- Blog
- Bios
- Boards
- Classifieds
- DIY
- Gallery
- Vendor Reviews
- Shop Weddingbee
Weddingbee boards
@PizzutiStudios: lol
•buy a tripod and use it when you don't need to (you look so professional)
That's pretty awesome.
LMAO! Ugh, I love every line :) Here is another good one:
•finally get stood up for the last time for a session with a parakeet and decide you will collect a deposit for portrait sessions
That is great, and sadly we have all been through a few of those line items...haha.
I still like my post of "photography is not a profession" but many people failed to see the humor in it.
Baha, that's a funny thing to say to a photographer. So people just think the photog is being mean by keeping the pictures so long after the wedding? No... it's because it takes tons of time to edit photos. I'm sure there are other things to do as well (I'm not a photog) but yea, that's silly to think they only work two days a week.
My photog had to only accept 24 brides this year. Think of how many weekends that is to be working? Not to mention how many pictures she takes and edits ALL of them. She go so behind last year that she had to cut back just to have better service for her brides. AND she wants to still love her job instead of being resentful about it.
It seems that every other day there is a new webpage making fun of "how to become a wedding photographer" or think again if you want to become one.
I don't see that in any other profession. I don't see the tons of webpages saying "how to become a fire fighter/plumber/doctor"...
Wedding photographers really must hate competitions.. Or they are some really bitter wedding photographers out there.
@wanderer: Well, it goes back to my "photography is not a profession" article. There is no schooling or degree, license, or training required, anyone and everyone can do it.....and with the advent of semi-affordable gear and high unemployement, people ARE doing it, at all skill levels.
The problem is, the mass public is used to putting some degree of "trust" in professionals, think a Doctor, a Plumber, or a Hairstylist,etc. Many amateurs and hobbiests are calling themselves professionals and many of them are not very skilled. People get taken advantage of, and you see it here often when people pay XYZ and get back a crap product. I am not saying that all newcomers and hobbyists in the profession are bad, but many are.
It's frustrating for professional photographers to see the mass public getting rooked like that, and it also gives the entire industry a bad name.
@wanderer: Here is a statistic for you:
The number of people calling themselves professional photographers in the USA has more than tripled since 2007. In that same span people's disposable income has fallen. So, yeah, do the math - and it's kinda depressing.
It's not that we don't like compeition, it's really along the lines of what USER just said. Too many moms with camera's calling themselves photographers, charging nothing or close to it, and devaluing the industry to the point where real photographers can't charge what they need to in order to make a living.
You know, there is an awful lot of hostility in these posts. I think it might actually be a better strategy for the industry for you guys to acknowledge how many brides really DO want something closer to what a talented amateur or beginning pro is willing to offer -- flexible packages, raw shots, simple and straightforward photography. We don't all CARE or WANT you to spend 4 hours a week for a month in the studio editing the photos and then being bitter that you are not appreciated. Oh, and the dig at "moms" is not very nice either. It sounds like you're scared of the competition or hostile toward women who are trying to start new careers.
I would respectfully suggest that if the public is not sufficiently appreciative of your work or grateful to you for your business model, then you might wish to consider adapting the business model. At any rate, the negativity and laughing at family photogs, etc, is a huge turnoff for me and I bet I am not alone. Just wanted to point out that forwarding these kinds of articles on a brides' forum is not necessarily going to improve everyone's attitude toward pro photogs as a group.
@snowflake119: You do realize I'm a woman right? You may be offended if you like, but I'm simply stating the facts, and moms tend to be attracted to it because they see the bulk of it, the editing, as something they can do at home while they take care of the kids. Again, it's just an industry trend and a fact being stated.
If people want amateur work, then by all means, hire your cousin who never shot a wedding before but really loves photography. The only thing is, you shouldn't come on this site afterwards and complain about all the missed shots or crappy quality photos, which more often than not is exactly what happens in those cases. I think those of us who hang out on these boards get extra frustrated and post things like this, because we have each read more than our share of that.
Too many moms with camera's calling themselves photographers, charging nothing or close to it, and devaluing the industry to the point where real photographers can't charge what they need to in order to make a living.
I'm a believer of idea of "if you are good at what you do, people will come to you". Sure, there are a lot more "photographers" and hence it affects the supply and demand curve and bring the prices down. But if you are good at what you do, people will pay your price. If the constant entry of new photographers are making brides go to them instead of you because they are cheaper than you, maybe that says something about your work.
I don't see those high end good photographers complaining about new photographers taking their business. All I see are the middle/low ones complaining about them. Maybe they should try to improve their skill and bring their game up instead of complaining all day long. Maybe their work is not worth what they are charging to begin with and now it is catching up to them.
And yes, I don't care if you need to charge X because you have insurance/studio/whatever. All I care is whether the price you charge is worth the work you are showing me. When I go to restaurants, they don't tell me that they need to charge X because of permits/rent/or their avocado prices have gone up. They show me their price, if I don't like it, I go elsewhere. That is the price you need to pay to stay in business.
To me as a customer, the most annoying thing is you trying to justify your fee to me. Show me your work, and I'll decide if what you are charging is worth it to me or not.
@wanderer: As for me personally, I'm almost completely booked for 2011, so I don't feel the need to re-evaluate my work, my prices or how I do business. However, at the end of the day, this profession just doesn't pay a ton and you have to love what you do to be able to live on this income full time. And yes, even those super-high-end photographers you speak of aren't making as big a profit as you would think at the end of the day. I'm not permitted to put my starting price on this board, but suffice it to say, I'm in the mid-to-high price range for my area.
The price of no other wedding expense is as highly debated as photography, and that's why photographers feel the need to justify their prices. The constant influx of people doing this for fun and marketing themselves as professionals makes brides wonder why the real professionals are charging so much and we are here to answer that question, nothing more. I don't see why you take such offense to this, and you seem un-necssarily hostile over it.
Again, it all comes down to what we see on these threads. If you dont want us to sit here and justify our price, dont come on these boards and complain about the price of the photographer whose work you really love because you don't understand why they charge so much. If it was common to go into a restaurant and complain about the price of a steak, saying well you only have to buy it and cook it for me, I'm sure restaurant owners would be posting threads justifying their prices too. Anyway, I think your tone is getting too heated for me, so this will be my last post on this thread.
I didn't post this because I am bitter, I've actually helped a few bees on here who are making that jump into wedding photography. Matter of fact I am currently mentoring two newbies only because I would rather them know what they are getting into and make good business decisions that help the industry at a whole.
I'm pretty much making fun of those people who think "wow it's such an easy job to be a wedding photog. I can do it too" I also admit that when I was starting out many years ago, I made these same mistakes. It was fun for me to look back on and laugh and wanted to share with other photos new and "old" who are on this site as well as give a perceptive of what it is like for a newbie to brides looking to hire one.
What I am bitter about is like what LB and User referenced to is that there are so many people who jump right in with out really understanding the business. They take crappy photos, take months and months to get photos to their clients or disappear all together because they realize they are just over their heads. It gives the rest of us a bad name and really pisses us off.
Photography is all perceptive of value. There are people who don't really value it, who don't care about hiring a newbie and only want the RAW files {even though most don't fully understand what a RAW file is} and don't understand or have the experience to manage their clients expectations. All is good, there are plenty of people who highly value photography not as snapshots but as an artist craft and are willing to pay good money for someone highly educated in what they do and run established reliable business. But again if you are in the first category then you really don't have a right to complain your photos turned out bad, they missed important shots, they are taking forever to get you your photos/album or you can't get a hold of them after the wedding. It happends ALL THE TIME on here.
There is also this post you can refer to: http://boards.weddingbee.com/topic/why-are-professional-photographers-so-expensive
p.s. This post was meant to be funny. Not to devalue or offend anyone or for people to argue over justifying reasonable pricing to make a living.
@wanderer: Many people don't have an eye for good photography and shop on price. This board is a great example. People post photographer's websites for others to rate for them because they admit that they really don't know what they are looking at and want to make sure they are getting a decent value It's not hard to get a dozen or so great portfolio images out of a thousand you have taken so how do you know what you will REALLY get?
A lot of people feel a professional is a professional is a professional and they know what they are doing and will deliver at the end of the day. They only find out afterwards that this is not the case and it happens A LOT.
I think this aspect is what frustrates professional photographers. For the person that doesn't have the experience to really rate your work, how do you convince them that you are different and will do a standup job? How do you convince them that you are worth your price and your price is good, rather than a start up that is doing it at a loss to gain experience and will probably be out of business before their wedding even happens.
Just like anything in this world (kia's to mercedes, sizzler to ruth chris, etc), there are people that want to pay 500 for photography, 2500 for photography, 5000 for photography, and 10K+ for photography. A lot has to do with budget and not necessarly quality or talent. Those that had a 5K photography budget probably didn't even look at the "craigslist crew" even though there is a chance that they may have gotten the same thing for much less. The same thing goes for any budget.
I myself don't feel these people are hurting me or my sales, they are hurting themselves and devaluing the industry.
They are operating at unsustainable levels which is why most of them are in and out of business so fast. They make up low cost with volume and quickly get overwhelmed with the hours of work and can't keep up. Eventually they quit.
You hear about this time and time again on this forum, people that are waiting 6 months for images, and people that get images back and regret using the 500 dollar shoot and burn photographer they found online,etc
I think we should all have a glass of wine. This was suppose to be funny.
@Miss Tattoo: agree! The post is meant for humor, just grab a glass of wine (or any favored drink) and poke fun.
I didn't post when I saw this yesterday because I knew that it was just meant to be funny and not really supposed to be mean-spirited at all. I think that it would be pretty easy to take it the other way though, so it shouldn't be that surprising if people get offended or annoyed.
Post like this do pop up from time to time and while I think they're MEANT to say: Hey being a photographer is a lot harder and more skilled than a lot of people think... it often comes off as: anyone who wants to be a photographer is an idiot.
Which always seems a bit confusing... being posted by a photographer who obviously made that decision at some point, right? and that is what I think people are responding to in saying that the posts come off as threatened.
@CorgiTales you hit the nail right on the head. If you read my other posts above I admitted to making a lot of those same mistake starting out and two I'm not bitter about people who want to become photogs I often help an mentor those who are serious because I don't want them to have to make the same mistakes I did. It was merely stating the life as a wedding photog isn't as glamorous as some people tend to think.
@PizzutiStudios: yep. I get it :) I'm not a professional photographer for pretty much exactly those reasons in the post. I love photography (might say i have a "passion" for it.... lol) but I'm not ready yet and I won't be for a while. I'm still working on getting better. I won't really "open my doors" until after I've been working at it for a (long)while, second shooting, building up my equipment (i'm still not shooting on full frame. very sad), getting a portfolio ready, etc etc etc. And I'm working full time while I'm learning so that I don't need to try to make money while I'm figuring out wtf I'm doing! So... it'll take a while. Because I don't honestly see how anyone could make a living charging 1500/wedding. When I finally put my name out there I am going to be awesome and expensive lol.
@CorgiTales: Eh, full frame doesn't mean anything. Don't focus on equipment, as equipment doesn't make someone a better photographer. Focus on improving your skill and developing a business before you make any large capital investments. I saw a youtube video of a studio photoshoot done with an iphone just to reinforce that!
Also, I just read an article on a national geographic photoshoot, images were published in the magazine and the guy was shooting with like a 30D! lol
@USER876: i wouldn't say it doesn't mean ANYTHING lol. But its not the first step. That's why I don't have one yet! For right now while I'm focusing on composition, lighting, and editing technique I'm just shooting on a canon rebel xti. There is no point in upgrading right now, but before I'd want to go start charging a lot of money for weddings I'd definitely want to upgrade to a ff.
@USER876: I saw that too! That was amazing!
I also read somewhere there was this husband and wife photography team that was doing a "megapixles don't matter"or maybe it was "Your camera takes good pictures!" I forget. Anyway, I think the point was they were just ranting about people saying "Wow! Your photos are amazing! Your camera must take really great pictures!" and they went and bought some disposable camera's just to prove that it's not the camera but the person behind the lens that makes great photos.
@wanderer: You are soo right!
I, a soon to be bride, am also am a professional photographer- so I totally understand both sides of the spectrum
Sometimes, pro work is outdated. Sometimes, pro work is literally 2,3, or 10 times the cost of the entire wedding. Sometimes the bride just plain can't afford us.
Get over it! Or, re-evaluate your business. It is possible to charge only 800 for a wedding. I promise. Yes, you might have to take on a second job; but if you have the 'passion for photography' then what is the issue?
Also, if you are taking weeks to edit your wedding photos, maybe you need to invest in a few lessons? Editing is not to create an image, rather to enhance it... If it is so highly edited (technically 60 % changed or more) it is not photography, but Graphic Design.
And yes, graphic designers make a whole hecka-lot more money than photographers. Maybe you are just in the wrong business?
@Whoopsie Daisy if you read all the comments you will see that this post was meant to be funny not to have anyone get their panties in a bunch.
Sure you can charge $800 for a wedding and have a part time job and only eat Top Ramen. If that's your thing. If you are doing it for "the passion". I am completely passionate about photography but I also need to run a viable business and no, I don't want to do a disservice to my clients by having another job to worry about. Lucky my skill set and investment in equipment and photographic education leads me to be able to charge what I charge. Which I need to charge in order to sustain my business and my very modest lifestyle.
Though I totally agree with you on the taking weeks and weeks to edit to "fix" images. I think so many newbies rely on this rather making the effort to actually learn the photography part of the job. Most of my images that come out of the camera would be considered acceptable. But it does take time to cull, bump the contrast, fix mixed color issues that are difficult to do in camera, process, retouch {we only do 100 but still takes time}, load them to a proofing gallery, backing up to the server and burn the disks. In between answering emails and phone calls from other clients, designing albums, meeting potential and current clients, shooting engagement, boudoir and rock the dress sessions, editing said sessions. I can keep going but the list goes on. Generally it takes us {my husband and I both do this full time} about 30 hours to fully process a wedding. We have a two week turn around. This is only in place after years of re evaluating our workflow and business structure. But again it goes back to valuing our selves, our skill level, and our time to charge what we do.
And one more thing. Just because a newbie knows how to fix a crappy image in PS or LR by cloaking it with actions doesn't mean they have the skills to be graphic designer. I come from a GD background and I can tell you it is a whole different set of skills you need to know. You can be a crappy photog and a crappy Graphic designer and charge next to nothing or you can focus on be really good at one thing and make a living off of it.
Not to add full to the fire, but this is pretty funny as well: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VhalmKt1IXU&feature=player_embedded
You must log in to post.
| Visit our sister sites | eHarmony Online Dating |
eHarmony Advice Dating Advice |
Project Wedding Wedding Songs |
JustMommies Pregnancy Calendar |
Create the honeymoon of your dreams.
| User | Posts Today |
|---|---|
| rivierabridal | 6 |
| texasbee | 3 |
| MrsOliveBird | 2 |
 LauraFaye4411 |
2 |
| cbeyelia | 2 |
| julies1949 | 1 |
| Potatoes | 1 |
| Ree723 | 1 |
| Regina Phalange | 1 |
| KatNYC2011 | 1 |
Sorry, there are no users yet.
I found this on a photog forum and thought I would share. Pretty funny esp for those who have been in business for a while. I get asked the same question at almost every wedding.."wow you must love your job, taking pictures and only having to work one or two days a week?" I usually just nod and smile. I'm lucky in the summer/fall months to get two days off a month.
Here's the link: http://www.studioeboudoir.com/photographer/photographer.html