Post # 76
I’m not looking to blame anyone. I do think it is valid to look at WHO’s actions. Maybe the timing is not right at the moment since we’re all fucked. Similarly it is valid to look at every governments action, every gormenment health authorities actions and even actions of the hospital districts. I’m not suggesting that anyone should take advice (especially government) from an internet forum but if us regular people have based on the news gathered enough information to be worried. So has health authorities and governments.
I don’t think WHO has been useless, but I do think that the organisation could learn from it. I’m not by any means an expert and I do understand that it’s hard to make decisions between deaths and economy. I work in healthcare supply chain and I’ve heard fuckton of propaganda from several sources that I know are not true and it’s getting tiring and affecting my work. No, WHO is not to blame nor is anyone else. Just saying that maybe it’s worth learning from this. While everyone (countries) can do what they want, WHO is still the reigning health body that has a lot of power.
Post # 77
Brideordie : What is your evidence for suggesting that the WHO is China-centric? (Second time of asking.)
I believe that the WHO has advised that to suppress and control the epidemic, countries must isolate, test, treat and trace. South Korea seems to have managed this very well at a time when Trump was insisting that COVID-19 was a hoax and no worse than flu.
I note that The Trump administration fired the U.S. pandemic response team in 2018 to cut costs. In hindsight that was a huge blunder.
Post # 78
It’s nice to say, we shouldn’t assign blame, or that it does no good. But the truth is that China’s irresponsible response to Covid has cost many their lives and livelihoods. I’m not “bashing” on China or pointing fingers for the sake of it, but China does need to be held accountable in some way so that this doesn’t happen again. I’ve read reports that the wet markets have reopened. These are not safe, and they increase the likelihood of spread of disease. China needs to be publically reprimanded, so that when the next virus starts, whether it be in China or elsewhere, it’ll be less likely that the country will attempt to hide it. There needs to be consequences for actions, or in this case inaction and the deliberate hiding of information, to avoid this in the future.
And just to be entirely truthful, I’m not going to lie and say that I’m not mad at China or that I don’t blame them. Because I am pissed, and I do.
Post # 79
I can agree that WHO should have put out clearer directives, sooner, but I don’t believe at all that they were trying not to offend China. I see no evidence of this, and I work in global health. The reason people are focusing on Trump in their responses is because you basically compared him to WHO in your initial post. Had you just asked, “do people think WHO should have done x,y,x sooner?” you would see a different tone in the responses. Also, you think Trump listens to WHO? He was downplaying the pandemic long after they declared it an emergency.
Also, you keep talking about closing borders. Sure, that would have been helpful, but there are so many other things that other governments are doing to flatten the curve that Trump refuses to do, like testing everybody (as someone else mentioned, see Iceland for an example).
At this point, he is the one preventing the US from treating and testing our people, out of his own selfish delusions and egotistical puffery. He wants to pretend he’s doing a great job. Weeks ago, he admitted he didn’t want testing because he didn’t want it to seem like we have big numbers here. He is currently pushing a drug that may not be effective, that is needed by lupus patients who now can’t get it, and oh , it just so happens that he has a stake in the company that makes it.
He is hoarding PPE and other necessary equipment – going so far as to confiscate them from states – and witholding it from states that desperately need them because their governors “weren’t nice enough” to him. He promised tests would be available, they’re not. Going back to the transition from the Obama administration, they gave him plans for how to handle a pandemic! Based on their experience with H1N1. Not only did he ignore them, he dismantled the team that would have taken charge of the response two years ago, and still tries to blame Obama for not having prepared for this. He prevents scientists and epidemiologists from sharing information. He retaliates against naval commanders who try to protect their crew. He has fucked up everything he has touched since taking office, and now people are dying in mass numbers as a result. And his party turns a blind eye because they want to keep power, keep stacking the courts to allow things like what we’re seeing in Wisconsin with refusing to let people mail in their ballots so they have to risk death to vote. As he admitted just the other day, if more people were able to vote, Republicans would never win another election. It’s frankly disgusting.
Post # 80
To be fair closing borders would have been much more than merely helpful. If it were done correctly it would have completely contained the virus within China or at least only a few surrounding areas.
Post # 81
you can’t just close the borders and say ok see ya. Thousands if not millions of Americans was outside of the country, we get stuff imported and exported all the time. We could has achieved the same thing if we had done social distancing right in the country, and all this is already done, why is not he responding better now? Why don’t we have supplies at my hospital? Why are states having to outbid each other for supplies? We is my state only testing people are 65 or older even though we have thousands of cases and all others are going to private labs which is taking longer. FYI they are doing it because we have so few testing kits available
Post # 82
No we couldn’t have achieved the same thing with social distancing that we could have with closing the borders to all immediate tourism and quarantining all returning citizens effectively. Most countries that have been said to have been successful with social distancing are still racking up cases and deaths, just on a smaller scale. Border closure would have prevented even that. If everyone’s borders had of closed to Chinese tourism at the start of this thing, the world wouldn’t be in this situation now.
Post # 83
I completely agree. If China had owned up to the problem immediately in Nov/Dec and shut down and properly warned the world instead of silencing the whistleblower doctors in China, I really believe we would not be in the situation today.
Post # 84
OP, you brought this on yourself. You could’ve made your post just about the WHO and not mentioned Trump at all. You could’ve just said, “I believe that the WHO handled this poorly, and here are the reasons.” You brought Trump into the mix, so you have only yourself to blame for people comparing the WHO and Trump. Own it and be more careful about how you express yourself, which is good advice for many of your comments.
Post # 85
lol, “I brought it on myself”
. Oh nooees!
Plenty of people agree that the WHO did nothing as shown by the poll, I guess I brought them agreeing upon myself too huh? Don’t think because you read some comments an they make you agree an nod your head that others hold less weight. Look at the poll, more favour the WHO than not, but not by a wide margin so obvi many agree with me.
You might want to take the existence of opinions you don’t agree with into account before you express yourself, because your opinion holds no more weight than any one else’s.
Post # 86
Christ, it’s like you didn’t even read what I wrote. You were babbling and complaining that people kept bringing up Trump and assuming you’re a supporter and such. I’m saying that it’s YOUR fault that they keep bringing up Trump. You brought him up first in your original post. You did not have to. You could have made a point about the WHO without mentioning Trump. You mentioned Trump. YOU mentioned Trump. So other people have also been mentioning him. That is your fault. You mentioned him.
Clear? I can’t beLIEVE someone with such poor reading comprehension is going to be a teacher. Frightening.
Post # 87
the fact that you created a poll with only two options at total extremes says quite a lot about you actually. Either you really do think in these black and white terms, which is alarming if that’s true… or you’re just trying to stir up drama.
Post # 88
I blame The Who for discouraging border closures as if we had made a call to stop overseas travel in Australia, only returned citizens who were quarantined in hotels- like we are doing now then we could have continued on without ruining our economy. We may have lost some travel income but right now we have lost a lot more than that plus we have no local travel revenue either as we can’t even go to a local air bnb or camping ground for Easter. If we had stopped travel then we could carry on normal and keep borders closed except for freight which could also be quarantined when necessary along with any airline crew. If the other option is a rise in unemployment, debt, depression, domestic violence, suicide, lack of schooling, not seeing anyone, stopping elective surgeries, isolating old people who need support, people becoming sick and dying vs offending some people because they can’t come for a holiday then I know what stance I think would be less harmful to society. Now that we have already got the virus in our borders we have all the travel bans and quarantined in place but no one chose to do it early as then it might be seen as ‘over reacting’ I’d rather have over reacted then be where we are now. As an isolated island we should have been able to avoid such an impact to our life here.
Post # 89
This is getting a little crazy. Closing for mod review.