Post # 346
- Wedding: April 2017 - City, State
And that is totally legitimate. As I said, people’s concerns about their economic wellbeing are absolutely understandable and I wouldn’t expect people to not have that in mind when they vote.
And let’s not paint the picture that democrats are all a bunch of rich city folk with absolutely no financial concerns. They also struggle with jobs, paying for healthcare and everything people on the right deal with. Money struggles are not limited to red states and rust belts. The difference, at least that I see, is his economic vision is not enough for a lot of people to ignore the rest of his vision. For some, their personal plight is paramount and there’s nothing wrong with that, but that’s not the criteria everyone uses.
Post # 347
I know in my county, there are a lot of people who voted Trump who had previously voted Obama, twice. I know it’s hard to understand, but there a lot of people who vote solely on who is best for the economy, and not for social reasons at all. I know people who will tell you they are prolife and don’t believe in gay marriage, yet they voted for Obama twice, and before him, against W. Bush, twice. It’s because the democrats were “for the working man.” Well, Trump targeted that demographic, and it worked. My county and state went red, and they ALWAYS go blue. I’m floored.
I’m a Christian, and I believe in the seperation of church and state. I love my Muslim neighbors, and I believe that they belong here because of what my country stands for. There are muslim fundamentalists who want to hurt our country, and yes that is a concern that needs to be taken seriously, the same way Christian fundamentalist groups who plan violence against abortion clinics need to be taken seriously. I don’t believe that average muslims have anything to worry about. Trump will not be running the country alone, and he will have people helping him make decisions. At least, that is my hope. I’m not excited about having Trump as my president, but I’m hopeful.
Post # 348
My legitimate question on the jobs and economy side of things, what has Trump done for American jobs and manufacturing while running all of his businesses? He was in a unique position of being able to support these communities, but what did he do? Isn’t it hypocritical now to blame the government?
We have some Australian business men here who are passionate about Australian owned and made. They’re always on about the benefits and why we should pay more for it etc etc. it wouldn’t surprise me to see them run for office on that sort of platform. I’ve never seen anything similar from Trump (but I don’t follow him that closely, so interested to know if that’s something he has always been a supporter of).
I do agree that America has moved past being that sort of manufacturing economy and needs to be supporting jobs growth in other areas. Even if they do set up a bunch of factories with amazing wages and benefits (which frankly sounds like a pipe dream), the rise in cost of living etc would likely cancel it all out…
Post # 349
“What have these people in the Rust Belt, Manufacturing, and Factories been thinking for the last 30 years? I’m African American, and I can remember my (grand)parents telling me before I graduated from high school in 1999 that you have to go to college (further your education) in order to survive in the upcoming years. Their favorite thing to say to me was that “In a few years, you’ll only be able to get a job pumping gas with just a high school diploma.”
Why didn’t these people get the same message? Was it their elders, local, regional, state, or national leaders that failed to prepare them for this reality?
If they think Donald Trump (or any president for that a) is going to save them, they are going to be in a perpetual state of disappointment/despair until their dying days.”
Post # 350
Well, not everyone is made for college. My brother is an example. He can build stuff, but he can’t go to class, take notes and study. He just can’t.
So that leaves us with trade schools. Trade schools still cost money. Its no free ride, though it is cheaper than a college education. You could always become an apprentice, of coures.
However, back 30 years ago people graduated from high school and got a job at the local factory. These people couldn’t afford college. Retail, which is left, in my area doesn’t give you a good salery to live on.
I dont think factory jobs will come back but something has to happen to the rust belt.
Post # 351
- Wedding: April 2017 - City, State
I appreciate you trying to help me understand the viewpoint from the other side. I admit I have a hard time understanding how someone can put aside the things he said and his other policies and vote for him, but I get that he made promises that gave people hope that their communities might see an economic resurgence under his presidency.
Post # 352
VictorianChick : “I dont think factory jobs will come back but something has to happen to the rust belt.”
It’d be nice for something to happen to help the people in the Rust Belt. I would like for something to happen to help my family there. However, I don’t think it’s going to happen, especially with technology getting more advanced all the time. People these days need to become more educated or they will not be able to get good jobs. It’s already happening, and there is no turning back.
Even if we open up the coal mines and destroy the planet, that is only a temporary solution. Coal is going to run out, and then technology will be even more advanced. People can’t get a good job with a high school diploma anymore, and that is not going to change.
I think what needs to change is the culture in the Rust Belt, with a heavier emphasis on education. The world isn’t going to magically change to make this region relevant again. They have to do what they can for themselves. I also understand that education is expensive, but people can take out loans. Many of us have educational loans we are paying off. It’s expensive, but if you go to a state school you minimize cost (you definitely shouldn’t go to one of those for-profit schools), and if you get a degree in a field that is sought after (not the follow your dreams crap), you’ll be able to pay loans off while working. You can also work either full or part-time while taking classes part or full-time, so that you don’t have to take out as many loans.
People need to do what they can to lift themselves up as much as possible. I know this sounds callous, but I just can’t see anything that can help people put themselves in a better place other than education.
Post # 353
I feel like there is a huge disconnect in our country in our understanding of how Trump got elected. Too many people think it’s because people want abortion and gay marriage over turned. Of course that might be why some people voted Trump, but for the majority, that was not the reason.
Abortion: Roe Vs. Wade has ZERO chance of being overturned. Why? Votes. Republicans just got in. That would be the fast track to losing in 2020. We don’t live in a culture and society that wants abortions illegal. Making it illegal would give every hack who has ever flunked out of medical school an opportunity to make big bucks with underground clinics, and then you would have dead women and babies. No one wants that. I’m prolife, and for that reason, I don’t want abortion clinics closed. Making abortion illegal will not stop it from happening. Personally, I’d like to see some compromise on partial birth abortion’s legality, but that is a debate for another day/thread.
Gay marriage: Again, no way it’s getting overturned. That would once again endanger the 2020 presidency. Trump and the republicans will not waste time and energy trying to overturn something that the society/culture has as a majority says it wants. Ultimately, everything liberals said about gay marriage is true: It doesn’t affect anyone except the people who want to get married. While there may be people in middle America who still aren’t comfortable/don’t understand LGBTQ issues, they are not going to vote Trump out if he creates jobs and an economy boom because the two guys across the street got married. It won’t be his focus.
I know people are concerned about Pence, but he was chosen as VP to pander to the far religious right, and those folks are the ones that going to be the most disappointed in Trump’s presidency I think.
Immigration: This is probably the biggest area people are going to part ways on, because there probably will be some changes. I don’t want to see a wall built, and I don’t see how that will be economically feasible, but border security needs to be increased/enforced. There was already an increase in deported illegals under Obama’a administration, and there is a reason for that. There are real concerns about our borders, like the fact that drug cartels get the majority of their firarms from U.S. border towns because it’s so difficult to obtain them in Mexico. Personally, I would like to see amnesty granted to all the undocumented people who are already here, before we start stricter deportation practices/tighten our borders.
Overall, I’d just like to see people work together on the issues that our country is faced with. That’s hard to do with the constant partisan butthurt on BOTH sides of the aisle.