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I'm submitting the order for my invites. We are using formal wording.
I wrote, "Two thousand ten." However, the ladies at the invitation shop disagree and said that "Two thousand AND ten" is correct.
I have heard that the word "and" denotes a decimal point and is grammatically incorrect. I have heard that it is different in different parts of the world (ie., British/UK usage etc.).
I have no idea (and don't care much either way, but I'd like to know)... Which is it?!
Yes, the word "and" denotes a decimal point. It is two thousand ten.
I stressed about this too--mainly because my head was filled with a variety of reasons for each of the choices.
I think that I put "two thousand ten" but I really can't remember.
Don't sweat it because no one else will (except maybe the ladies at the invitation shop)
I'm with Gilneas. We don't say 19 and 10, so we shouldn't say 2000 and 10 either.
I know it sounds funny; mostly because in American English, we say numbers like 300,560 as "three thousand five hundred and sixty" but it is grammatically incorrect. These Bees are smart: it's two thousand ten
I am an ex-math teacher. An and denotes a decimal point. It should be printed the way you originally had it "two thousand ten"
Yikes, I hate being a dissenting opinion.
I'm a graphic artist and I put, and was told to put, "Two Thousand and Ten"
My understanding is because it's the year 2000 and 10 more.
Google wedding invites and you'll see all the examples from professionals have it written this way.
To be honest, no one will probably notice nor care either way.
EDIT: After taking my own advice and looking at different invite websites, it actually seems like even professional invitation designers are torn on this. Some sites had it one way, some had it another. Really, either is probably appropriate so go with what you like.
Part of her email states:
Just to let you know, the year without the “and” is grammatically incorrect. If you want to print it without the “and” it is totally fine, I just want you to know what you are choosing.
Hmm.
Anyway, I do prefer the "two thousand ten," and I NEVER say out loud "two thousand and ten" or whatever. I looked it up (again); it seems either way is correct and that the "and" is closer to British usage. I also see that wedding etiquette and "regular" etiquette seem to differ on this.
::shrug::
@FutureMrsDuff: Don't worry. I like these ladies at the invite shop; they're very nice, they do the best formal invites in the city, and have been doing this a VERY long time. So I thought I'd at least consider their POV before dissenting. Thanks for your input!
Its actually correct either way. Two thousand and ten is the more old-fashioned way of saying it. Two thousand ten is more modern.
People used to say their ages with the "and" ("I'm five and twenty" etc.) back in the day.
I'm using "Two thousand ten" because I prefer how it sounds... If I saw an invite that said "Two thousand and ten" I wouldn't think anything of it! :)
@ mouse - Problem solved! LOL
I am using Two Thousand Ten - but that's my style. Do whatever makes you feel comfortable and let it go.
:)
Well in math and to be totally grammatically correct, you should leave out the "and". Few people actually follow it, and no one really notices the difference when it's said out loud anyways. It'll be accepted either way when printed. Most people stick in the "and" as more of a spacer so allow for the brain to catch up to the mouth when saying things like that. Kind of like an "um" in your sentences. But you don't normally write "um"s or "uh"s in your essays even though your mouth or brain would insert it there.
The choice is entirely up to you. The "and" flows better in the common person's mind, and when they read it, but it's not technically correct.
I wouldn't use "and" - it doesn't make sense to me. We wouldn't use "two thousand and nine", so why "two thousand and ten"?
I guess it's nice of them to point out something they see as a potential problem to you before the invites are printed though.
I looked around at etiquette information about this subject and most places seem to think you should drop the "and." Plus, I just think it sounds better without the "and."
Here's what Mrs. Cupcake said in her post about creating invitations:
5. It’s “Two thousand nine”, not “Two thousand AND nine”.
This is a constant battle with some invitation clients who insist that the year should read “Two thousand and nine”, but grammatically, the proper way of writing the year is “Two thousand nine” — no “and”. This is a pretty common mistake, thus most of your guests think it is written with an “and” too, so ultimately it’s not a big deal if you already included it on your invitations. But, being the crazy OCD designer/typesetter that I am, I am a little crazy about making sure my invitations are grammatically correct and I always notice this now on other people’s invitations. (It’s a curse.)
http://www.weddingbee.com/2009/01/20/twelve-steps-to-creating-diy-wedding-invitations/
Yes, I read Mrs. Cupcake's post. The fact that my invitation shop is so vehemently in the other direction makes me think that "two thousand AND ten" is grammatically correct... to someone, somewhere. She also called and told me that whenever they send an invitation out with "two thousand ten" on it, the invitation companies call them and ask if it's a mistake.
I looked it up (again!) and found that every single invitation I could find, samples, even, have "two thousand and ten." The ones that featured "two thousand ten" seemed to be less formal invitations, or very modern ones.
NO AND! The ladies at the invitation shop are... well, I shouldn't say the word. You would think in their profession they would know better.
In British English, you would use the word "and," but in American English, you would not.
American English generally eliminates letters, words etc. that are deemed excessive
Years
For years up until 2000, separate the four numbers into two pairs of two:
1965 = nineteen sixty-five
1871 = eighteen seventy-one
1999 = nineteen ninety-nine
For this decade, you need to say “two thousand and —-” in British English:
2001 = two thousand and one
2009 = two thousand and nine
http://www.english-at-home.com/speaking/saying-dates-and-numbers-in-english/
I WILL use the "and" for my invitations. I live in a former British colony and we were taught "British English" in school.... eg. "colour" instead of "color", etc.
Although I'm sure hardly anyone will notice either way.....
Just spell it two-zero-one-zero and let your guests figure it out! It's like a puzzle!
Technically "and" does denote a decimal point, but they are pretty commonly used in wedding invitations. I don't think I'd worry about it one way or the other.
two thousand ten = 2010
two thousand and ten = 2000.10
I'm a math teacher :)
@mouse - Honestly, your way makes sense historically. I never quite understood why the year 1910 would have been "nineteen ten" whereas 2010 is "two thousand ten". Why not "twenty ten"?
Interesting discussion. I decided to see what Crane's has to say:
<p style="padding-left: 30px;">In mathematics "and" denotes a decimal point, and since there is no decimal point in the year "2001," it may seem incorrect to use "and." Wedding invitations, however, are not mathematical equations so the use of "and" as a decimal point is irrelevant. On wedding invitations "and" is used simply as a connective word.
I agree with Chartreuse - I'm a professional editor, but I work for a British publication, and we would use two thousand and ten. I've always heard it's two thousand ten for Americans, though.
Maybe you should just throw everyone off and say "Twenty ten"
:) That would be different; we might do that on our invites.
@ mouse - I actually wrote that in the magnet we used as our Save the Date! (We did a scrabble board and tiles and two thousand ten was just too long!)
I have also been stuck on this. As an English, Math teacher I know the and denotes a decimal, but after research and reading these blogs I think I understand. the invitations are formal and are derived from the British form. Thus we use honour instead of honor. To be consistant it then would follow that the "and" WOULD be included as it would be in the Bristish form. So at least for me, I am satisfied and will go with ...and....Good Luck to all of you, happy wedding bells and I hope this is your biggest conflict!!!!!
The way I figure, you wouldn't say "nineteen and ten" for 1910, so why an "and" for 2010? But I doubt anyone would notice or care either way; one might be correct but they both sound good :)
I would use two thousand ten because of what my math teacher used to say, but I don't think that people will notice the "and".
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