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OK, this might come off harsh, which is not my intention, but it has to be said -- You give me the impression that you sort of do not want to marry him; you want to marry the version of him you are hoping he'll turn into by fixing these (honestly important) things. I am not saying it is wrong to think that way, and I think that a post like this is definitely a step in self-awareness and whatnot, but honestly, it does not sound like you are at all fulfilled and you have concerns about the future. You want to work on it, you are trying your hardest, you are willing to go to counseling, and he is not trying at all. As it stands right now, is that what you want? What if he never changes? Sure, what if he changes and there was drama for nothing, but realistically, if this were as good as it were going to get, would you still go through with the wedding? Have you thought about telling him your concerns exactly as you've laid them out here and just telling him that if he is not willing to work on them, you would seriously consider calling off/postponing the wedding?
My ex and I had a similar problem with intimacy (though not due to weight). I asked him what I could do to help; I asked him to get himself help. Nothing. It was not the only factor in our breakup, but when taken with other problems, it and his unwillingness to work on changing it certainly helped me make my decision.
I am sorry you are going through this, and I really hope that he realizes how important these things are and will work on them.
How comfortable are you with the preacher? Perhaps you could talk to them one-on-one if that's who you agreed to talk to. It sounds like you guys have some talking to do and it's best not to wait until marriage for talking.
I think the best thing here is to sit him down and talk through each and every issue in one setting. Let him know that unless you guys go for marriage counseling, the wedding just isn't going to happen. If you're unhappy now, getting married isn't going to change anything, unfortunately.
Another thing to think about is that he may be depressed. You mentioned that he gained quite a bit of weight in the last year, he's not very...ahem...active in the bedroom, so maybe he's feeling pretty down on himself that he can't make you happy. It's almost as if he's stuck in a bit of a rut. I definitely think marriage counseling will help, but you have to let him know that you're 100% serious about this. I don't think he gets that your entire relationship is currently in trouble. Sit him down and let him know that and give him a chance to fix it. I know you said you talked about each individual thing in the past, but for him, those might not be deal breakers. It sounds like all of them together, they're deal breakers for you. So definitely try to get him to go to counseling and see what you guys can do.
I hope everything works out for you, and keep us posted on the situation. We'd love to see you around the hive more :o)
People are package deals. If he's not going to change now, he's not going to change once you're married (but I have a feeling you already know this). Has it always been like this?
My suggestion would be to postpone the wedding (I know it's a loss of funds, but perhaps this would be worth it to help get things in order). Also, there could be a chemical imbalance that's causing depression. When was the last time he went in for a physical?
I just want to address a portion of this. He might not be depressed or stressed, that frequency might be utterly normal for him. There are plenty of women for whom that is normal. We just don't tend to think of men falling in that same range but in reality human beings of both gender are natrually all over the range of frequencies. It is especially hurtful for a relationship when it's a man because everyone thinks it is abnormal and doesn't know how to react.
While there is never a way of predicting the future or ensuring compatibility I actually do think that a wide gap in preferred frequency can/should be a deal breaker. It is so important to happiness.
he might not realize that this is the point you're at with his behavior. I'd be pretty honest about it, and see where that takes you. Everyone can have their ups and downs w/ intimacy (especially during times of stress or uncertainty or being physically limited etc) but it sounds like it's starting to become more permanent. At least you are a pretty good example and seem confident - maybe that will help him turn things around.
It sounds like you are doing an awful lot more work in this relationship than he is. It sounds as if he's just comfortable - it sounds almost like you're his buddy that he's just taken for granted and whom he assumes will always be there to take care of things and keep him company. While being similar to someone, spending a lot of time together, having the same friends, and working in the same field are all nice things, they are not what a marriage should be built on. It sounds like there's zero passion in this relationship, and I don't think you deserve a passionless life.
Your FI sounds very depressed. And, as the PP pointed out, it sounds like you don't really want to marry him. Do not worry about pleasing others or wasting money due to canceling your wedding. It is better to postpone or cancel it now if you are as doubtful as you sound. Other people will get over it and understand, your future and your happiness are at stake here. Personally, I couldn't marry someone who refuses to face their problems. You could always tell him that if he won't enter counseling with you, then you are going to have to postpone the wedding. If that doesn't motivate him to solve some issues, I doubt anything will.
@Amarylis - you're not too harsh. Thanks for the response. I would be thrilled to marry him, issues and all, with the exception of the intimacy issue. I REALLY don't know how to fix that one, and feel like the other things often come as a result of that.
And I guess I talked all about his negatives here. But I really really meant what I said in the first paragraph. He is the best man that I know, and I can't really imagine NOT spending my life with him. But marriage... marriage seems like a scary thing right now, especially with an imperfect relationship.
@bviq - I've thought about speaking to the preacher, but ultimately I'm uncomfortable with that. He's not OUR preacher, he's my mom's preacher, and he's across the country (where the wedding is). So that's out. But there is a counselor in town that I've spoken to before that I could make an appointment with. I'd feel comfortable talking to her about it.
@2peasinapod - thanks! I'm actually around the hive quite a bit, under another name. I've wondered about depression, but there are few other signs of it, outside of these. He's a happy guy, socially active and unreserved. I went through a spot of depression last year, and he was so wonderful during it, and he's nothing like how I was (I was awful). I know it affects folks differently, though. I think you're right, though. I really need to address them all together, and make sure that he knows what I'm thinking.
I love him, and when it's good, it's GOOD, you know? Argh.
You are very strong to acknowledge that these are real issues that have to change. I think coming to that realization is the first step, and you're already there. I would consider each one of these problems a huge red flag, especially the lack of sex life but the others as well.
It sounds like FI sees you more as a friend/sister/clone of himself than a future wife. Being funny, respectful, and sharing your values might be great in a friend, but certainly not enough in a husband, as you are discovering. He is comfortable in the status quo, comfortable enough to refuse to change even though he knows you guys are not at a good place. As painful as it may be to postpone or cancel the wedding, you might have to do something like this to spur him into action, since talking clearly hasn't worked. You may be surprised at how willing vendors are to work with you to make sure you lose as little $$ as possible. This is especially true if you are postponing rather than canceling.
I think you need to be very upfront with him about all of these issues at the same time. If depression might be an issue, ask him to figure it out with his doctor. Make it clear that your relationship cannot move forward or even continue on as it is if he doesn't make changes. Don't let him make excuses - focus on the fact that whatever his reasons are, the behavior needs to change. Keep in mind, if this is his true personality (which you are only discovering), he might never be able to change to an extent which will allow you to have a happy marriage.
One other point: working together, living together, and having the same friends (i.e. seeing each other ALL the time) can really hurt the relationship. As someone who has gone through that issue myself, I know how hard it is to force yourselves not to see each other all the time, especially if it naturally works out due to having the same job, home and friends. FI and I absolutely could not have gotten to engagement/marriage without reaching a healthy balance of time spent together. That said, I don't believe that your problems are completely or even mostly caused by too much time together. Hence, while I would strongly urge you to look for ways to spend much less time with him, I don't think this alone will help.
@other posters - thanks so much for your responses. I'm really appreciating additional input on this, b/c I can't really talk to our mutual friends about it, now can I? :)
So you're at a point now where something has to be done? Do you think it would be better to talk to a counselor first or him?
I agree with Arachna, we usually don't think of men as having a low libido. But sometimes they do. Mr.Bobby and I don't get intimate any where near as much as I'd like, although it has changed a little since he lost his job. He was just really depressed before, but now I'm finally starting to realize that he's just not(sorry about the term but) as horny as I am.
But please if you don't think you are ready to marry him, then don't put yourself though it. A divorce would be much worse. See if he will go to counseling or at least "just talk" to the Pastor or any counselor. If this isn't who he used to be, then tell him you miss the old him. A lot. This isn't crazy, this is perfectly normal.
(ps the weight gain could be a big factor in the less intimacy)
@cinnamon roll -Yes. We've become a passion-less couple. We weren't always this way! And damn it, that's EXACTLY what I need. I need some f'ing passion! While I know that he's got it in him somewhere (I've seen it before!), I just haven't seen it in a loooong time.
@GirlWithARing - I think you've hit it. Sometimes I feel like his best friend, rather than his fiance. That is le suck. And while we do spend a ton of time together, I do things by myself. I do have girlfriends around that I hang out with regularly, without him. He just never does anything without me. Sometimes I wish that he would.
@bviq - yes, I think that we have to address this, and soon.
I'll probably talk to him in the next few days about it. But we just had a fight about wedding planning (joy), and I hate to bring up another fight-worthy topic so soon.
@bobby - That's kind of what he's said - his boss is awful, and that he can't wait to change jobs. Because we're both in school as well, he can't do that until he graduates, which might be another year or more. I guess I'd be okay with a lower libido than mine, just not a non-existent one.
I've written on other boards here how 'it's so much easier to post-pone the wedding rather than get divorced,' and I very much agree with it. I just never really thought I'd have to make that decision, you know? I was completely prepared to decide on colors. <sigh>
This might be a bad question....but sometimes when I've heard girlfriends say their relationship is passionless, it's because someone else is starting to spark their interest, especially if their relationship has kinda been in a funk lately. But just wanted to check cause there's other things to deal with if you're starting to have crushes on other people.
@bviq - No, it's a good question, but happily irrelevant. I totally understand this, though. I'm of the opinion that you're going to have crushes, regardless of your relationship status. If it's a good relationship, the crush passes quickly. :) I've totally had a crush on someone else during our relationship, but it did pass quickly, and was kind of a nonevent - never mentioned, and certainly never acted on.
It sounds like you've really got a good head on your shoulders and I think you should feel proud of that.
It sounds to me like he is experiencing some depression (not as passionate as before, weight gain). I think you should do some talking about it and definitely see if your preacher or someone else can help with premarital counseling. Make the move to marry him when you feel optimistic about the positive progress towards the future.
I don't think this has to be the end of a relationship at all (unless you want it to be). I think a couple who can help each other grow and move through tough times as a team is a very strong one. Now you need to find out if your partner is willing to do the work like you are.
I think he's lucky to have you!
This is just me but for some of the more serious issues I've always had to write it out, edit it, write it again. To figure out what I'm flexible on, what I really need to changed, and what are some solutions. For me it helps filter out all the other nonsense that is going on in my head that serves as a distraction and then I get frustrated because the real issues aren't being addressed. Maybe you could give him a letter and ask him on a date or something, something to try and make it a conversation instead of a fight. But it seems like if it's kinda become a routine it might be a bit of an uphill battle for a bit.
Thanks, Vonnegurl! That's sweet to say. And I definitely do NOT want this to be the end of our relationship. I think I need some professional or insider (aka, my FI's) help figuring out how to go forward, though.
@bviq - I think that's kind of what I've been using the bee for just now - a practice run for the real letter and the real conversation. Thanks so much for your thoughts!
I think it may be time to let him know what's up. He is unwilling to reciprocate your intimacy, unwilling to take any steps towards being healthy, and unwilling to work on your relationship. Every single one of us in our lifetimes will go through periods when we lose some sex drive, when we gain/lose weight that impacts our health or attractiveness, and will run into communication issues that frustrate our partners. Having the problems is not actually the problem. It is his unwillingness to take any steps that is worrying to me. I think it would be a safe wager that if he made attempts to be affectionate, tried to lose weight, and made effort at communication, you wouldn't be here. Notice I didn't say you wouldn't be here if you had a banging sex life, he dropped 60 pounds, and he communicated his love like Marvin Gaye. Its the absolute lack of effort that I think is probably really getting to you.
So here are the issues: is he naturally a big buy with a low sex drive who loves you like a sister? Or is he dangerously taking you for granted? Or some combination? The best way to find out may just be to tell him, make an effort or I'm bouncing. Despite the money and the embarrasment, calling off a wedding would be a lot better than a passionless, sexless marriage with a guy who shows little to no regard for his health.
EDIT: same goes if this is depression. Just like weight loss and intimacy, you can't demand that he get better, but you can demand that he work at it.
all i can add is can u honestly stand infront the lord and ur family and say i do .and that you will commit to someone whom u have these issues with?i think u guys need to get a on the same track pronto before the weeding.this lack of sex thing will one day take its toll and u might stray.best of luck
If he won't see a counselor with you, don't be afraid to go to one yourself! It's amazing the things a neutral third party can help you see about yourself and your relationships.
These are important issues, so give yourself the time to figure them out.
@someoneelse....I think you have your answer now that the bees have spoken :) I think talking to him about the intimacy issue and seeing a counselor is the way to go! I dont think your relationship is over by any means...it just needs to be worked on a bit...and if both of you put in time and effort to make things better than everything will be OK :) Like you said...postpone the wedding a little bit so that isnt an additional worry in both of your heads...and just try to figure things out now.
I think you've gotten great advice. My only additional piece is about your fear of wasting time/embarassing stuff by postponing the wedding and it's a personal story (yay! fun stories).
At the bachelorette for one of my best friends I found her crying in the bathroom and we spoke for hours. She wasn't sure about marrying her fiance - she loved him, she wanted him in her life - but she felt she HAD to go through with it because her parents had put so much money down, people were invited, etc etc. It was tearing her apart because really what she needed was more time and the wedding was in a month. She went through with it and sad(?) ending: they got divorced within a year.
If after your conversation you're not sure you want to get married - dont get married because of fear/etc. On an intellectual level we know these thingsand you seem smart, but so is my friend and she let the expectations get to her. Weddings put alot of pressure on ppl, don't let that impact how you really feel.
GOOOOOD luck. I hope your convo/letter goes amazingly well.
We talked this morning. The results are:
1. We're biking to work and back each day, starting tomorrow. He doesn't feel good about himself, either.
2. I need to be more aware of him and his battles with work. My job, while similar, is much better due to a better boss, and sometimes I don't realize how crappy it is for him.
3. He feels cheesy saying how he feels about me, so instead he will write it. Because I NEED to hear it from him, and a post-it works just as well as the spoken word for me.
4. We are working on the intimacy issue. That was the big one, and that will take a lot more work to get where it needs to be. But the beginning is openness, and we've started a dual dialog now, instead of just me talking.
5. We might go to counseling if we don't see results soon, but honestly, it's so difficult for him to be open with just me, that I fear a counselor would get very little out of him. But, I will go by myself if I need to, with a standing invitation to him. I've been before, and found it very helpful.
6. The reasons that I love him have all been rehashed, and I know that I want to marry this man. Yes, we have issues. But we will get through them, and we will do it together, because in the end, we are simply better when we are together.
Thanks y'all.
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My FI is one of the best men I've ever met. He's funny, respectful, has similar values, works hard (mostly), and we get along well. We've been together for 3.5 years, have the same friends and have the same job.
But.
First, our, um, intimate life is non-existent. We live together and we haven't been intimate in over two months. He knows it's a problem, I know it's a problem, but nothing changes. I've tried multiple things to jump start it again, from lingerie to unexpected places/times, to expected places/times, to romance, to dirty messages, and the list goes on. Sometimes it works, but usually not. I've talked to him about it, and his response is that he's really stressed with X project at work. Then X project will end, and something else will take its place. We've been...inconstant for over a year now, probably closer to two, being intimate only sometimes (maybe once a month), and ONLY when I intiate. He's not getting it elsewhere, if only b/c the logistics are impossible (we live together, and spend a LOT of time together).
Probably contributing to this problem is his weight. He's gained a lot in the last year or so, going from about 200 lbs (which is about right for his frame) to probably 260+. I've asked him if he wants to exercise with me (I go 3+ times per week), tried to cook healthy meals (he eats cheese if he doesn't feel 'full' after (or before) dinner), and have told him that I'm worried about his health. It's to the point where I can't do anything else. He has to, but he won't.
In addition to this, I STILL don't know why he loves me. I know that he does, and I know that I deserve that love (healthy self-esteem here), but he NEVER tells me what he loves about me. I have no clue. After picking fights with him for a week, I finally got up the courage to ask him why he loved me at all. His answer was "Because you're just like me. You're a female version of me." Okay, that's great - I tell him all the time what I love about him, so maybe I should just turn that around and apply it to myself as well?!?! WTF?!? This was months ago, and he hasn't managed to come up with anything better since then. Honestly, I really just need some sort of positive feedback! I know that I'm a kind of a neat person, and that I'm worthy of love, but I need to know that he realizes that too, and I need to hear what he loves about me.
I have talked to him about each of these issues individually, but never together. I don't think he realizes that these things are bothering me to the point that I'm totally freaking out about marrying him. I love him, but I don't know if I want to be chained to someone for the rest of my life who
a)will cause me to be essentially celibate,
b)won't take care of himself,
c)won't communicate with me.
I've asked him to attend pre-marital counseling with me, but he says that we don't need it, and we agreed to do what the preacher said (I was confident the preacher would advise it), but he said we didn't need it. Awesome.
I don't want to cancel our wedding. It's coming up in a few months, and honestly, the idea of telling people and wasting money, and telling our families is awful. I want to marry him. But these things HAVE to be fixed, and I don't know what else to do. Please tell me that I'm not crazy?