(Closed) Stupid rules. Stupid societal rules.

posted 9 years ago in Christian
Post # 31
Member
1361 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: April 2011

I’m sorry if this was mentioned before, I just can’t focus through reading all those posts!

Fiance and I live together as well (a year this month!) and are abstinent until marriage as well.  My mom was less than impressed, so are several Christian friends.  And I’ve struggled with my share of guilt about whether the situation is really right.  My mom asked me one night “If God came back today, would you want to be found in the same bed as xxx?”  Food for thought perhaps.  Then there’s the verse about not doing anything that is suggestive of sin (shoot…I can’t think of the verse right now).  Perhaps a PP posted it, or you know what I’m talking about.

We are getting married in a Baptist church (we don’t really have a home church right now, as we are either working or sleeping (after night shift) during church service times.  Fiance is also not Christian, which I thought would be a big deal for some pastors, but our pastor is very accepting and non-judgemental of him.  And Fiance puts in an effort for this course, which is hopeful for me!

ANYWHO.  Have you thought about having one of your close family members become officiated (is that what it’s called?) so they can marry you?  I can’t think of anything more “special” than that!  And if you need to vent…I’ll always listen!

Post # 32
Member
1056 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: May 2012

While this is painful and hurting you must realize that the Church has rules and guidelines for a reason.  Yes, while you are agreeing not to have sexual interaction, the church/pastors eyes it doesn’t look that way.  What he had told you does go along w/the guidelines/rules of many churches/pastors.  I don’t believe there is anything in the bible against living together, it’s more the fact that marriage is designed by God to be a holy sacrament.  And in the eyes of society or the church (more the churches) those are standards which doesn’t include living together.

You should look into finding a church that will offer the premartial classes there in HI and talk to the pastor again once you can confirm you can take the classes there.  That’s what I’m doing.  I am a member of an Assembly’s of God church and my man and I are planning on taking the classes there, HOWEVER, we are getting married by my grandmothers former pastor from a Methodist Church and getting married in a Methodist Church.  I’m sure when you talk to them they will change their minds.

I wish you the best of luck.  Pray on it!  It will work out!

Post # 33
Member
4 posts
Wannabee

Find a real church, rather than one with that kind of cult-like attitude.  When you find one that loves and accepts you ‘as is’, just as God himself would accept you, check it out.

Post # 34
Member
3364 posts
Sugar bee
  • Wedding: December 2011

We will be facing this! We arent equally yolked (in terms of religion) and we are and have been living together! Its hard! Being pushed by the same church that brought you up! I feel you girl! 

I hope you can find someone better to marry you in the end! 

Post # 35
Member
971 posts
Busy bee
  • Wedding: September 2008

Why would you want to get married in a church whose laws you don’t agree with and don’t like? 

Granted, living together might not be in the Bible, but a lot of church laws aren’t Bible based.  For example, the rule about eating meat on Friday during Lent in the Catholic religion.  Do you know why you’re not supposed to eat meat on Friday’s during Lent?  Not because Jesus said so, not because it’s in the Bible (because it isn’t) but because some Pope decided it.  In Jesus’ time, every day was meatless!  They didn’t have refrigeration back then, so eating meat (when they lived by the sea and fish were so plentiful) was expensive and saved for important and large occassions – like weddings.  If you slaughtered a lamb, you had to eat all the meat quickly and that wasn’t possible for a small family, so either they shared the lamb (money out of their pockets) or just went with the whole fish thing.  Used to be every Friday was meatless and the Popes changed that rule to only Friday during Lent. 

Living in sin isn’t in the Bible but in Jesus’ time, it wasn’t done.  It was considered sinful back then … along the lines of lust (one of the 7 deadly sins).  There are a ton of Canon Laws (in the Catholic church) that aren’t in the Bible but are based in the history of Jesus’ time.

As for not completing the class … you mean to tell me that there isn’t one single church in your area that offers a class that would be acceptable to your church?  And your church didn’t offer any alternatives to that class?  I find that difficult to believe.  I am sure there had to be some kind of couselor or course you could’ve taken in order to get married in that church.  Hawaii isn’t a primitive locale with nothing available to it.  Do you expect the church to bend the rules for you? 

I say if you’re not going to follow the rules/laws of the church, you shouldn’t get married in that faith.

I am Catholic.  I was raised in the Catholic faith.  I went to religious ed, made my sacraments.  I do not prescribe to all the Catholic beliefs.  I had premarital sex and three children out of wedlock, lived in sin for 9 years before getting married.  I use birth control.  Because of our situation, we knew that the Catholic church would never marry us based on the adult decisions we made.  With decisions you make, there are consequences.  We accepted our consequences … it’s time for you to accept yours.

Post # 36
Member
1025 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: August 2010

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@BanditGirl: I get your point, but just so it doesn’t confuse other people – the Catholic church does not refuse marriage to those who have kids outside of marriage or are living together.

Post # 37
Member
971 posts
Busy bee
  • Wedding: September 2008

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@jedeve: tell that to our church who made it loud and clear to us that it wasn’t acceptable as we didn’t follow Catholic Canon. 

Post # 38
Member
1025 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: August 2010

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@BanditGirl: Maybe it’s different in Canada? But this is from the USCCB:

5. If a couple is cohabiting, can marriage be denied or delayed?

  1. Denial of marriage — Since cohabitation is not in itself a canonical impediment to marriage, the couple may not be refused marriage solely on the basis of cohabitation. Marriage preparation may continue even if the couple refuses to separate. Pastoral ministers can be assured that to assist couples in regularizing their situation is not to approve of cohabitation.

http://www.usccb.org/laity/marriage/cohabiting.shtml

Post # 40
Member
971 posts
Busy bee
  • Wedding: September 2008

In the church’s eyes, what you’re doing is wrong.  And it has its consequences.  How can you not see that?

You might not think what you’re doing is wrong but your church thinks it is.  And, if you want to get married in your church, then you follow their rules. 

What happened when you were a kid and you didn’t follow the rules?  You got punished.  You don’t want to follow the church’s rules, well, they’re going to punish you.  Like it or not, it’s their rules, not yours.  They don’t care if you think cohabitation is ok — to them, it’s not.   

The church isn’t going to change their view because you think what you’re doing is ok.  Apparently, to them, it’s not. 

 

Post # 41
Member
350 posts
Helper bee
  • Wedding: January 1991

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@BanditGirl: What your saying is completely wrong.   You cannot be denied marriage for cohabitation.  You cannot be denied marriage for premarital sex.  You cannot be denied marriage for children out of wedlock. 

The practice of not eating meat on Fridays isn’t from the pope.  It was a practice that dates back to before 100 AD when the apostles decided to abstain from meat on Friday as a sign of sacrifice.  Originally it wasn’t meat – it was all animal products, including milk and eggs.  It was later that it was relaxed to just meat. 

I get that you’re unhappy with Catholicism, but don’t outright lie to people on the internet.  If you don’t know, don’t say anything.

Post # 42
Member
1025 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: August 2010

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@CoffeeHound: It seems like she’s just saying what she was told. So it would have been her parish who lied to her.

Post # 43
Member
350 posts
Helper bee
  • Wedding: January 1991

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@jedeve:  She’s making up things, like what’s in canon law.  There are no canons regarding meat on Friday and thre are no canons regarding cohabitation.  Canons are not based on traditions from “Jesus’ Time”, they’re all biblically based and/or based on Sacred Tradition and deal with theological matters, not social.  Basically, she doesn’t know so she’s assuming and she’s spreading her incorrect assumptions as fact.  That’s a lie.

If you don’t know what’s in canon law about marriage, go read it it.  It takes 10 minutes.  http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/__P3V.HTM

As far as why cohabitation is bad – it’s technically not a sin.  There’s nothing wrong with living with another person.  However, the Church teaches against cohabitation because it leads to premarital sex, which is a sin.

Having a child out of wedlock is also not a sin.  It’s a wonderful thing that you’ve chosen to have a child and not seek an abortion.  The sin is, again, the premarital sex that led to the child.  However, that premarital sex can be absolved quickly and completely through a valid confession.

The “loud and clear” message that her parish sent her about not being able to marry in the Church was almost certainly entirely in her own head.  By spreading that misinformation she’s doing a massive disservice to others that will not seek a wedding in the Church because of a misunderstanding of Church teachings.

Post # 44
Member
1025 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: August 2010

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@CoffeeHound: I already showed her what Canon law says. There’s no need to call somebody a liar. 

Post # 45
Member
4 posts
Wannabee
  • Wedding: August 2012

I get why the church has all these rules and standards, but what I have found is many people in the church are pretending they are not doing or have done sinful stuff. I have belonged to a very strict church and not so strict ones and most set these standards . I want to get married in a church but I have finally become open to the fact that if I cannot be true to myself in the process I will not get married in a church. We travel together and spend alot of time together but have both decided not to have have sex yet……that is OUR decision so I will not have the church decide when it will be the appropriate time….that’s really how I feel. My fellow Christians that choose to judge…..I don’t worry about them Laughing

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