(Closed) SO Sick of Shootings in the US (continued)

posted 6 years ago in The Lounge
Post # 3
Member
9955 posts
Buzzing Beekeeper
  • Wedding: December 2012

First off, I want to say that I am very saddened by this news (as I am ANYTIME that I hear that innocent people were killed… be it by whatever cause / reason… but certainly more so when it is a mass shooting… and doubly-so when it involves children)

And so I feel for ALL American Citizens in this tragedy.

What I can say clearly, is that even more sad, will be the fall-out that will come about as a result of this.

What it means for America (based on past performance / statistics) is that there will be even more people who will make the decision to buy a gun to protect themselves in “the fear” that this could in someway happen to them… and that by having a gun, they could in somehow have / will prevent it happening to them.

That is the scary part…

The issue isn’t in the USA that you guys somehow have a greater number of people who are mentally ill … because you don’t.

(Statistics prove that… if the stats are for a particular illness are 1/10,000 then that is the stat period)

What you do have in the USA is the fact that there are more citizens than in many other first world countries who have the ability to obtain and carry weapons quite easily (be that a hunting rifle, a handgun, or a semi-automatic weapon)

Statistically there are 88.8 Guns per 100 People in America (or aprox 277 Million Guns in total) making the United States the country with the highest gun ownership in the world (and that is a startling factor when you consider that means that a lot of people own multiple weapons, because well the stat is based on ALL Citizens including children)

http://big.assets.huffingtonpost.com/transparency.jpeg

ABC NEWS in the aftermath of this most recent shooting has reported that for the month of November 2012 alone, that the FBI processed more than 2 MILLION background checks for Gun Purchases… not surprising in a country that stats in 2010 show that close to 5.5 MILLIION guns were manufactured in the USA in 2010 (with 95% being sold in the USA) and another 3.2 MILLION being imported that year (so close to 9 MILLION GUNS being bought in the US for one year alone !!).

Never mind that a gun is not a “consumable” item… but is something that has a life-span of many decades if not longer

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/08/guns-in-america-a-statistical-look/

In truth, it isn’t “the criminal” element in the USA that is SOLELY shooting Americans (what people are claiming to arm themselves against).  In reality, it is other Americans… who up until 5 Minutes before they pull the trigger, were pretty “normal law abiding” folks

This is clearly happening, because guns are just so available / accessible… and a “normal” part of day to day life for many people.

In the case of 20 year old Adam Lanza`s life… guns were a very normal part of his existence.  Word coming out now in the media that his mother being a “Prepper Survivalist” who owned 5 legally registered guns (2 Handguns – a Semi-Automatic Rifle – and 2 Hunting Rifles)… who by all accounts handled and stored her guns and ammunitions properly.  His mother in a effort to teach him responsibility had been taking him to a local firing range.  And he enjoyed the activity… and made her proud.

http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/339227

http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/12/17/divorce-records-reveal-adam-lanzas-mother-had-full-authority-over-him-as-portrait-of-killers-family-life-emerges/

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/9750525/Connecticut-school-shooting-Adam-Lanzas-mother-taught-him-to-be-responsible-with-guns.html

It is not clear yet “what snapped” that day for Adam Lanza (although there does seem to be evidence that he was a young man indeed with mental health issues).

BUT, what is known is that he shot and killed his mother, before making his way to the Elementary School with the 4 of the weapons (a military style .223 semi-automatic rifle that did the killing – and a handgun that he used to shoot himself… along with a semi-automatic pistol that he had in a pocket of his cargo pants – and another gun that he had in the trunk of the car he drove to the school in).

Currently, Investigators are stumped as to WHY he targeted this school (it was first reported that his mother was a teacher there… but that was FALSE info)… or why the entire class of 6 and 7 year olds.

I am not sure what the solution is for the United States, and if this cycle of violence will ever stop.  I do think that part of it is the element that the right to bear arms is part of the American Constitution… it therefore is seen as a RIGHT… more so than an actual responsibility (at least that is what it looks like from where I sit… and for many of us who don`t live in the USA)

And the more people who buy-in to the idea that guns are required part of being a US Citizen (as a RIGHT of Citizenship… or as a way to protect oneself), then based on statistical evidence the more that tragedies like mass shootings will continue to happen… as with more guns around, they will naturally at times fall into the hands of the wrong people (or those that have “snapped”).

Sad for sure.

All I know, is I HOPE & PRAY that a solution can be found so that America can go back to the being the country where people are not afraid to call it home (and feel safe in their Homes, Schools & Businesses)… and the sooner the better in my opinion.

 

Post # 4
Member
3170 posts
Sugar bee
  • Wedding: October 2012

No idea what debate is going on in the other tread but I am so pissed off about what is going on in America right now. I was in Target two nights ago and was literally looking over my shoulder the entire time, watching people making sure they didn’t look suspicious. Terrified that I was going to die. That is no way to live

My two cents for a solution (obviously wouldn’t solve all problems), stop paying our politicians, athletes, those overpaid people who don’t really help anything, and pay our security forces more money. Put a police officer in every public place. Be prepared for this crime because it obviously isn’t just a rare occurance. There is a problem in America right now and we need to do something about it.

Post # 5
Member
13010 posts
Honey Beekeeper
  • Wedding: November 1999

@Birdee106:  Do you live in an unsafe area where you have to look over your shoulder?  I live in DC, which has one of the highest violent crime rates in the country, and I’ve never walked around watching people in a public place like Target or a grocery store to see if they were suspicious.  Additionally, crime rates across the country have been in decline for at least a decade…

Post # 6
Member
3170 posts
Sugar bee
  • Wedding: October 2012

@abbie017:  No, I don’t. My town is actually very safe. It doesnt matter how much crime is in your city though. Criminals aren’t thinking ‘I want to kill people but my town is too safe for this, I shouldn’t do it.’ or ‘I want to kill people and I live in the perfect place for it!’. Things like this are happening everywhere. I look over my shoulder because i’m paranoid and freaked out. Not because I expect it to happen, but because it could.

Post # 7
Member
9917 posts
Buzzing Beekeeper
  • Wedding: June 2013

What I don’t get, and what I want those who carry guns/have guns in their home to answer, is why people feel so unsafe in their homes.  Is the crime rate in your area exceptionally high?  Have intruders been frequently going into homes in your area?  If you made a choice to live in that area, why did you choose it given the high crime rates?

Post # 8
Member
13010 posts
Honey Beekeeper
  • Wedding: November 1999

@Birdee106:  I’m sorry you’re so “paranoid and freaked out” (your words!) by the possibility of crime occuring in your vicinity.  There’s a possibility that you’re going to get hit by a car driving, so do you stop driving?  There’s a possibility of being mugged at an ATM, so do you stop using the ATM? 

I guess what I’m trying to say is, if you live with the fear that crime is around every corner, the criminals “win,” so to speak. 

Did you know a person is more likely to be killed with bare hands/feet/being pushed than they are by a rifle or shotgun (or basically any weapon excluding handguns or knives, which obviously are the highest percentage. 

Post # 10
Member
3170 posts
Sugar bee
  • Wedding: October 2012

@abbie017:  I never said that i’m never going out again. I went to Target, I’ve gone grocery shopping and other places. I’m not living in a bubble. Just stating that these shootings have me worried. I don’t think that makes me weak. I’m a realist and not living in la-la land where I think i’m so safe. The town directly next to ours is very dangerous, two cops were shot and killed last night. There are shootings all the time. There is a federal prison thirty mintues from where I live.

I just don’t like not being in control and when someone has a gun pointed to my head there isn’t much I can do.

Post # 11
Member
9917 posts
Buzzing Beekeeper
  • Wedding: June 2013

They made an excellent point on the radio the other day about the apparent increase of these shootings.  The commentator said that people think there has been an increase, and that we are in danger, and that we need to watch out…but in reality, there has not been an ACTUAL increase.  There are these horrific shootings which are covered in the news, and they go on and on about them (and nothing is done), but then he was like, “And how many people are listening right now and are not wearing their seatbelts?  They are at a larger risk for death than anyone is by a mass shooting.”  

Post # 12
Member
4275 posts
Honey bee
  • Wedding: April 2012

@peachacid:  I will answer this from one perspective (which is my and my husband’s perspective). We have a gun in our nightstand in cases of a “last resort”. It does give me extra assurance that if someone was to break in and keep coming, I can protect myself. While our neighbors have been broken into, we did not know until after we moved in. We did have a security alarm installed as a first line of defense even before hearing about that though.  Most of the time, when people break into a house, they do it when they believe nobody is home. That is what the security alarm is for. If somebody was to trip the alarm and keep coming, they are looking to cause harm. I do not carry a gun on my person and neither does my husband. I admit, I am a little worried how people will act as “doomsday” nears….. and my hackles have been up a lot more lately, but yeah the gun will still stay in the nightstand and the alarm will stay on the no-delay setting as we sleep.

Even if we do keep a gun in our home though…we are not totally against gun control. So my opinion might not mean much in that case.

 

Post # 13
Member
13010 posts
Honey Beekeeper
  • Wedding: November 1999

@sarahbabs:  Gun owners will be able to answer this better than me, but I’m guessing that it boils down the constitutional guarantee that you have the right to bear arms.  Whether that’s outdated, and what arms mean, is a discussion for someone other than me (meaning, law enforcement, policy makers, government officials, etc).  Gun owners, who are generally lawful, want the protection of having a handgun, and in most (if not all) states, it’s perfectly legal as long as the weapon is licensed and/or registered.  The problem with outlawing handguns and not rifles is that you take away the protective nature of the weapon.  Rifles are designed to shoot at a longer range (hunting, for example) rather than someone who just broke into your house and is three feet away.  Rifles are also impractical in cities and urban areas where hunting is pretty rare.  There is also the personal choice argument, where people suggest they are allowed the choice by constitutional provision.  Personally, I’m not a gun owner, but I recognize the dangers of outlawing guns (basically what it boils down to is that the good guys turn in their guns to comply with the laws, while the bad guys keep them, increasing the proportion of illicit and illegal guns on the street).  Hopefully some of the pro-gun bees can help answer your question better than this. 

@Birdee106:  Shootings make everyone nervous at first, but the description you gave personally sounded more than a bit nervous, especially if you live in a generally safe area.  In a country of over 300 million people, there were 12,664 murders committed in 2011.  Personally, I choose to live on the side where it’s so massively stacked in my favor that I don’t live in to the fear.  And yes, I gather you live near FCI Leavenworth, which houses predominantly medium level offenders (mostly drug offenders with more than 5 years on their sentences, since lesser sentences go to Low level FCIs) – who are locked up and incarcerated, and therefore, not a threat.  (For the record, I’m a criminologist and worked with BOP for several years…)

Post # 15
Member
525 posts
Busy bee
  • Wedding: April 2014

@sarahbabs:  My mom actually carries a handgun when she hikes alone for protection.  Not that her small handgun would be much help against a bear, but it would do a lot of good against a mountain lion or coydog (more wolf like animal) which are in our area back home.  Can’t really hike carrying a rifle or shotgun.  I feel safer knowing she has it when she’s out there for hours by herself. 

 

 

Post # 16
Member
903 posts
Busy bee
  • Wedding: September 2012

@Cady:  Just curious — what do you intend to do with that gun if you want to have kids (or do you have them already)? If you don’t plan on any kids, then nevermind 🙂

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