Post # 1
After 3mths. of agony,wondering, discussing why no ring,a very recent “blowout”,and me really considering it being over and leaving……SO has finally come to the realization that perhaps honesty is the best policy even though it may hurt my feelings and he at the very least owes me an explanation of his ridiculous 5yr. engagement time frame. YA THINK!! For those bees that haven’t read my other posts we live together and he’s had a ring for 2yr. locked in a safe and hasn’t proposed and gave me excuses that were very “see through”as to why not. So…..we talked for 2hrs. yesterday and he told me the REAL REASONS,so here we go,OPINIONS BEES–
1. He said when he met me I was “emotionally stunted” and emotionally my way of thinking sometimes was immature. I was with a loser from the time I was 16yr. old (which eventually ended in divorce,I’m 34 now)and didn’t know how to act in a “REAL RELATIOSHIP” He thought that if we waited 5yrs. that this “stunting” issue would resolve on it’s own.
2.He feels I can be very selfish and that I feel an “entitlement” to his assets,particularly the house(he owned it when I moved in). If we were married and he died,the house would go to his sons because it’s an asset that HE owned before we got married(NOT SURE IF I LIKE THAT ONE!)He wants a pre-nup to state this. However, I would recieve his pension for the rest of my life if anything were to happen to him.
Yes,he was burned in the past….Can ya tell??LOL. He felt that waiting 5yrs. the issues would subside on their own and I would be more “marriage material”. The problem with Mr. SO’s plan is that 5yrs. for me is ridiculously long. It took 3mths. for him to come forward and be honest and tell me those things(he just didn’t want to hurt my feelings,he is EXTREMELY HONEST 99% of the time)He thinks that now that they’re apparent to me, I can work on them and the engagement can move along quicker than his original 5yr. plan. And Bees,HE’S NOT OFF THE HOOK!!!I HAVE MY OWN LIST FOR HIM LOL!! I learned that sometimes these things suck to hear,but I can be selfish and I am “emotionally stunted” but I am willing to work on those things and be his wife,and in turn he has things to work on also(his relationship with my daughter). I don’t want to get married tomorrow,I would at least like the commitment and to set a 2yr. date. This would also allow for us to both grow together and work on things in a committed relationship.He says now, that these flaws are not big enough to not get engaged and he felt a 100times better finally expressing them and I feel like we made alot of progress. Proposal soon????????
Post # 3
hi sunshine as i mentoned earlier he needs the five years in order to ensure thing will work out without the nasty divourse again.well am happy he as come clean finally as it is the only way you guys can move forward.there will always be things that you guys need to work on,thats just how life is.granted he may have good reason for the wait.maybe u should focus on becoming a better u, address the issues u have.maybe see a shrink.if u were in a very bad relationship you would of developed bad emotional rsolving skills which may have negative effects on A MARRIAGE.maybe the two of you should see a shrink togther or individually to help get passed what is hindeRinG the relationship.as u mentioned he is a good man.maybe that might help.AS for this prenup this is a decision for you.you are making a life for yourself and your daughter with this man if god forbids he dies u will have to grieve as well have to consider moving cause the house will be in his sons name.what if ur 60 when that happens to do really want to uproot urself?well as i said it is how u feel about the matter.if u do decide ,make sure u would have ur own lawyer to advise u. as for if i belive and engagement is soon? he seems pretty adamant that these issues be fixed before u get engage .hope all goes well am rooting for u guys
Post # 4
I don’t have a lot of experience on this particular topic, but my two cents is that for a relationship like marriage to work, you have to stop thinking of things as “mine” and “his/hers” and think of things as “ours”. I realize that this is harder for you two since you’ve had prior relationships, but you have to leave that behind and focus on the PRESENT relationship.
It sounds like he is very wary of you for whatever reason with the assets. To ask for a prenup is fair, but to act like you’re going to be the evil stepmother towards his sons if something happens to him is not okay. The action and the intention are completely different things to look at here. In my opinion, if you are going to truly share your lives together, you have to be comfortable with sharing 110%, even large things like houses, cars, etc. If the trust is not there…well, you know the answer to that.
Again, just my two cents 🙂 Good luck to you both.
Post # 5
I’m really glad y’all talked. I read the other thread and I was hoping y’all would at least talk once more!
I agree with the house thing. I know he will have had it before marriage, but it does worry me about where you will live, like a PP said, if he dies when you are 60?
I really hope y’all work things out though.
Post # 6
What a productive conversation, that is good. Two thoughts:
1) Take proactive steps. Go to counselling, let him in on the sessions every once in a while, share your plan for mental health with him. Almost every one of us could use work with a counsellor to be a better version of ourselves, so if this is a major concern of his, showing a proactive approach will work best. Tell him to do the same.
2) Sign a pre-nup or at least discuss with an attorney how assets are divided at divorce or death in your state. Because he has children, his concerns are entirely legitimate. At the end of the day, his number one priority in life must be his children. On the other hand, you are not crazy for wanting to make the house you live in your home as well, and he may be slightly too sensitive to what is really normal behavior on your part. I would recommend opening the possibility that you could keep the house, but the kids could have a trust or other assets. A good attorney should be able to find satisfactory ways to protect the kids, and I really, really recommend that you are supportive of doing so with a legal instrument.
Post # 7
Mmm. I think the bottom line is that he’s not ready to commit to you as you are. Period. That’s clear. Marriage is important to you – instead of waiting around for you to change (and/or him too) you should leave to find someone who wants to marry you. I’m not saying that people don’t develop unhealthy emotional responses from bad relationships or that these can not be reasonably alarming to a new partner but. it’s been years that you’ve been together and he should know by now if he wants to marry you or not – he doesn’t. No one is perfect and you will not become perfect with time. I absolutely think you can find someone you love who will love you and want to commit to you as you are even while working to always improve each other. I think you deserve better than you’re getting.
Post # 8
@ Arachna: totally fair advice.
Post # 9
@Arachna: Your advice reminded me of what my mom always said to me when I would go shopping:
“Don’t buy jeans a size too small because you’re going to try to lose weight. Buy the size that fits you now, otherwise you’ll end up with a closet full of unworn jeans.”
The marriage is the too-small jeans, the ‘weight’ is you trying to change as a person. You can’t be certain you’re ever going to squeeze into those jeans, or even still LIKE the jeans when you can fit in them.
Sorry if it’s a bit of a tangent..ehe. Just came to mind.
Post # 10
Why is it that you’re giving him all the power and decision making in this relationship? What will you do if after his designated waiting period for you to change (is he that wonderful and perfect that HE has no flaws?), he pushes it back once again? I have to agree with a few posters. As much as you want this to work,I don’t think its going to happen with this man. He’s actually getting the best part of this deal, but I don’t think you’re seeing it. As much as it might hurt, save yourself more heartache and move on.
Post # 11
That’s great that you are making progress! Personally I feel like if a man bought a ring 2 years ago, and is still planning on waiting 5 to get married, there is an issue. I wouldn’t stick around 7 years, waiting.
Post # 12
- Wedding: July 2010 - The Tower Club
Ouch. I’m sorry you had to hear those things from the person you love. I think that 1: Arachna’s advice is spot on and 2: these types of things “suck to hear” because it sucks that someone would say them! You are 34 and he’s speaking to you as though you’re a little kid. It’s no wonder he’s feeling more comfortable now that he’s been able to freely tell you that (a) you’re selfish (b) he’s suspicious of you (c) he gave you a list of your flaws to justify his position (d) you agreed to the idea of a “list.”
You cannot marry the person you hope someone will be. You cannot marry someone with those types of conditions attached. You cannot marry the future. You marry the present, and then you pledge to jump into the unknown future together. He is not ready to jump.
I think the “ring locked in a safe” is a striking metaphor for the love and unconditional support that has been withheld from you. You might get a proposal now and you could accept it, and you could be married. But there’s better out there, and while it might be scary to reach for it now, it will be worth it to you (and to your daughter) in the long run.
Post # 13
1: Seriously? He thinks you are emotionally stunted and will magically change in 5 years? I have no idea if you are “emotionally stunted” or not, but at 34, that’s honestly probably not going to change. What do you think of his accusation that you are “emotionally stunted”? Don’t just accept it at face value. Look within yourself. You may just be a different person who sometimes has different thoughts and reactions than him.
And speaking of “emotionally stunted”, I’m not sure your boyfriend is exactly healthy emotionally since he’s still taking out his past relationship failures on you, which brings me to…
2. Finances. This is a biggie. First thing, will you have children together? Because if so, he should not already be planning to leave all his stuff only to his kids from his first marriage. Second thing, if he doesn’t want you to have the house, he doesn’t expect you to contribute to it’s upkeep, right? I mean, he shouldn’t expect you to invest in it if you don’t get anything back. Third thing, as his spouse you will be the beneficiary on his pension unless you waive that right (interesting little factoid for you).
I don’t know what to think here. I understand him wanting to protect his assets and also his sons. But at the same time, if the two of you are married for 40 years and he dies, are you going to have to watch most of what you’ve built up in your marriage go to his sons instead of for your retirement?
I just think it sounds like he’s not ready to be a partner right now. He’s too wrapped up in what he can get, and not in what the two of you can build together. JMHO.
Post # 14
Arachna, Pharmy, Smyly, Mitla, and Blackcherry made some valid points. In addition to those points, I just wanted to add why are you still with someone who has to “work on” his relationship with your daughter? You didn’t say how old your daughter is, but to me, that statement sets off warning bells. It reminds me of a coworker who has been with her “boyfriend” for probably ten years with no ring, he keeps giving her ultimatums, and worst of all, she constantly chooses to stay with him even though he treats her son like crap, (while she considers his kids and their children to be “hers” and they feel the same about her).
You’re only 34. You (and your daughter!) can do so much better. You DESERVE so much better!
Post # 15
I would be so ANGRY if someone I loved said these things to me. I know it was in the context of him “being honest,” but I think he was really striking some low blows at you. Particularly his language – it sounds like he was not trying at all to frame his comments in a supportive, encouraging way (e.g. “I really admire how much you’ve grown as a person since I’ve met you, I’m excited to see what’s ahead for both of us as we grow old together” vs. “you were emotionally stunted when I met you, and you’ve been making meh progress so far but I think in five years you’ll be okay”). Instead, to speak frankly, he sounds like a big jerk.
Post # 16
I go back and forth with all this advice bees. I think I do have things to work on as we all do. He does own his flaws too,he’s really a great guy even though the way I worded things I made him sound like a jerk. He’s a cop,and he DOES like to be in control and I definetly do too,two captains on the same ship!!I like what Mitla said to me “You cannot marry the person you HOPE someone will be” and “the ring locked in a safe is a metaphor for the love and unconditional support that has been withheld from you” I do feel like he is FREAKING OUT about making such a crucial decision regarding getting engaged for the second time in his life. He does seem to unintentionally dangle the ring like a carrot in front of my nose like a kid(I have brought this to his attention and he says “absolutely doesn’t mean to do that”) He seperates love from the marriage contract,very black and white thinking. I struggle with this because I feel the two go hand in hand and I completely am the opposite where I think with my heart first. He says it has nothing to do with how much he loves me. He looks at it in two parts 1. The love we share 2. The actual binding contract,financial,who’s responsible for what,pre-nup etc. I don’t know if this is normal. I did read articles on second time marriage and it did say “YOU CANNOT RELY ON LOVE ALONE” you have to get into the nitty gritty of uncomfortable things like money,prenups etc. The second marriage you’re coming into a new life with TONS OF BAGGAGE vs. a first time marriage with starting off with nothing and building together. I am really struggling with this in my heart and wondering how I will feel if he asks me soon. When I talk to him it makes great sense at the time. Then I come on here and talk with you bees and my mind and heart gets confused again. I have no idea,I just feel lost. He did agree if he asks to set a 2yr. date not a 5yr. one. But do I really want to marry this man is the REAL question…..