(Closed) 8 years. No proposal

posted 4 years ago in Waiting
Post # 31
Member
7268 posts
Busy Beekeeper

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northwinds :  I get what you’re saying, no offense taken :). My issue with “why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free” is that it is usually thrown out as a blanket statement or universal truth. Of course there are some men who think this way–there are women who think this way too I’m sure–but I wouldn’t want to be in a relationship with them, even if I was savvy enough to cajole them into marriage. I think the phrase is more useful in business transactions than in human relationships.

I definitely agree with you that we all need to value ourselves. There’s nothing more important. But to me valuing yourself isn’t about whether you live with your SO before or after marriage, or whether you put out on the first date or on your wedding night. It’s about not allowing your partner to take you for granted or treat you badly. It’s about having the courage to say “I would rather be single for the rest of my life than continue in a relationship with a person who takes me for granted.”

Post # 32
Member
1135 posts
Bumble bee

I think you should propose. If he says yes, then yay! The waiting is over! You’re engaged!

If he says no, then you’ll have your answer and you can stop wasting your time and making excuses for him.

Post # 33
Member
299 posts
Helper bee

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tiffanybruiser :  I agree. No woman, man, or child deserves to be taken advantage of, for granted, abused, emotionally abused, or treated with disregard. I would also rather be single than to put up with this just to be in a relationship. I don’t believe one’s value is based on sexual choices, but is having the self esteem to not allow poor treatment and being strong enough to say no to things that are unacceptable. If a woman really wants marriage and is unhappy with a man’s elusive, dismissal behavior and disregard, yet she allows herself to be strung along while continuing with “marriage-like” living conditions despite that, then I do feel that man is doing exactly what that phrase implies, and she is letting him.

To me, a situation being OK or not for a woman is based on what she is truly comfortable with. There are some women who really aren’t into marriage themselves and are really fine with this, and if both parties are happy with no hidden resentment—not even a tad—then there is absolutely nothing wrong with it at all. Maybe she was married before and sees no reason to do it again, but does like companionship. That’s totally fine.

But if she has any resentment or feeling of being used, is being jerked around, yet still allows the situation to not only continue but to expand, then to me, it’s on her to take control of her destiny.

I don’t mean this as any judgement—I know it’s hard to convey tone over an internet post. I think the phrase does apply to the particular threads where the guys are not stepping up, have no intention to step up, and are leaving the women hanging and confused, since these women do want to be married, and because of it, get head games instead. This type of guy has a girlfriend who cooks for him, attends his needs, raises his child, changes the diapers, does his laundry, cleans his house, takes care of daily details, and provides pleasure. So since he has no desire to make her his wife and disregards her [opposite] needs and feelings, then yes, he fits the phrase, because in his mind, he’s got it already without having to marry her, so why marry. He gets away with it, and all he has to do is put up with what he sees as an occasional “whine” which he quickly dismisses. (but her “whine” is  justifiable of course!!) 

Luckily though, not all men feel this way or see this as acceptable behavior. I just hate to see women or anybody being used and treated shabbily. 🙂

 

Post # 35
Member
5304 posts
Bee Keeper

Is he usually good at keeping his word in other ways to you? If you can trust that he means ’10 months or less’ then I’d be willing to give it to him. 

As for TTC, I agree you should put engagement first, as for TTC when engaged, I would make sure we had a firm wedding date set and the planning started- and also figured out the logistics so you won’t be too far along to travel overseas if you get pregnant before the actual date. Personally I’d want to TTC after the wedding or only a month or 2 shy of it. (wouldn’t be a big deal to me not to drink at the wedding if I was 6 weeks pregnant or so). 

I am rolling my eyes at your guy for wanting to ‘surprise’ you. ffs. I went through this with my own DH and I’m baffled how guys who wait years still want intelligent women to somehow not see it coming? IMO they’re the ones that let the ‘surprise’ ship sail by waiting so long! If the surprise element is important to the partner (personally I don’t think it’s necessary), then they should propose sooner not later. This isn’t a dealbreaker, just something I side-eye as a having your cake and wanting to eat it too. 

Post # 36
Member
7268 posts
Busy Beekeeper

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RobbieAndJuliahaha :  +1000 to all of this.

I also think it’s kinda rich that “he had never previously been bothered about getting married,” “it’s not something he deemed necessary,” yet claims that it’s important for him to give you an uber traditional proposal with a surprise ring/hollywood moment? I would keep an eye on that…

Not tryin to be too negative though, it definitely sounds like a promising update! I hope it all works out for you bee, but def don’t TTC until you are married (or very close to being).

Post # 37
Member
2165 posts
Buzzing bee
  • Wedding: NJ

I was just thinking, how often do we see in the paper or on the net, pictures of old couples, with a caption “here is Joe Schmerman and his girlfriend of 65 years, Sue Silver, and their 3 kids”

Never, right? Because Sue leaves Joe way before that point. Or Joe dumps Sue after year 10 and marries Jane.

Post # 38
Member
1409 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: September 2015

I strongly side-eye the phrase “one day”.  In my experience that just means “Anything to shut this person up right now, and I’ll get amnesia later.”

he had never previously been bothered about getting married just because it’s not something he ever felt necessary,”

It’s only something that the woman he (supposedly) loves wants more than anything else in life.  Dude you right, it’s not necessary and nothing to be bothered with at all.

One last thing, I’m so sick of the “grew up with divorced parents” excuse.  Oh boo-hoo.  When you’re out the door, make a right, the bridge is right there, please get over it.  Plenty of people have grown up around people who’ve been in horrible car accidents and how many of those people choose to never drive??

Post # 40
Member
10190 posts
Sugar Beekeeper
  • Wedding: City, State

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charlottejx1 :  

‘Pre-engagement’ time?

House stress?

If it wasn’t so sad to watch, it would be laughable.  OP, you’re on Cloud Nine after he gave you a giant hand full of nothing.  You are no closer to being engaged at this moment than you were before.

He noticed you being droopy, didn’t like it, set about fixing it–to improve *his* life. So he tossed you a bunch of argle gargle about pre engagements–OP, that’s not a thing.

The one thing he did get right–no more annoying and childish hinting.  If you can’t discuss your future with him, openly and whenever *you* need to–why are you with him?

 

Post # 41
Member
616 posts
Busy bee

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charlottejx1 :  Pre-engagement is called dating and you’ve had 8 years of that.  After 8 years he should be very sure of whether or not he wants to marry you, instead he needs more time?  Sorry bee, but you just were fed more excuses with no actual steps towards marriage so I don’t see this as a step forward.  

Post # 42
Member
299 posts
Helper bee

What caught my eye is when he said “…he had never previously been bothered about getting married just because it’s not something he ever felt necessary” which says he didn’t feel it’s necessary because he’s been OK with the way it currently is, because it’s like he’s already married without the marriage, house renovation and all. There’s actually something special that comes along with marriage though, extra little things that a man does when he’s a husband, even though he’s been a fantastic boyfriend. He might not know this yet.

Try to let yourself relax a bit on this for a little while, but without excusing him. Keep your eyes open, but try to enjoy each other. For now don’t hint or nag, but also don’t forget what you want. In the future if nothing changes, don’t permanently settle for the way things are, unless you are OK with having him but not as a husband. If you weren’t wanting marriage, you wouldn’t have this frustration since you have him with you anyway,  but it’s OK to feel that it’s not enough for you. He shouldn’t be given the green light when you are hurting.

If you hadn’t been together so long already I’d say to lighten up a bit so that you both could enjoy each other and do fun things that draw a couple together and don’t push. Many times when a woman is so intense on the subject of marriage, it tends to make the man back off a bit, particularly when he’s not ready and feels the pressure from her. 

Unfortunately, waiting for him to do something about this just puts you in a bit of a powerless position while you ride it out, but you’ll just have to see what happens and if he will step up. 🙂

Post # 44
Member
24 posts
Newbee

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charlottejx1 :  Do not have a baby with him. If marriage is a deal breaker for you, I would go ahead and move on soon.

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