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Honestly....you cannot have EVERYTHING you love in a first home. It always helps me think "yes i can live with it" because we are in our first home. For the square footage you have, 165K is an amazing deal (in my opinion). A home that large in st louis costs 240K. Trust me, I'm paying the mortgage on it, lol. BUT there are PLENTY of things I want to change in our home. No, it isn't perfect. There are things I do not love. In fact, there are things I hate. Small kitchen, ugly linoleum, etc. Oh my gosh, we had PURPLE periwinkle walls. I've been there almost 2 years now and we STILL have things we haven't updated. It's just kinda how it is. You can't have it all at once...and it kinda makes your home a project. I sort of like that, watching it progress through the years.
But, the fact that they deviated from what you'd agreed upon, though, that is something I WOULD make them fix now. Yes they are a pain to deal with--what construction unit isn't?! My dad built his own home and he always said it was a HUGE task staying on top of those people. My dream someday is to build our own home, but it may not happen in this super metro city--it's not like there are empty lots around. And you SHOULD get what you want. But i also remember mydad compromised on some things--is it worth bringing up? What is it in the big scheme of things? that kind of stuff.
Now, some of those things sound to me like in-construction messes. Standing water makes me nervous though. Can you talk to your realtor (is it a realtor?) and say "we will not close until our issues are addressed? Because you do that when you buy a home off the market. I had a HUGE list of 15+ items I wanted fixed before I'd buy the home. I wanted all the windows argon sealed, i wanted the concrete fixed, i wanted a bunch of things done. And because she wanted to sell the home, she fixed it. THEN i closed. I don't see why you can't do that now.
So...i can completely relate. There are things I'm not in lov ewith about the honme. We have some things to fix. Yes, it will take time. BUT, we are a family in the meantime. And we can work on these things while having a family. I thnk id' rather have some items that need to be fixed than hold off on a house for a few more years, providing the house is still built solidly AND there aren't any major factors that could make it hard to sell down the road. Already, i know the small storage space in the kitchen will be a deterrant to selling our home. So we are looking at ways to make it seem like it's not a problem. Because anything that is a detterant, a possible buyer will negotiate for a lower price. I got a lower price on the home (Ok we got 30K off...) because there were problems with it like filthy carpets (need to be replaced) and lots of fixturing that needs to be replaced (helluva lotta work). And wallpaper (needs to be removed). But I can live with it, slowly chipping away at it. Maybe you can negotiate some price reduction with the sales person. If anything, you need to move up into talking to someone who is a manager. Someone with some power, and tell them that you'll walk if XYZ aren't done because you feel like business isn't being conducted right. There's a way to swing this and get your way.
Ok long novel over =]
It seems very odd that they would agree to do something a specific way & then not do it. I understand if there's a specific floorplan they have to follow, but they told you they would do one thing & then didn't do that. Do you have a friend in construction that could meet with them with you & put his foot down on your behalf?
I would talk with a manager & let them know what's going on. If you can meet with them in person, that's better. If you continue forward with this house, I would get EVERYTHING you want done to the house to be in writing & signed by them. I would also be sure they fixed everything that has issues before you close on the house. Are you confident the builders made a secure, solid house? If they cut corners, you can have issues in the future...
The water on the back porch concerns me too. Did they fix that? Did they tell you what it was from?
I'd plug through, I'd still want the house. Remember how fortunate you are to have such a great opportunity! Ok, they've been treating you terribly, you haven't gotten everything you wanted, but you'll have a house! And a place to raise a child and a dog, I'd take it!
I'm surprised that everyone is siding with going forward - all of our friends and family (even the granite guy at Lowe's) have told us to run away! We are working directly with the builder, so we do not have a realtor to be an advocate. I didn't realize you could have a realtor help with this kind of home purchase until after we were in contract. We've already had one run in with a manager regarding the furnace, and he was the one who made me cry because of how unhelpful and rude he was. At this point the countertop/backsplash issue is a big pile of what appears to be miscommunication, as the design center told us we would have the three inch lip instead of the backsplash, but the salesperson and builder are saying they never do that. I don't have anything to really back me up except for what the design center said, and I don't think it has much weight.
The water is what concerns everyone the most. We have asked about it repeatedly, and the only response we got was that it had rained that weekend. Um, it rained, but not five full puddles worth (as in, I could put my foot down and the water would be above my ankle easily). The rest of the yard was bone dry. They've leveled off the yard and filled in the areas where water had been with more sand, but the ground is still soggy around those areas.
I think we are going to do the walk through next week, but I don't have a positive outlook at all. I was clinging to the cosmetics of the house to make up for the fact that it wasn't exactly what I wanted in the first place, so now that the cosmetic aspect is a turn off I don't know that I want the house. I am ashamed to show people the house because it is not something I'm proud of at all. I understand you can't get everything you want in your first home, but we planned on staying in this home for at least 15+ years, and I had already compromised on alot. How far should I really go?
I don't think most of these things will be a problem as long as they fix it before they finish the home and you move it. Honestly, that is a great deal for the space, our old house was less than that sq ft wise and cost more! As long as you can afford the home payments on this home, I say go for it. Most people don't stay in homes more than 3 years or so, so if you really hate it, you can move on and find another home then.
Rereading your response, maybe you should walk away since you are planning on staying in the home for the long run. That way you can save up the money that would be going toward a house and have a good downpayment and possibly a lower mortgage in the future.
It's tough - it sounds like a great deal in theory, but if the contractor is neglecting things you asked for and deemed important it makes me wonder what else he is 'sweeping under the rug'. As an architect I've honestly never seen a laminate backsplash go to the underside of the cabinets....ever. The whole situation would make me very nervous; I've worked with good contractors, and I've worked with not so good contractors. Unfortunately, the projects with not-so-good contractors always have problems down the road that usually turn into huge headaches. No house is going to be perfect, but since it's new construction you should have had the chance to make it what you wanted - it just seems weird.
I say go for it... it sounds like a great deal, and other than the water, as though most of the issues have been more of a cosmetic nature than a physical one. If you would have to out your future plans of having a dog and a baby on hold, for a few years especially becuase of cosmetics of the house, you may become more resentful and upset over that than if you just went ahead with the house. i agree that you need to put this all in writing... I'm not sure if you have a lawyer for the official closing of the house, but they can help you draft up a letter with your concerns, and then have the builder sign it, guaranteeing that the repairs will be made. Covers yourself in the future if they aren't done, and you have any difficulties because of it. Around the water issue, definitely get something in writing that it will not be an issue, so then you have some legal backing if the water becomes an issue in the future. We are building a new home right now, and have been told by the builder, and confirmed with my uncle (who builds homes) that sometimes there will be water for a few months around the foundation, but will dry up as the house settles. If the water is getting into the house... that's another story. GET IT IN WRITING!!!
Just to give everyone context, these are two pictures of the backsplash followed by a picture of what we thought it would look like - the lip with the bare wall.
I think that if you go forward, you first need to bring a lawyer into it. i'd sit down with a lawyer who knows about stuff like this (one has to exist somewhere!), tell him/her what's-what and see what they say. It may come down to you simply using a lawyer to lean on the company to get what you want. Especially if they're leaving you with standing water patches in your yard! That could get into the house and rot it! Bad bad bad! If you can't afford a lawyer, then frankly, I'd walk away. Save your money. Sure $165,000 is a great deal for a new home that big, but if the construction is shoddy and you end up having to dump the property or dump More work into it, that $165 could easily become $300,000+. Not good! Also- I agree with you, that backsplash is Fugly! What a way to ruin a kitchen!
My biggest concern with the backsplash is that it doesn't go all the way up in the stove area! If you do go through with this, I would bring a lawyer into it, or try calling one of the local consumer reporters on the news.... I'm from Houston and have seen and know a lot of "custom home" or "builders" and this seems ridiculous.
Where is your Fiance when dealing with the builder? Sadly, you've probably already shown "weakness" and now they are really walking all over you. I think you need representation to stand up for your interests.
In Houston, you DONT wan't flooding or standing water! Really... the kind of storms you get... no way! I didn't vote, because I wanted to say "other: Fight to the end before just "giving up." If getting a "ball breaker" to deal with the contractors doesn't work, than walk away.... but don't just give in to them or give up!
What area of Houston is this? Feel free to PM me, but I'd love to know the area and builder giving you issues.
The good news, is that $165k can get you a ton of house in Houston! If this does fall through, you can even get a ton of house for less than 165k.... have you considered getting a FHA on a house in the low 100s? Many of the FHA loans (especially on a house that "cheap") don't require too substantial of a down payment...
@KLP - I've been the one mostly dealing with the company. DH has always gone to meetings and that sort of thing, but he keeps his feelings about everything very close to the vest and has a tendency to not allow people to know what he is thinking. I've tried to get him to be more vocal, but he keeps wanting to "see what they do". I know he's as angry as I am, I just wish he'd express it a bit more!
We're building in the Northeast part of Houston, near Baytown / Crosby / Atascocita. Home prices in Houston are pretty phenomenal, so I know we could probably find something else that is comparable to the size if we have to wait. I think we could definitely do the FHA loan if we save for another six months or so, as we are right under the down payment requirement for this size home for now. We qualified for the USDA loan program, which was designed for people like us wanting to build a home in a "rural" area, so we decided to go ahead with it instead of the FHA. This loan also does not have the monthly mortgage insurance payment that FHA does, so it actually helped to lower our monthly payment amount. It would definitely suck to have to lose the loan opportunity, but I don't want to keep a house just because of that.
I talked to the construction manager yesterday afternoon, and it was ugly. I tried to suggest a few things regarding the backsplash that could make both parties sorta happy, and he said "Well, it sounds like you should just close on the house and I can give you the name of a friend who can come in and take the backsplash down for you for a small amount of money". I was LIVID and basically tore him a new one. I let him know that I was thisclose to not closing on the home because we've had so many problems, I didn't trust that they built the best house they could, and I was paying a whole lot of money for him to just tell me to suck it up and deal with their mistakes. He suddenly backtracked a bit and said he would try to get to the bottom of the miscommunication and we could work something out. I guess we will see what happens today...
I read your post yesterday & thought you should just close, but after reading today's posts, I voted to walk. But only if they don't really try to work with you. They sound like they're gonna try something. If they say "there's nothing we can do..." than walk!
It looks like the construction manager is now realizing he can't just walk over you. I wouldn't work with someone who 1st says "we can't change things" to "if you pay someone, they can do that" to when you threaten to walk "ohh ok I'll help you now!". Sadly, there are people who are like this. Good builders would want to make you happy. What's the point of building a home if you can't choose things??
I would make an outline of every single thing you want done/changed to the house, or say you won't close. Make sure they address everything. Bring a friend who will help stand up for you if they're not taking you seriously.
I would also have them completely resolve the standing water issue. It can cause rotting & other things that could really hurt your home. I'd have them sign something saying they fixed this, so IF that standing water hurt your house, they would be responsible for any damage caused by that. I'm not sure if you can do that, but I'd vote to try that.
They also should give you a warranty, that if something breaks or doesn't work or something, THEY pay to fix it, not you. I would also photograph the things they didn't do a good job at, & also take pics of the standing water spots. Then keep those pics somewhere safe that shows the kind of job they did.
To me the backsplash isn't a huge deal. I do agree it's ugly and I wonder why it doesn't go all the way up above the stove, but it's something that can be easily changed down the road. However, you're going to have to deal with these people for years and the underlying communication issues would make me have second thoughts. I settled for many things when buying an older house, but believe you should get what you want (within your budget) when buying new.
I understand the backsplash is something I could change down the road, but I literally walked in and hated it immediately. I was told there wouldn't be a backsplash and I'd have a bare wall, so it was a huge shock. I feel like for the money I'm paying, I should get a product I like. As I told the construction manager yesterday, if I had wanted to do immediate renovation I would have purchased a pre-existing home and made changes that way. In my eyes, I shouldn't have to already be forking out a lot of money to make it a house I like. If I were to have walked in to this house as a potential home buyer, I would have automatically said no.
We're still fighting about the water. Currently, the ground is just consistently soggy since they leveled out the yard, so no standing water is visible, but it is still strangely wet with no real explanation.
I wish I could get over 2,000 sq ft where I live for $165,000! A nice 2-bedroom apartment is almost $400,000. For real. I would try as hard as possible to get them to fix these things. If they don't, these really are easy fixes. It would probably cost you less to fix the cabinets and backsplash not having the builder do it than having them do it. I'd call a couple contractors and see what they say. I'd also bring an inspector in this week or next if possible and have them look around and see if you've missed anything big! Good luck!
I'm really concerned for you about the wet ground. I'd get it checked out by a professional who does NOT benefit from the company selling the house. The construction company will probably make it sound like its not that bad so they can sell the house. You want a strong foundation on solid groud. Otherwise, its a waste of a house. Hope that gets resolved for you!!
Well, I buckled and called their corporate office after another round of non answers from the people I have been dealing with. I asked to just talk to anyone who had the time about my concerns / frustrations / problems about my entire experience. The girl patched me through to Greg, who I thought was just some random supervisor. So I spilled my guts - my frustration over the month it took to figure out where to put the furnace to the lack of communication to when they would just brush off my concerns about the water or a hole in the siding or the mismatched cabinets. After we talked for about ten minutes, he assured me he would look into the situation and that he was very sorry that we have had a negative experience. I told him I deeply wanted to want this house, and that my goal is to have the home we signed up for and expected, but the way it currently stands I don't see that happening and that we'd more than likely walk away. He told me he would talk to everyone involved, and I asked what his full name was and what his title was. He is the president of the company
!! I definitely had no idea that is who I was talking to, and I told him that. I thanked him profusely for just listening to me essentially vent about how upset I was over everything, and he said I was very professional about it and he wasn't offended at all. I am hoping that we'll get some compromise now.
Thanks for all of the concerns and input Hive! I'll keep you posted as things progress...
Just one little note... anything they tell you from here on out... get it in WRITING. If you discuss something on the phone, ask for the person's email. email them your understanding of whatever you've agreed to and have them confirm.
First time reading your post. I'm glad you got through to the President, that is a good sign.
I grew up in the military, and my parents still often move, so we've had lots of houses. Buying from a builder you trust is huge. Life can be much worse with a bad builder than just dealing with an older house. I've seen both bad and good, and bad from the beginning always equals bad in the end.
See what happens, but go with your gut.
Ok first IMO for those who say to close, buying a home is alot different than BUILDING your own home. You choose colors, pick out designs and choose how things are placed. That is part of the price for those of us who build pay. Also depending on the area, that square footage at that price is really doable so please do not feel bc PP say be greatful or you should feel lucky to get a house that big, you have to close. We just built a 2 story with full basement, 4 BR, 2 1/2 bath and had a lot of upgrades, 2300 SQ with 2 car garage and our original price was 165k but we paid out of pocket for somethings and our final loan was 154k. Of course if you are in a major metro you are not going to find that but not all of us live in areas like that.
I know I read your previous post regarding the issues you were having and I could tell it was definetly a different building process than what we went through. However, when you sign a building contract, it HAS in writing what you asked for and what you want like the countertops and no backsplash. They need to fix it to what you signed for. NO, it is not acceptable to think well it can be fixed later. Are you kidding me!? You PAID/are paying for a house to be built a certain way!!!! They need to come through! It sounds like the builder is not a reputable one and I am so sorry you are going through this! We just finished our build in Nov and I WOULD NOT close until things are done as to how you signed them to be done. Now if it is not in the original building contract, unfortunately that is out of your hands, but you can, at least with our builder, we did a work order and it basically did an ammedmant to the contract. Honestly if it was me and I was only going to lose $900, I would walk away. I know many say well you can fix it later and at least you will have a home, but honestly, with a builder as icky as this one sounds, how do you possibly know that the home is of pure, sound structure? I see many problems in the foreseable future.
Yaaaayy :). Glad you got someone with power... the most power!! I'm pretty certain that things will "magically" be able to be done your way since Greg is helping you. Those builders have probably walked over others & this will get them to either stop that, or be fired & you get a new & good builder.
I used to work at a lawy firm and I have to agree with another poster.
Start getting EVERYTHING in writing, and keep a little journal yourself...stuff like "went to the site today, May 5.2010 @ 10:50am, there was water here and there and blah blah, talked to so an so...." It will be really helpful in the long run.
Kudos to you for going above and beyond. I hope this guy can get some answers for you. In my experience, people that high up get real pissed when their lower level penny anny workers mess up big deals like this. It ruins THEIR company's name.
I hope it works out!
Still no update from the corporate office. The salesperson called earlier to say that if we changed out the mismatched cabinet (she called it an upgrade...I called it a mistake) it would push our closing back an entire week. She didn't seem like anyone from corporate was breathing down her neck to make me happy, so I'm not sure if anything has been done or said.
Pushing back closing would be fine, if they deliver the house you contracted. My gut says there is a lot going wrong here and some of them are little things, but they do start to add up. We've been house hunting for a very long time and sometimes it's easy to get caught up in the swing of things and want to MAKE it work.
I hope that the corporate office comes around soon and that they do make you happy, but you're going to have to live with this builder for a very long time, so don't be afraid to walk away. (And as someone who keeps loosing contracts on houses, I know that's heartbreaking.)
Good luck!
Still no response from the corporate office. I sent a detailed email outlining every single issue we've had since January yesterday, so I'm getting antsy for even an acknowledgement that they received the email. Do I call to follow up or should I be patient?
If I were you, I'd call. Just to check up, see if they got it. When to expect a response/reply. Remember, get things in writing!
If they don't get their act together, dump them. Or ask Greg if they can assign you a new building team because you don't trust their workmanship. From what you've said, I wouldn't trust the way they built the house. It sounds like you'll have to pay for their mistakes in the future. Is the ground still wet around the house?
If you really want that house, see if you can change building companies. I'd assume there's other builders in the area. I'm not sure if that would work, but maybe its worth a shot? Possibly talk to the city & see if the grant you were qualified for would transfer if you got other builders? I'd talk to the city & tell them the issues you've had & see if they can refer you to anyone else & what steps you should take.
Honestly, I'd look for houses for sale & start looking at other houses. Maybe you'll find one that you love much more than the way you thought you wanted your house. Also, don't be too picky, no house is going to be perfect! Just don't submit an offer for a house until you've signed papers that you're walking away from the building one.
Well, the corporate office finally got back to us after we had to send another email, and they aren't being terribly helpful. They refuse to help with the backsplash, so if we want to change it we have to do it ourselves. The ground is a little moist around the back porch still, but it isn't as bad as it was. My husband is leaning toward closing because the project manager sweet talked him yesterday, but I keep bouncing back and forth. To add another layer of stress, our apartment has already been leased out and someone is moving in on June 5, so we don't have the option to stay. We have the official walk thru tomorrow morning, and we will have a new construction manager for our neighborhood, so I think we are going to see how it goes.
Please please please hire someone not connected with the building company to check out the ground water situation. You could have a HUGE problem on your hands that might not be obvious until big rains come in. Do NOT close this way until you've got a WARRANTY that there'll be no issue. And get that in writing. The headache is just not worth it, and if you end up with a water issue, it'll be really hard to sell.
Good luck to you!
Ok once you said the ground is still wet, I really really really (just like bluebook) want you to get the ground checked out. Get a warranty & read over every bit of it & see if someone can be there with you so that if legally anything has to happen, you have a witness. Seriously, a dream house that's sinking is no dream home & may have no value.
IF you close in this house, please get flood insurance. It doesn't come with the typical home insurance, you have to get it seperate & its extra.
I would also document with pictures any and all of the standing water.
I would match that up with weather patterns.
"Rained 6 inches in 10 hours and ground has 3 inchs sitting XYZ for length of Z feet"
Hey everyone, I just wanted to give you an update. We hired an independent inspector to come look at the house, and he did not find many issues with the house. We were right about the water situation...they did not properly grade the backyard so there was no drainage path for the water. The inspector said that is against code, so they have to fix it. He did not see any damage that had occurred because of the water. Overall he could tell we had been very involved in our building process and there weren't nearly as many problems as he normally sees. Because of his stamp of approval, we decided to close on the house. We close Thursday and move in this weekend. We are going to wait and fix the backsplash and countertops in a few months (or years). Ok, update over...I need to go pack! Thanks for all of your support through this mess!
Hooray! Congratulations! I think that was really smart to get someone independant of the situation out there. That's wonderful he didn't find anything. Good luck packing and moving! So exciting!
Awesome, I'm very happy for you!! I had been wondering what happened with the house, so thanks for updating us. I'm very glad you got the inspector & that they're going to fix that standing water issue. Wow that's a fast move in :).
was just about to say ClOSE IT! but you have lol people think that building your own house means that you get exactly what you want, it doesn't . well maybe for a lucky few! my parents *finally* built their own house a few years ago and it was a nightmare throughout the entire process though. as long as the house is structurally fine everything else can be fixed. congratulations!
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Well Hive, I come to you a broken woman. We've been in the process of building a home for the past five months, and it has been one problem after another after another with this builder. Hubs and I are at the end of our rope. The builder's apathy to the problems we have is driving us nuts. Theoretically we are supposed to close in less than two weeks, but we just don't see how it is possible. Here's a run down of the situation:
2 story home - 2275 sq ft - $165k; Specialty loan program through the government that requires no down payment to help stimulate growth in rural areas. Approved strictly for this house; cannot transfer loan to different property and the loan program has officially ended. Loved the idea of a brand new home that we wouldn't have to renovate. It is in our hometown so location is great.
We started the building process in January; mid - February work on the house grinds to a halt. It took two weeks to get a response from the construction manager as to what the hold up was. This is the first time they were building this floorplan (it is brand new) so they have discovered that the furnace does not fit in the attic like it was supposed to. 2 more weeks go by with no solution. Finally have a sit down with them about lack of communication and how unhappy we are because they were wanting to change various aspects of the house which we found unacceptable. The meeting went badly...I left in tears. The next day they come up with a magic solution that won't completely change the floor plan and keeps it in the attic. We were relieved, but were still very upset with how they handled the entire situation.
Dry wall finally goes up the second week of April, but we continue to have a laundry list of things that aren't quite right: holes in the siding; broken electrical box; a large amount of standing water along the foundation of the back porch; etc. Some of these things were addressed right away, others were pushed aside as something trivial by the construction manager and are still not fixed.
Yesterday we went out to take a look and they had put in the countertops. I decided I did not want a backsplash, so I was shocked to see that the laminate countertop did not end with a previously agreed upon 3 inch lip around the wall - it went up the entire wall space between the upper and lower cabinets. I officially have walls of countertop material in my kitchen and it is hideous. This, along with the mis-matched cabinets we found in the master bathroom, caused us to go to the sales office. Instead of trying to make us happy, the salesperson simply told us no, all of the houses have that backsplash so too bad we can't change it. We can make the cabinets match for an extra fee. We left angry.
So, hive, what do I do? Do I just suck it up and deal with a less-than-fantastic house with horrible people I will have to deal with should we need to fix anything with our warranty, or do we sacrifice this deal and wait another 2 or 3 years to save up enough for a realistic down payment? Turning down this house also means waiting to get a dog and to have kids, which really depresses me. If we do not close we only lose $900, which we've already paid. We won't have any extra fees. I'm not in love with this house by any stretch, but I'm in love with the idea of finally being settled in our home town and starting the family that is starting to become a more frequent topic of conversation.