Post # 1
Member
1396 posts
Bumble bee
The original post was by a troll and got deleted, but we were having a good conversation and it’s an important subject so let’s keep the discussion going.
The original story, to sum up, was about a girl who went out with friends, met up with some guy friends and got really drunk and possibly high. She danced and flirted with a guy. After the bar, she went back to an apartment with several people and sat on the guy’s lap. He kissed her once, she said no. He kissed her again, she said no. He kissed her a third time and she went with it. She blacked out and woke up naked, in bed, with vaginal bruising. He was sober.
Posted on Reddit, this was first written by a man instead of a woman. Since this is a hypothetical event, at least for the purpose of this thread, let’s say the gender of the ‘main character’ doesn’t really matter.
The question at hand is, is it rape? I believe very firmly that it is because you can’t give consent when intoxicated or unconscious, but there were several bees who disagreed. I think we should also talk about what sort of action can or should be taken in this sort of situation. If you have no legal recourse, does it still ‘count’ as rape? Finally, what can be done to further understand rape laws?
I am personally a big advocate of changing the conversation on rape in this country to one of stopping rapists from raping than from protecting victims from getting raped. I think this is the first step. What do you think?
**Keep it civil please, and let’s respect one another whether we agree or not.**
Post # 3
Member
143 posts
Blushing bee
Nope it is not rape. She put herself in that position. She drank and got high. I was raised if you put yourself in that situation you ARE NOT to call rape.
Post # 4
Member
3580 posts
Sugar bee
First and foremost: If ANYBODY is concerned that they have been assaulted, please go to http://www.rainn.org/
Second…..KITTENS!
Post # 5
Member
1561 posts
Bumble bee
@artichokey: “The question at hand is, is it rape? I believe very firmly that it is because you can’t give consent when intoxicated or unconscious.”
I agree with you 100%
“I am personally a big advocate of changing the conversation on rape in this country to one of stopping rapists from raping than from protecting victims from getting raped.”
I agree… no matter how many short skirts I stop wearing, or how many guys I don’t flirt with, how many I go home with — rape isn’t going to end unless PEOPLE STOP RAPING. The fault lies with the people who commit the crime, period.
Post # 7
Member
3580 posts
Sugar bee
@pinkzebra: I feel really bad for you. That means that at any time you were drunk or high and audibly and forcibly said NO, then you still wouldn’t report it. That completely blows.
Post # 8
Member
10635 posts
Sugar Beekeeper
I’m confused by the original title, but I didn’t see the original thread.
Yes it was rape.
I think one of the best ways of dealing with the issue is education. I’m a supporter of enthusiastic consent. Why have sex (especially with somone for the first time) if they aren’t into it?
It’s not going to stop all rapists, but I think social changes can occur, and it can help with some cases.
Post # 9
Member
2457 posts
Buzzing bee
I want to say that it is… but I only think that’s because the situation just makes me mad – that some douchey douchebag could take advantage of a girl that is clearly intoxicated; however, I think I would say it is not rape, but definitely a form of assault.
She *did* put herself in a situation where this was possible in the first place, and that could’ve been prevented. So no, not rape, but I would consider it assault. As a human courtesy, a guy/girl should know when to stop (in this case, the guy that kept pushing her to do it).
Post # 10
Member
1115 posts
Bumble bee
@pinkzebra: So basically, you think she asked for it?
Why did I even click on this thread? People disgust me.
Post # 11
Member
10635 posts
Sugar Beekeeper
@pinkzebra: She drank and got high. She put herself in a situation where she deserves the hangover. Rape isn’t a part of that.
Post # 12
Member
2266 posts
Buzzing bee
@pinkzebra: What if that was you? I’d think you’d want to call rape. That wouldn’t be fair to you. Put yourself in that situation. You already said no! It is totally rape.
Post # 13
Member
2457 posts
Buzzing bee
@DeadlyNightshade: I know that wasn’t directed at what I said – but I will say I definitely do NOT think she asked for it, but I think think the situation could’ve been prevented if she knew her limits and try to remove herself from a dangerous situation.
Post # 14
Member
1765 posts
Buzzing bee
@AB Bride: +1
If he was sober he should know better than to have sex with a extremely drunk woman who is clearly not capable of consenting. In my mind, that is rape, because the woman cannot consent. And also, what someone is wearing or if they are acting flirty is NOT a sexual invitation.
Post # 15
Member
3580 posts
Sugar bee
@artichokey: ” If you have no legal recourse, does it still ‘count’ as rape?”
This is a wonderful question and I think DeathByDesign had a legitimate point about how even though a victim doesn’t go to the police, doesn’t minimize the fact that it was still rape. It happens every day. ESPECIALLY in the case of black out drinking, because let’s be honest. If someone is blacked out, they are past the point of their nervous system being able to fully 1) make a thoughtful decision, and 2) their motor skills are depleted enough that it should be obvious that even when they say they’re ‘game’, they really shouldn’t be engaged in any sort of behavior.
Post # 16
Member
10635 posts
Sugar Beekeeper
@StephieBee: What’s the difference? Here, my understanding is that ‘rape’ is not a crime, sexual assault is.
