sometimes. Make the decision that is best for you, medicated or not. As for the "badge" comment, I don't know the context but I do agree that the women I know that gave birth naturally tend to mention it. OFTEN. So in my experience there is a bit of arrogance surrounding it. Again, I don't have an opinion either way but judgement goes both ways and in my experience it's more often come from the natural birthers.
I do agree with that. Every woman I have ever met that went natural has mentioned it to me quite a few times. More so than woman who have had c sections, inductions, or epidurals.
um, wow, I said her interventions were unnecessary...as in they were not medically necessary...I never said she sucked or was a bad mom. Yet, I have been alluded to be arrogant & presumptious...hrmmmmm
@NJmeetsBX: I agree with that. My FSIL is sometimes arrogant about her natural births, but it's also a very empowering experience for some. I wouldn't want to diminish that in any way. But I feel like, it's one of those things that's deeply personal to each woman and I think I start getting frustrated when people call others interventions unnecessary b/c we don't actually know. We weren't the patient or the doctor.
@cannotwait: You picked a bad example, that's all. You set up your contrast as though she somehow didn't deserve sympathy and how it was not a MEDICAL reason (which does imply that it is less than). You did not set it up as every birth is difficult and has different circumstances. I can't know your intention, but that's how it came across. Your later post is much clearer, but maybe next time just say that without ALSO commenting on another person's choices.
It is anti-comments like "there is no reason to be in pain...you are crazy to go med free...no badge"...etc.
Well, I agree that impying that a woman who wants a natural med-free birth was shooting for a medal is pretty insulting, but I think a few other things are going on here when people say that.
First, some (certainly not all, but some) will have a natural childbirth and then lecture other women about their choice to have meds or a c-section. Not saying you would do this, but some women do, and the comments rankle and that's where the 'well here's your medal' comments come in. Really, every woman should do what she is comfortable with and not make any snide comments about what other women choose to do.
Second, I think the comments might also come in when a woman is determined to make it through labor med-free, or puts off an induction/ c section after being advised to have one, and she is at the point where she or the baby is in danger. Then those comments come out, not as a slam to other women who did have a med free birth, but as reassurance that the woman is not a bad mother for ultimately agreeing to other methods.
I am one of those ppl that wanted to have an Epi because I didn't want to feel anything. Hell with my second one the Epi and the DR were waiting on ME to get there. My DR told them I was to feel no pain. ( even if I hadn't I would have anyway because I had terrible BP with both and it was a way to calm me and help that...but I did CHOOSE it)
My older sister had my nephew without meds and I've told her lots of times that she's nuts...do I really mean it? No! But, that's how it is sometimes you joke.
My other sister also had an Epi and no one has given her grief as they haven't given me any.
It doesn't matter how the baby comes into the world as long as they are healthy.
Judging on either side isn't needed or fair. It's each persons right to make that choice.
@Amaryllis: if i could have "liked" your comment I so would have. Agreed completely.
my bff went epi-free and to me, that's totally courageous. It wasn't her plan, they just waited too long, but I don't think LESS of people who either do or don't use an epi. It is what it is, and each person has their own views on what is best for them and their child - not my place to preach to anyone about what's right or wrong. Go you for going w/o it!
For the record: I WANTED a c-section with my son. EVERY other female on my mother's side had c-sections.... do you really think the odds were in my favor?
Also, I've only heard people say they wished they had a "pain free" labor. NO, YOU DO NOT. NONE of the doctors belived I was in labor, or even the nurses AT the hospital the night I GAVE BIRTH to my daughter. Also, the epidural did NOTHING when I was in labor with my son... and I was being given MORPHINE. My leg STILL felt like it was trying to break, but couldn't.
To just about everyone I've talked to you HAVE TO HAVE PAIN TO BE IN LABOR.
Do I want a freaking trophy because I had no pain? NO. My daughter was FOUR WEEKS PREMATURE and in the NICU for a week because I HAD NO PAIN and was in labor for over a week. Yes, a week.
Also, I had NO MEDS with my daughter. I went in at 6pm and she was born shortly after 11pm. (I think... I was so out of it, the hospital could've been burning down and I wouldn't have known. Or cared. Damned meds, doctors and nurses who were pissed because I didn't have pain....)
There is ALWAYS a flip-side to everything. I would have happily traded my leg-pain (and it was ONLY my leg) for a c-section. It also would've been better on my son, health wise had they allowed me to have a scheduled c-section.
I could easily be on the "med free" side and pro-elective c-sections BUT I prefer to think everyone should make their OWN decisions. If you're 18 and older, you're an adult. You can decide what's best for you, the baby, and your wallet.
eta: Both kids were c-sections. My daughter was elective due to having a previous c-section.
My mother gave birth naturally to all three of us, her reason being that she felt drugs and other procedures were bad for the baby.
I also find it offensive when people say "you don't get a badge at the end for doing it natural." It is insulting to insinuate the only value in natural birth is to look like a toughie.
My stance is "different strokes" for different folks. It is really none of my business. I never ask people how they gave birth, and I hope I do not get any advice unless I ask for it.
So far it seems to me that according to weddingbee if you have a natural birth and are proud of it then you are automatically trying to win a trophy and are obviously looking down on other medicated bees. But if you are medicated and proud of it then thats ok for you to make snarky comments to the naturals. Just feels like a double standard going on.
People choose to do things for different reasons. It doesn't matter what others say. Unless you are unhappy with your choice, don't let others bring you down.
this post is super interesting...
i absolutely agree with others who say its each woman's decision to make with her ob/midwife/partner etc. no one should be made to feel they have to birth a certain way to avoid judgement or rude comments.
the crazy comments and judgement DEFINITELY go both ways, though. my experience has been the exact opposite as the OP. i think it depends who you surround yourself with...like @NJmeetsBX said, natural birth, hiring a doula, etc is becoming more and more popular these days, and i feel like i have to justify my decision to get an epi way more often than my peers (at work, at yoga class, etc) who have had natural births have to defend theirs. it might have something to do with the fact that i work in public health, and most of my friends/colleagues are pretty progressive when it comes to reproductive health/childbirth -- but women who give birth naturally usually get MORE props in my experience.
also, i dont think its so black and white either. we tend to talk about 'natural birth' as solely med free, but many women who get pain meds during labor appreciate, are educated about, and practice natural methods to prepare for childbirth (like yoga, aromatherapy, water birth, doulas, etc) and have much respect for natural techniques. its silly to discuss as either/or cause there is so much room for blending whats right for the individual.
really, we all need to stop judging eachother's birthing decisions, stay educated about our bodies and our options, and be confident about our choices (not to say anyone here is or isnt, but in an ideal world this debate wouldnt be necessary)!
@bells:Actually, from what I've seen, if you're mother, no matter what, you will be judged for your choices. Regardless of what they are.
I think what rubs me the wrong way about your original post is this...
Saying things like "you don't get a badge at the end for going med free" is honestly insulting.
Because, honestly, you don't. I think most of the time people are saying this to Mom's who are made to feel like they failed for getting an epidural so that they DON'T feel like they failed. It really irks me when people belittle other people for their choices, especially moms, because frankly it really isn't any of our business what any other woman chooses to do with her body. Yes I think women who choose c-sections just for a date or just because are not making a decision I would make, but it really doesn't matter because I am not them. I wanted a med free birth, but if I had tried for much longer, I would have put my baby and myself in distress, and I still have some guilt about that. I agree with other posters that sometimes women who have had babies "naturally" have a way of making other moms feel slightly inferior, even if it isn't intentional. I definitely think it's a feat to go through an unmedicated child birth, having gone through excruciating back labor myself, but I also think it's a miracle to bring a child into the world no matter what the method.
Edit: I TOTALLY agree MUI831!!!
Hey, hey, hey... Remember when we first started this board and we all pledged to stay away from MommyWars (TM)? This whole discussion kind of seems that way. Unmedicated is better. No. Medicated is better. Unmedicated moms want a badge of honor. Medicated moms weren't educated enough. Elective C sections are crazy.
We all have different reasons for the choices we make and frequently there is a really good reason for whatever it is we end up with.
Went med free? Good job. Had meds? Congratulations on a pain free birth. Had to get a C-section? I'm glad you and your baby are healthy and your outcomes were good.
There's enough judgement in the world about us moms, so let's try not to judge each other! We're a team!
I say "they don't hand out trophies" all the time, because it's true. I sometimes see when the judgement starts and words like "Unneccessary" or "I didn't want my baby to be all drugged up" start flying around or "I felt my contractions" it makes me want to say "What do you want, a cookie? Congrats, you managed to do something billions of women have done since humans existed."
Plus you could have the best, fastest, easiest childbirth ever, (or maybe you suffered like a champ, med free and had 80 gazillion stitches and broken blood vessels) but PARENTING is still the hardest job in the world. Moms should stick together.
@bells: Why not just be proud that you delivered a baby? When you say, "I am so proud I went natural or no meds" (as a friend of mine mention 4-5 times after she gave birth), it does sound like you want a pat on the back. What other reason is there to discuss your birth plan at that point? Baby's already here. I don't mean you in particular just stating a general "you."
everyone, this is not meant to be a debate about medicated vs non-medicated...it is calling out the double standard, since I JUST saw on here someone (and often do) acting like epi vs natural is about pain vs less/no pain. WB does seem skewed on this one.
IRL, I have never said anything negative to my friends who had epis/c-sections, etc. However, they have said stuff to ME. Ultimately, I do think most mommy wars always boil down to "it's their kid..." but in fact we all have a limit on what we think is OK....is doing an elective c-section at 30 weeks bc you don't want to get bigger OK? I think almost everyone on here would say "no, that is not OK". So, we just draw the line at different places. I also don't see how someone being proud of their birth experience diminishes your birth experience. If someone runs a marathon and I run a 5K, I am still proud of them and myself.
If you have friends that brag all the time about going natural, then I can see why that would get annoying. I, however, usually don't bring it up in real life. If my friends ask me then I am more than happy to tell them my reasons, but I don't go around wearing my "badge". :)
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