Post # 16
limelemonlime : I think the bees are being way to harsh.
Firstly, alcohol is not a liquid truth serum for everyone. Everyone reacts differently to alcohol. I will put my hand up and say how Emily acted, sounds exactly what happens to me if I get drunk. If I drink too much, I will flip out and verbally attack those close to me, especially my husband. I will say horrible things that I in no way mean, not even subconsiously. I will also suddenly become fiendish for alcohol and want more and more. For years I wanted desperately to be one of those people that can have a few too many and just be a happy drunk, but I eventually learnt it’s just not possible, and severly limited or stopped my drinking.
Now, that doesn’t excuse Emily for her behaviour, however I wouldn’t assume that she meant what she said, and I certainly wouldn’t assume that she remembers what she said.
If you don’t want to forgive her then that’s well within your right. But if you otherwise enjoy the friendship and don’t want to throw it away, then I suggest the following:
Firstly, when I would have a “blackout” night, since I didn’t remember it, I would try and act like no one else remembered it either. It was just easier on my psyche. You need to calmly confront her about the awful things she said, preferably in person. Her reaction will tell you if she remembers it or not.
Secondly, I would then limit hanging out with her to non-drinking events.
Post # 17
I’m alarmed that she got that drunk that quickly. I’ve been to those sorts of fests and while there are a few drunken folks staggering about, most people can pace themselves appropriately to enjoy the event. To be THAT person is just juvenile and embarrassing. I’d avoid her for a few weeks then see how I feel about it after some time has passed.
Post # 18
Good Lord bee, l hope you are not drinking at all anymore. It’s not entirely clear since you say ‘ severely limited or stopped) What
What you have documented sounds really alarming, and saying ‘ l don’t mean any of it -even subconsciously” ( well, the point of subconscious is , you know, not conscious, so you cannot with any truth say you know about intention) is not exactly acceptable to those on the receiving end.
Even less acceptable is your blithe commentary on it’s being easier ‘on your psyche ‘ to act like it never happened !
l hope my post is redundant now. Sorry for tangent OP.
Post # 19
elderbee : Oh, yeah I don’t drink basically at all now. Rarely (once every couple of months?), I’ll have a sip of champagne for a toast, or one private drink with my husband, but I don’t ever drink to get tipsy or drunk. I was referring to when I was much younger and hadn’t yet learnt my lesson.
Definitely that kind of behaviour is completely unacceptable, and I’m certainly not excusing it. My point is that people react to alcohol different. PP were saying that she’d have to mean what she was saying, and I am just saying that she may not have truly meant any of it. Some people shouldn’t drink alcohol. I’m one of them, and it sounds to me like Emily is too.
That’s why I said if OP wants to stay friends with her, I don’t think any of their activities should involve drinking. Realistically, Emily should probably stop drinking entirely, if she can behave that way after a few drinks.
Just re-read and I see why you wrote what you did, sorry I did not explain myself well.
I was not condoning any of my past actions, and do not behave that way anymore. The reason I was mentioning it was because when I was reading OP’s story, the way Emily reacted to the alcohol reminded me exactly of how I used to when I drank. Emily didn’t just sound like a standard person who had too much to drink, she sounded like she has a poor reaction to alcohol in general. When I said PP were being too harsh, I meant they were being harsh to OP by assuming that what Emily said to her, is what Emily actually feels. That’s why I said OP has every right to not want to be in this friendship anymore, but if she does still want to be, it’s probably best to not include drinking activities.
There’s a perception that “angry drunks” mainly apply to men – but it absolutely manifests in women too and it’s not because we are naturally angry or messed up or anything – it’s just literally the way alcohol reacts with our brains. The only cure, is to not drink.
Post # 20
That makes much more sense, thank you .
OP this sounds really applicable to Emily. Stay well clear if alchohol involved!
Post # 21
rosadiaz : Thank you for sharing your story. I think it’s very brave of you to do.
Post # 22
I know that certain types of alcohol can make some people really aggressive…
A friend of mine can’t drink a certain brand of bourbon, it makes her insanely aggressive when she is in fact the most calm and placid person.
I wonder if beer has this effect on her?
I probably wouldn’t end the friendship, I’d just not go drinking with her anymore. It might take some time before you can hang out with her again.
Post # 23
I wouldn’t be friends with this woman, you don’t get a personality transplant when you’re drunk. Alcohol lowers your inhibitions, but I’m not buying that you can become a totally different person and spew abuse that has never popped into your head before just because you had a few too many beers.
The fact that when you told her about this the next day she completely glossed over it and instead of apologising wanted sympathy for her drunken injuries shows she’s not a good person. I would be mortified if I behaved the way she did. Her friend’s reaction also makes me believe this is normal behaviour for her, or she’s not surprised she was abusive towards you since she doesn’t really like you anyway.
Post # 24
- Wedding: October 2019 - UK
Some people are nasty drunk, that does not mean that what they say is what they truly think. The only thing you learn from a person who is a nasty drunk is that they are a nasty drunk and if that makes you uncomfortable then make sure you don’t go places with them where they might get drunk.
Ending a friendship over it happening once I think is a little extreme. If she has been a lovely person up to this point then give her the benefit of the doubt. If it really bothers you, then text her to meet up for coffee and have a honest conversation with her. Tell her she said some horrible things to you and you would like to know if there is some truth in what she said. Maybe if she is confronted with all the horrible things she said she might think twice before drinking so much again.
This is not a conversation you should have over text.
Post # 25
As my brother says, “A drunk man’s words are a sober man’s thoughts.”
I remember a similar thing happened with a girl I used to work with. It was a small company and we were all reasonably youngish, and our boss decided to take us out for a treat because the business was doing really well.
We went for a cruise, dinner, dancing and lots of alcohol, and then carried on drinking at a pub afterwards. Our office manager, whom I had always thought of as a lovely girl and whom I had always got along great with and never heard her with a cross word to say about anyone had had a lot to drink. She started saying all these bitchy things to people sitting at the table, people she works with, subordinates. She started criticising my taste in music, lashed out at one guy for having no drive or ambition in his life… all very mean, very condescending. It was absolutely cringey.
All that alcohol does is lower your inhibitions and take away your impulse control. Those thoughts and feelings are there – we just don’t give into them most of the time.
I’d be very concerned about your friend being very two-faced, and I’d definitely start keeping my distance from now on.
Post # 26
rosadiaz : I disagree with much of your post but I’m glad you took action.
ariesscientist : I agree completely. Alcohol is not a personality transplant vehicle. And there is a reason that the phrase in vino veritas has been a saying for millennia. While it’s nice to believe she really didn’t mean what she said, actual studies do not back this up. We all have thoughts we barely want to admit to ourselves let alone anyone else. Alcohol simply removes the inhibition we would feel when sober because you care less about the consequences of voicing those thoughts.
I really hate to see the rationalization of alcohol induced behavior as, “oh, she was just drinking, she’s not really like that”. BS. That’s the kind of thought process that kept drunk drivers on the road for so long.
OP, you can bet your bottom dollar that there’s a piece of her that believes what she said. In particular, a comment on your engagement ring and dog, I’m not buying that it just occurred to her…when she was drunk. And the fact that she didn’t immediately own up to it speaks volumes about her character. She’s obviously done this before. A person I’d still be friends with would know herself, and would have taken the initiative to ask you if she did anything wrong and apologize. She couldn’t even apologize when confronted with the truth. She’s more comfortable around you now, which I think explains why this happened now rather than at earlier times in your friendship.
Obviously I feel very strongly about this.
Post # 27
I definitely would not continue a friendship with someone who acted that way towards me. Life’s too short to be friends with someone and wondering if they actually like you as a person or not. But I would invite her to coffee and tell her everything that she said (since she “doesn’t remember”) and explain that in light of those feelings you do not wish to continue the friendship.
Post # 28
Friend getting black-out drunk and being mean to me, next morning is horribly remorseful and either promises herself not to drink to excess (and follow through!) if this is a one off or takes herself to treatment if alcohol is an ongoing problem= forgivable.
Friend getting black-out drunk and being mean to me, acts like it’s no big deal, focuses on her superficial lip injury, doesn’t ask about what happened, best friend acts like it’s either no biggie or no surprise or both = friendship ending.
Post # 29
I also think that some people really do have bad reactions to alcohol and behave ways and say things they don’t necessarily mean. However, I also think by your late 20s she should know better than to end up in that situation. This isn’t college anymore, you’re too old to have to take care of the sloppy drunk friend.
Post # 30
Finally this older woman who was sitting at our same picnic table and was overhearing all this craziness said to me “When they turn on you, it’s time to take them home.”
Love this – smart woman!
I would not continue a friendship with someone like this. Even if she apologizes, I personally would never be able to trust her. The things she said to you were awful. If I ever got that drunk, I would want to know everything I said/did because I would be so mortified. If someone told me I’d said those horrible things, I would be falling over myself apologizing and it would be a massive wake-up call that I should quit drinking. It seems this is not the first time she’s done something like this.