Post # 76
jannigirl : “I am staunchly pro-life, from conception to natural death”
Do you oppose the death penalty? Do you oppose war/lethal military action under any circumstances? Are you for the prohibition of firearms to reduce violent and accidental deaths? Are you for universal healthcare?
If your answer to all those questions is “yes”, I applaud your consistency and have to give you credit for being steadfast in your beliefs even if I don’t completely agree with you
Post # 77
We all have the freedom to choose and you have the freedom to change your mind. You don’t however, have the right to judge anyone on their choice to have an abortion rather than adopt. I think that’s the very important difference.
Post # 78
SisterJude : Yes, this. It’s okay to decide abortion is no longer something you’d consider. It’s NOT OK to then preach that viewpoint to everybody else.
Post # 79
DancinDarlin : “I really just wish it wasn’t so commonplace and accepted, and don’t support the view of “a woman can do what she wants with HER body” because to me it goes beyond her body, it’s another human life.”
But the whole thing is her body, that’s HER mass of cells/embryo/fetus/fertilised egg. Pregnancy and childbirth are incredible, but being pro-life when it comes to termination just makes no sense. What about HER life? Why is the bundle of cells multiplying inside of her more important than she is? Pro-life is such a large contradiction, because it attempts to take away the rights of women. Women have lives too.
You can still be pro-choice but wish that termination was less common.
Post # 80
BubblesandCupcakes : this.
Realising I am actually pro choice took a while for me.
ive struggled with the issues of abortion for years and decided that for me (other than in certain circumstances) I couldn’t morally justify having an abortion. And I thought that made my stance pro-life.
It never occurred to me that I would ever want to stop another woman making her own choice. And I never found that contradicted with feeling very pro-life.
…then I realised that the fact I’m willing to put my own personal feelings to one side so others can choose actually makes me pro-choice.
My view hasn’t in itself changed. I just realised that I can be personally pro life and pro choice, what I’m NOT (which I think many pro life activists etc are) is anti-choice.
And for me that’s the actual issue, whether as an individual We believe our sense of morality is so superior to another human that means we can decide what’s best for them and their unborn child/baby/foetus/embryo etc.
Post # 81
When I was a small child my mom was super prolife. She volunteered for a prolife organization and we literally would go to rallies and hand out literature with pictures of dead babies on it. As time went on, she became much less conservative and realized things aren’t always so black and white. Now, her position is that she personally doesn’t like abortion, but understands it’s necessary to provide safe care and options for women to decide what to do with their bodies. If that isn’t a change- I don’t know what it!
Post # 82
Of course you can change YOUR views on abortion, and everything else under the sun…but please allo everyone else have THEIR own views on abortion.
Post # 83
Yes, it can happen for people to change their views on important subjects like abortion.
Is it possible for MY views to change? Never. I have always been and will always be pro-life. And you’re darn right that’s anti-choice. It’s not just a mother’s body, it’s a baby we’re talking about here. “Fetus,” “clump of cells,” whatever you want to call it to de-humanize it and rationalize away the termination of a life, it doesn’t matter to me.
Post # 84
I was pro life before I got pregnant, and an even more so now. I was fortunate to have my first ultrasound at 4 weeks. Which is actually when the “ball of cells has been alive for two weeks. That ball of cells had a heartbeat, and I saw it with my own eyes. It was a baby even at that early stage. The heart starts beating eight days after conception. It’s miraculous. It’s not a raisin. It’s a baby.
I don’t want to judge or condemn anyone who has had an abortion, but I do feel really sorry for those that have.
Post # 85
sparklies16 : Please do not “feel sorry” for me. If that is not patronizing I do not know what is. Having an abortion was one of the best choices I have made in my life, and it helped *me* go on to have a life. I do not want anyone’s pity.
Also, though this is neither here nor there, just a point – the heart does not have all four chambers or a “beat” until 6-8 weeks after conception. What you are describing are the irregular electrical impulses (leading to random twitching) of heart cells, which is around 18 days after conception.
Post # 86
I guess we will never stop going around and around about this topic. I don’t understand what is so hard for pro-lifers to understand about the issue: if you don’t want an abortion don’t have one. But just because you personally have a religious or other conviction that life begins at conception, doesn’t mean others do. All the Supreme Court cases used SCIENCE to determine when abortions would be allowed. Clearly, our laws are attempting to follow current science on this issue. Religion or personal conviction is not how we make decisions on this particular issue in the US, although it clearly colors the issue and the justices have attempted to address convictions, but use science as the basis for at what point the state has an interest in the life of the unborn.
So as OP asked, of course it’s OK to change your beliefs, after thinking about them, whether that’s pro-choice or pro-life. But it’s not OK to think this is a black and white issue and it should be outlawed outright because your religion or your feelings say so. Clearly what trimester the woman is in is a determining factor, and also the fact that other women need access for reasons you might not be able to fathom.
Post # 87
DancinDarlin : Women will still seek illegal abortions. And even try and do it themselves. This has been clearly shown in Canadian and US history, and in parts of the world where abortion is illegal. Or if they are forced to continue a pregnancy, those babies are not guaranteed life once born or a safe refuge.
All making abortion illegal will do is end up in dead fetuses AND as well as a lot of dead women who had unsafe abortions or were afraid to seek treatment when they had complications because of the threat of criminal charges, leaving children without mothers, husbands without wives, siblings without sisters, parents without their daughters, friends without their friends. I don’t see what is pro-life about condoning the death of so many girls and women.
Post # 88
RayKay : This. One of my friends has a saying…. “Pro-life until you’re born. Once you’re born, you’re on your own!” Or that might have been George Carlin. 🙂 In any event, it’s true. Pro-lifers want birth no matter the consequence because it’s life. But it’s not a cut and dried issue. Some women will die from complications related to being pregnant. Some fetuses or babies are no longer viable. Some women will be raped. Some women need this abortion so that they do not fall into poverty (or fall into it further) because they can’t support a child. Some women want an abortion for whatever reason. Pro-choice is the way to show compassion to other women and respect for their circumstances, even if you don’t understand or endorse them.
Post # 89
Of course it’s OK for your opinion to change. I’m sure there’s other people who have flipped from against abortion to for it. It’s just part of growing older, sometimes new information or experiences change how you feel about things.
Personally, I wouldn’t have an abortion unless the pregnancy was the result of rape. But that’s because I know myself and I think I’d regret giving up a baby more than sruggling along to raise it. I’ve always felt that way. However, and it’s a big HOWEVER, I believe it’s a woman’s right to choose and I would NEVER take away what I believe is an individual right.
Whenever I hear people use religion as their platform to support their “pro-life” stand it just makes me laugh. You can believe whatever you want, and so can everyone who also identifies with your religion, but other people shouldn’t have to live their lives as you would, just like you wouldn’t want to live as they do. I’m using “you” in place of “one”, not speaking to anyone specifically.
It’s OK to choose not to exercise a right, but it’s not OK to take away someone else’s option to exercise a right. Little girls deserve to grow up knowing they’re in control of what happens to their bodies.
Post # 90
bearbear1 : I am very pro-choice, and when I was younger I would have absolutely terminated a preganancy.
Then I hit about 24 (am 27 now) and realized that I considered myself a “full adult” able to take proper responsibility for my own actions and would not terminate a pregnancy from that point, but I still respect other people’s decision to do so
However, it was a moot point, because when I decided I was responsible enough to have sex, I was also responsible enough to make sure I was on BCP and using condoms until I was in a steady, monogomous relationship with my future husband after discussing children (still on BCP and will use condoms as well.. though not as frequently)
The whole pro-life/pro-choice debate confuses me because really it’s treating a symptom. What we actually need is better sex education (abstinence is not enough!) so that less women find themselves having to decide if they are pro-life or pro-choice at all.