(Closed) 1.5 months til wedding…already thinking divorce

posted 4 years ago in Emotional
Post # 121
Member
678 posts
Busy bee

I wouldn’t be able to sleep with that much debt. I would call off the wedding. He hasn’t learned anything from this since he still wants to spend money he doesn’t have. Don’t let him baby-trap you either. How long have you been dating? What is his credit card debt like? How long were you long distance?

Post # 122
Member
7881 posts
Bumble Beekeeper

Aside from the financial stuff, why did he have so much trouble with his schooling? Has anything changed so that he’ll be successful from here on out? Did he learn anything from the whole experience? Academics aren’t everything, but there has to be a reason why he’s failed so many times. 

I am worried for you. 

Post # 123
Member
932 posts
Busy bee
  • Wedding: May 2017

I just read your update. I urge you to please not go through with this wedding. This is a lifetime of debt! What kind of future will you have straddled to this debt?

Are you ok with bringing children into the world with so much financial burden? Will you be able to buy a home? Pre nup or no pre nup, I know you will end up helping him pay. 

I even asked my husband if he would have married me with this much debt and this sort of irresponsibility that lead to it and he said no. I wouldn’t have married him with this much debt as well. Maybe that sounds bad but we value our lives more than that as should you. 

Post # 124
Member
409 posts
Helper bee
  • Wedding: April 2012

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bridesmaidnomore44 :  if you marry him you MUST get a prenup. Love is all wonderful and beautiful but it won’t protect you from getting financially devastated by his debt. Prenup ALL the way.

Post # 125
Member
2691 posts
Sugar bee

He isn’t going to sign a prenup. He already told her he EXPECTS her to pay the debt. I feel for you, OP. Personally, I wouldn’t marry him. He’s throwing all this on you at the last minute and the numbers continue to grow by the day. I also do not feel he is going to last in his field. Anyone who has THAT MUCH TROUBLE with their schooling probably isn’t cut out for a strong lifetime career in that field. Then you’ll be stuck financing another degree for him. The fact that he had a “gap year” and did not work the entire year — what the hell was he doing?? He isn’t responsible and I think he is going to pull you down further and further. Cut your losses and run. The money you lose on the wedding – even if you refund every single airline ticket from your pocket is NOTHING in comparison to the debt you’ll be taking on by tying yourself to this man forever. If the tables were turned, he probably would not marry you either.

Post # 126
Member
1917 posts
Buzzing bee
  • Wedding: May 2016

yeah no, i wouldnt be able to take on that much debt. I would call it off, and if your willing to stay together help him with his finances to start paying it off. But no, there is no way i would agree to help him pay that down unless you were helping with the bare minimum. 

me and hubs pay our own student loan and credit card bills with our own money, we have never helped eachother out with student loan payments. 

Post # 127
Member
207 posts
Helper bee
  • Wedding: June 2018

Best to put the brakes on the wedding. I know this is me, but I have no tolerance for those that put people in financial jeapordy. Why didn’t he tell you the truth? Maybe he was afraid to tell you, but now he has to contend with the lie on top of the debt. Think twice about going forward. P.S. Does that include undergrad debt, living expenses, graduate degree debt, etc.? It seems like too much for one degree. 

Post # 128
Member
1452 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: September 2015

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bridesmaidnomore44 :  I wish people would STOP SAYING DEBT BECOMES YOURS WHEN YOU GET MARRIED. On an emotional level maybe it does. But legally speaking it does NOT. 

There is a thing called separate property and there is a thing called separate debt. In both instances what was yours before you got married stay yours and YOURS ALONE. You may consider a prenup just to hammer that point home. 

Your Fiance and his debtors don’t have a legal leg to stand on if they “expect” you to pay the debt. Could you? Of course you can, it’s not illegal for them to take your money.  But do you HAVE to? They’d love to tell you that you do but you DO NOT. Unless you continue to pay when you are not married, in which case it is possible for you to be deemed as having “ratified” the debt.  Which is why I recommend the prenup to hammer the point home that this $350k is your FI’s separate debt. 

I have no idea why your Fiance seems intent on muddying the waters on the separate debt and trying to drag you down with him. If it were me and I owed that much money, I would be bending over backwards to make sure it stayed my separate debt so that 1) my husband won’t be bogged down with me and 2) now that I have a son I want him to be able to inherit my husband’s property if I die, and not have his money also eaten up by debt (your estate becomes responsible for your debts when you die. No it isn’t all erased. So why would you want to tie up your spouse’s money in your estate IF your estate has so much negative equity like OP’s FI??)

And in conclusion, people, for the love of all law grads who can also have 6-figure debt cuz it’s not just med school, STOP SAYING HIS DEBT BECOMES YOUR DEBT. Again, emotionally speaking yes but legally speaking HELL NO. 

And yeah I wouldn’t marry him. 

Post # 129
Member
744 posts
Busy bee

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camenae :  are you sure this is true in every state?  That his debt won’t become hers. 

Post # 130
Member
1452 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: September 2015

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waiting2bee :  First a “I am a lawyer but I am not your lawyer and this is not legal advice. For advice specific to your situation you need to seek legal advice” disclaimer.  No I haven’t done a comprehensive survey of all 50 states and I don’t practice family law.  That being said, my understanding is that Yes, in every state, debt that you had BEFORE you married is your separate debt. 

When state laws have the subtle difference it’s in how debt is treated if it is incurred AFTER you marry.

In community property states, debts after marriage incurred by either or both spouse is presumed to be community debt.

In other states, debts after marriage with only one spouse’s name on it is STILL considered separate debt, unless it’s for a community necessity like food and rent. Not sure if student loans are considered a necessity but I suspect not. When the law says necessity it generally means necessary for survival. 

Post # 131
Member
1647 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: January 2016

I’m sorry you are going through this.

1. I don’t believe it is ever a good idea to get married when you are contemplating a divorce before the wedding.

2. While the wedding is mostly paid off, losing that money is less than the cost of a divorce.

3. Cancel what you can; get whatever money refunded that you can; see if there are any options to donate things that aren’t refundable.

4. if you are worried about people in your family or your friends who have purchased flights, offer to reimburse the cost of the flights if you are able to do so (and, if it is only a few people)- this is still cheaper than a divorce.

5. realize friends and family will support you and be glad that you did not go through with a wedding when you were already contemplating divorce.

 

re: your update.

1. he still lied about all of this

2. he expects you to continue to support the two of you; expects you to also be paying on his loans; and is insistent on kids. This is entitled and controlling- you deserve better.

3. you have incompatible views on both finances and work ethics- that just spells disaster. I am a first generation college student. I came from an uneducated family with no concept of money management (didn’t have any), college costs, etc. (good, hard-working people, just no experience with education or money). I worked, loaned, scholar-shipped, borrowed my way through. I worked hard to pay off the loans early by taking on extra work (paid off all debt from a doctorate – undergrad and grad school). But, I took on the MINIMUM debt I needed to actually get by- and, by get by, I mean just that.

My son has a doctorate in pharmacy- 18 to 22 credits a semester and he worked during school, worked a ton in the summers, had room-mates, scholarships, lived within his means. While I helped with some tuition expenses, he by far, paid for the bulk of this himself. He bought a car (used) and home all within his first year out of pharmacy school and is getting married in the fall (saved for two years- paying cash). His student loan debt was well under 100,000- he worked hard, over-pays on the debt to pay it down sooner, and did not defer or spread the loans out, as he wanted to reduce the amount he would owe to interest and to be out from under this debt sooner. Three years out of school, even with his other purchases and stockpiling money for the wedding, his loans are 2/3 paid off- and, he has pays over and above the maximum match into his company 401K. While he had debt, his then-girlfriend/now fiance 1. knew about it, 2. saw that he worked hard all through school and after to keep the initial debt manageable and to pay it down, and has seen him make sure to be planning for their future by taking care of those expenses and by putting money away for their future.   

I think my point is, your fiance has made different lifestyle choices- and, this will impact you. If you buy a house while married, and he defaults on the loans, your house is a marital asset and can be taken to pay off the debt. Similarly, while FEDERAL loans are discharged if he should die (or, in some cases, become disabled), PRIVATE loans are not- private loans do not have the same (minimal) protections of the federal loans. If he reduces payments to do income sensitive payments, the interest continues to accrue, as does the time he will be paying on the loans.

He made economic and lifestyle choices which will impact you for the rest of your life, with no real plan on how to take care of this debt, and you had no voice in the decision- you were kept in the dark. RUN. RUN NOW!

I’m sorry, but in your heart, you know that you should not get married now if you are contemplating divorce. It doesn’t make this any less hard, or any less sad, but you should leave.

 

Post # 132
Member
1987 posts
Buzzing bee

Finances are the #1 couples fight over and divorce over. Aside from everything else that has been pointed out- you guys just have COMPLETELY different views on financial responsibility. And that is such a problem for so many reasons. He is completely irresponsible when it comes to financial decisions, and TBH, sounds like he’s just irresponsible in general.

He was on academic probation, but just kept taking out loans and not getting a job? He bought a car? Went to an expensive, private, out of state school? 2 years of studying to pass the boards, with no job?

Honestly, this sounds like he has little/no work ethic, doesn’t understand a damn thing about money, and has just been racking up debt the last 8 years like money grows on trees. Anyone with some financial responsibility would have gotten a job, gotten roommates, looked for scholarships or a less expensive school, worked through school, etc. 

Does he really just struggle with school, or does he not put the effort in? I don’t understand how he has had so many academic issues when he has NOTHING else to focus on. No job, no kids, nothing else to steal his focus. Is it an issue where he really does give it ‘his all’ and just can’t pass the classes? Or he just doesn’t give a shit and pisses away his time? 

I would NOT get married to this guy. I would NEVER, LEGALLY SIGN MY SELF UP TO BE ATTACHED AND RESPONSIBLE FOR THIS MAN’S CHOICES! If he goes out and takes out a loan to buy a new sports car- YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE! If he walks away and defaults on these loans, YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE! If you get divorced, YOU WILL STILL BE PARTIALLY RESPONSIBLE!! 

Even if he hadn’t lied and didn’t have so much debt, you guys look at money SO differently. Is he willing to admit that you would need to be responsible for 100% of the finances in the marriage? Hell, he shouldn’t even have a debit card access. Do you even want to have to be 100% responsible for all financial decisions, because your husband is this irresponsible? That’s like having a child.

Speaking of children— NO. just NO WAY. He is FAR too irresponsible to be a dad (financially and otherwise). 

Does he think that because your parents are wealthy, his debt is just going to get paid off? Or your parents will just pay for your kids? 

He sounds like he’s just been living the high life, racking up debt, assuming that you/your parents will take care of it. He EXPECTS you to give him children, EXPECTS you to pay off his debt. 

All of this would be a 100% deal breaker for me. 

Minimally, I would be calling a great lawyer right now and understanding what you can do to legally protect yourself from this guy. But really, I would call things off right now. 

Post # 133
Member
2691 posts
Sugar bee

Also bear in mind that everything you purchase as a married couple will have to be in your name. He won’t be able to buy a scooter with a debt load that heavy and won’t get any type of financing FOR YEARS. So while your debt is yours and his debt is his, I potentially see yours ballooning as well since you would bear the brunt of things down the road. I venture a guess you’ve covered most of the wedding expenses? Envision years and years of doing just that. 

Post # 134
Member
1714 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: September 2018

View original reply
bridesmaidnomore44 :  

hard words coming.

Firstly, it is insane that he has never worked. Especially in times he was not studying (and wtf, he wasnt studying because he was in academic dire straights. So he was a bad student AND a lazy worker!) It speaks of a very very bad work ethic. With this amount of debt you need someone with an EXCELLENT work ethic and someone who is very motivated. Apparently he is neither.

I also feel like perhaps, unconciously, knowing your background, he was kinda thinking you and your family were going bail him out of this financial mess. Sweetheart, I do not mean this unkindly, but I would entertain the thought for a moment that he sees you as his knight-ess in shiny good credit armour.

Speaking of credit: yeah. you need to see credit reports. Who knows what else is lurking there…

OP, even in love and in years of a relationship this man is not financially responsible or compatible to you. He was dishonset, ridiculously lazy and comes with so much debt it would cripple you both. Add at least a suspicion that he thinks you are going to rescue him as you come from a somewhat wealthy family and it appears he wanted to lock you down by having children quickly (to perhaps motivate your parents to helping more financially?)

He wants a magic wand for all of this to go away. I think he thinks that would be you.  

Do not do this.  

 

Post # 135
Member
1227 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: July 2018 - Fremont, CA

I hardly ever give this advice, but PLEASE do not marry this man. I’m so sorry and so worried about you!

 

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