(NWR) Republicans unveil replacement for the ACA

posted 3 years ago in The Lounge
Post # 61
Member
1148 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: May 2017

F*cking Rep Meadows, scum of the earth: “there’s already a federal law..if you show up in a hospital, you get coverage”. He makes me think violent things. Anyway what he’s saying is “yeah less poor people will have insurance but they can go to the emergency room if it’s necessary”

Post # 62
Member
1148 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: May 2017

Republican politicians will kill you for more money. They and their donors are getting 200k tax cut every year and the 90% are getting $0 and less are going to be insured. The poorest of us will go bankrupt and more will die, all for the tax cut, no other reason.

Post # 63
Member
2019 posts
Buzzing bee

younikkitome :  Not what I said. As an example, I used the right to bear arms. Which means you have the right, as an american citizen to bear arms. As another example, you have the right to vote as an american citizen. 

You don’t have a right to clean water. You don’t have a right to food. You pay for those things (just like you would pay for a gun, should you choose to own one). 

Post # 64
Member
2003 posts
Buzzing bee
  • Wedding: May 2016

honestly trumps healthcare bill doesnt sound much better then obamas… 

Post # 65
Member
1039 posts
Bumble bee

italianbride0508 :  Actually the Supreme Court disagrees with you and has ruled that it is within the purview of the federal government to initiate policies that perserve clean air and and clean water initiatives as well as regulate CO2 emissions. So they do have the authority to do that.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/03/washington/03scotus.html

In other words, yes, citizens do have the right to clean air and clean water and it is within the federal government’s rights and duties to mandate those initiatives if they deem it necessary.

Post # 66
Hostess
9672 posts
Buzzing Beekeeper
  • Wedding: March 2014 - Chicago, IL

italianbride0508 :  By all means, would you want to raise your children in Flint, MI? Because that’s what is going to happen.

Post # 67
Member
1148 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: May 2017

FutureDrAtkins :  people like her don’t care unless it personally affects them. So she probably wouldn’t agree until her children are poisoned, and if we continue down this path it WILL happen.

And lol to guns> clean and safe drinking water, you have to be idiotic or delusional to not realize what is more of a human right. I doubt the founding fathers knew we would be fracking our country to death.

Post # 68
Member
1148 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: May 2017

Kslim13 :  honestly obama’s wasn’t that great, it was already a republican plan brought by the Heritage foundation, but now there are going to be less protections for the elderly, sick and poor. More people WILL die. 

Post # 69
Member
631 posts
Busy bee

I feel like it’s kind of silly and disengenuous, on both sides, to continue comparing the right to bear arms to the right to clean water. This doesn’t help anyone in this discussion.

First, people are using the term ‘right’ in various ways: some people mean ‘this is a basic human right that no one should go without’, while others mean ‘this is a constitutionally protected right that no one can take away’. Not only is the basis of the right completely different, the concept of what having a right entails is completely different.

The ‘right to bear arms’ is constitutionally protected in the US, while food/water/healthcare are not. But it’s really important to understand that all that means is that the gov’t can’t prohibit you from obtaining ‘arms’ on your own. There’s obviously no right to have a gun provided to you.

If you want water/food/healthcare protected in the same way that guns are, then I would argue that they already are. There are no circumstances where the government could possibly get away with prohibiting people from obtaining their own water/food/healthcare. Trying to even construct such a situation defies imagination.

So, please, let’s stop with the idea that the gov’t protects gun rights more than healthcare rights, because that’s not really accurate. They may prioritize protecting gun ‘access’ more than they protect actually getting healthcare, but that’s a different argument. Notice how the GOP language has shifted to ‘access to healthcare’ instead of coverage. If they can convince people that all that has to be protected is ‘access’, then they have no responsibility for whether people actually obtain healthcare.

Now, the argument that we all have a right (as in, basic human right) to HAVE (not just access) clean water, food, and healthcare is a separate argument. And while italianbride0508 : is right that, generally speaking, we pay for water and we pay for food, currently in this country, if one is so poor that they cannot afford water and food, we (society/government) do actually provide it for them. The extreme conversative/libertarian argument would perhaps be that we should not do this – this is, as they might say, ‘not the government’s job’. But the question is: what kind of society do we want to live in?

Do we want to live in a society where if someone is too poor, we let them starve to death? Are we morally and ethically comfortable with those results? If you’re comfortable with that, then it would be consistent to shrug off poor people being unable to pay for medical care.

 

Post # 70
Member
265 posts
Helper bee
  • Wedding: January 2017

I’m starting to think that italianbride0508 :  is secretly Tomi Lahren or something. I just keep thinking to myself “she can’t REALLY believe what she is saying”.

Post # 72
Member
2003 posts
Buzzing bee
  • Wedding: May 2016

italianbride0508 :  seriously… you really think that people dont have the right to have clean drinking water and food to feed themselves. tell that to the people in flint who have been drinking poisoned water for how long now? causing god knows what kind of health issues and illness.. same with food. 

you must be such a generous person to the poor and homeless, since you seem to think people dont have the right to water and food…… smh 

Post # 73
Member
2968 posts
Sugar bee

Kslim13 :  It’s definitely worth reading Sephiroth’s post earlier on this page about the right to clean water being a different sort of right to a right to bear arms. (She’s making much better points than I have made.) 

A very interesting thing that she says is about how the GOP language has shifted from healthcare ‘coverage’ to healthcare ‘access’. 

She says that “If they can convince people that all that has to be protected is ‘access’, then they have no responsibility for whether people actually obtain healthcare.”

This is a subtle but profound shift. By replacing the word “coverage” with the word “access” they hope to move everyone politically to the right (without anyone noticing) while getting rid of any responsibility to provide healthcare.

Obama, of course wanted complete coverage for everyone with the goal of saving more lives and eventually (once everyone was enrolled) the opportunity to bring down costs. That’s because he cares about people.

So don’t be fooled by the subtle change of words. Resist it. 

From here over the pond (with my access to the UK’s National Health Service – free at the point of need) I hate the thought of Obamacare being replaced by Donald-doesn’t-Give-A-Damn.

But then I long ago decided that I’d rather pay higher taxes even if I don’t necessarily directly benefit from them. It’s the price we all pay for civilisation.

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