(Closed) Was I raped?

posted 4 years ago in Emotional
Post # 32
Member
385 posts
Helper bee
  • Wedding: February 2015

I feel like I may be attacked for this…but the first one doesn’t sound like rape. She said she didn’t know the Gatorade had alcohol in it until after a few sips, but she made it sound like she kept drinking because she wanted to know what it felt like. She admits she can’t remember much, and then says she still felt happy about it afterward.

Taken advantage of…maybe. But that doesn’t sound like rape.

Post # 33
Member
326 posts
Helper bee
  • Wedding: July 2017

anonkitty:  I would say that it is non-consentual sex, yes. Only a conscious YES means yes, for either party. If any person is not within their reasonable faculties to give consent, sex would then be non-consentual. 

Post # 34
Member
326 posts
Helper bee
  • Wedding: July 2017

turkeysausage:  Consenting to drinking alcohol is not the same as consenting to put a penis into your body.

Post # 35
Member
385 posts
Helper bee
  • Wedding: February 2015

ohnoitslindsay:  She said she can’t remember much. She might have said yes, she might have said no. We weren’t there, so it’s up in the air.

Post # 36
Member
714 posts
Busy bee
  • Wedding: September 2014 - Jacksonville Inn

ohmylanta13:  It amazes me how little compassion some people have, and how proud they are of that fact. I’m glad you don’t understand the nuances of rape because I hope it means you have never been raped. It means you don’t understand how rape shatters your soul. It takes time to heal from rape and to overcome the emotional trauma. I was raped 20 years ago. 99.9% of me has healed from that day but it took many years. Shame on you for being so heartless. Just because someone has been victimized does not make them a victim. I’m not entitled and I don’t want special treatment. I survived and because of that I get to live the happy life I now have. That’s my special treatment. I get to be a whole person again. Your lack of compassion is disgusting to me. 

Post # 37
Member
326 posts
Helper bee
  • Wedding: July 2017

turkeysausage:  If she was too drunk to remember, she was too drunk to give meaningful consent. It’s no different than being unconscious because you are not of your conscious mind. If we return to the tea metaphor I posted previously – 

“Just imagine instead of initiating sex, you’re making them a cup of tea.

You say “hey, would you like a cup of tea?” and they go “omg yes, I would LOVE a cup of tea! Thank you!*” then you know they want a cup of tea.

If you say “hey, would you like a cup of tea?” and they um and ahh and say, “I’m not really sure…” then you can make them a cup of tea or not, but be aware that they might not drink it, and if they don’t drink it then – this is the important bit – don’t make them drink it. You can’t blame them for you going to the effort of making the tea on the off-chance they wanted it; you just have to deal with them not drinking it. Just because you made it doesn’t mean you are entitled to watch them drink it.

If they say “No thank you” then don’t make them tea. At all. Don’t make them tea, don’t make them drink tea, don’t get annoyed at them for not wanting tea. They just don’t want tea, ok?

They might say “Yes please, that’s kind of you” and then when the tea arrives they actually don’t want the tea at all. Sure, that’s kind of annoying as you’ve gone to the effort of making the tea, but they remain under no obligation to drink the tea. They did want tea, now they don’t. Sometimes people change their mind in the time it takes to boil that kettle, brew the tea and add the milk. And it’s ok for people to change their mind, and you are still not entitled to watch them drink it even though you went to the trouble of making it.

If they are unconscious, don’t make them tea. Unconscious people don’t want tea and can’t answer the question “do you want tea” because they are unconscious.

Ok, maybe they were conscious when you asked them if they wanted tea, and they said yes, but in the time it took you to boil that kettle, brew the tea and add the milk they are now unconscious. You should just put the tea down, make sure the unconscious person is safe, and – this is the important bit – don’t make them drink the tea. They said yes then, sure, but unconscious people don’t want tea.

If someone said yes to tea, started drinking it, and then passed out before they’d finished it, don’t keep on pouring it down their throat. Take the tea away and make sure they are safe. Because unconscious people don’t want tea. Trust me on this.

If someone said “yes” to tea around your house last saturday, that doesn’t mean that they want you to make them tea all the time. They don’t want you to come around unexpectedly to their place and make them tea and force them to drink it going “BUT YOU WANTED TEA LAST WEEK”, or to wake up to find you pouring tea down their throat going “BUT YOU WANTED TEA LAST NIGHT”.

If you can understand how completely ludicrous it is to force people to have tea when they don’t want tea, and you are able to understand when people don’t want tea, then how hard is it to understand when it comes to sex?

Whether it’s tea or sex, Consent Is Everything.”

 

Post # 38
Member
385 posts
Helper bee
  • Wedding: February 2015

ohnoitslindsay:  TLDR…Didn’t really have to compare it to tea. Could have just said sex.

Last time I checked, it wasn’t illegal to have drunk sex. But this is getting beside the point…referring to sex as tea…kinda getting ridiculous. Gonna leave this thread before it gets even more out of hand.

Post # 39
Member
544 posts
Busy bee
  • Wedding: April 2017 - Not sure

Unfortunately, yes, these scenarios are considered rape. I’m am so very sorry that this happened to you. It sounds like you had a very traumatic past. When we’re young, we don’t know that we were actually victimized. My first told me “do it or else”. I was so scared of being alone, that I complied. I was reluctant, but is still did it. He dumped me the next school day. I was 14. I went home and I grabbed the sharpest knife I could find and I sliced both arms over 30 times. I continued on a confused sexual path for years after this, if ended up used for sex, I cut myself. My emotions to this day are volatile. In our youth, maybe rape wasn’t as defined as it should have been. For me, I question to if my first was considered rape. I am sorry you have to ask yourself this. It would be best to see a therapist. You are not alone, bee. I am so sorry you have been a continuous victim. I only hope that you see light in your years to come and pray for your healing.

Post # 40
Member
326 posts
Helper bee
  • Wedding: July 2017

turkeysausage:  Was just coming back to specify that I was not judging by the standards of the law, but rather by what violate’s another person’s jurisdiction over their body. The situation would never hold up in court. 

Post # 41
Member
3307 posts
Sugar bee
  • Wedding: November 1999

ohmylanta13:  Oh yes indeed, everyone’s a victim, consent can’t be given if alcohol is involved, it’s all the rapists fault. Heaven help you on this board if you dare suggest that a “victim” look at her own actions which may have contributed to the situation. And why would you do that? To decrease the chance that it will happen again. And again. And again. But the special and protected status of the victim is not to be violated.. Boy am I tired of all this. 

OP, you weren’t raped in the first instance, but you were taken advantage of. For all those gearing up to tell me how wrong I am, no one feels “warm and happy” after being raped. No one. 

The second time? You must have had a great deal to drink, which unfortunately makes your memories suspect. No, it was not your “fault” per se, but you could very well have avoided the problem by not getting drunk and telling this guy to leave. You’re not obligated to stay in a situation that feels wrong or unsafe. Read The gift of Fear by Gavin deBecker. It’s all about listening to your instincts and following them. But alcohol dulls your instinct, among other things. 

The third time? This one is the closest to rape, but in my opinion, “feeling” pressured into having sex is different than being pressured. Not sure why you couldn’t leave, if he was restraining you in some way that’s definitely rape. Once again, I suspect alcohol is involved.

OP, I’m not trying to be cruel, but I abhor the notion that that someone who is drunk is not responsible for something that happens to them. Responsible people don’t get drunk. The world does not protect you when you’re drunk, because you’re unable to give consent. So you can be absolutely correct that it’s not your fault, but you still end up raped. If you are still drinking, it would be a good idea to stop, immediately, before something else happens. And get some therapy to sort these issues out. Take care.

 

Post # 42
Member
79 posts
Worker bee

ohnoitslindsay:  but in her first example no one was unconscious and she didn’t say she said no. If they were both drunk,  they both didn’t consent but it wasn’t the guys fault. She was just as much to blame as he was, since they were both intoxicated. 

Post # 43
Member
1450 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: May 2016 - St. John\'s Lutheran Church

ohnoitslindsay:  I get confused about this, too. Like, if neither person was capable of giving their consent, did they each rape the other? That seems like a ridiculous conclusion. That being said, OP never specifically states that the guy was drinking at all, and my initial reading of her story made me think that he intentionally got her drunk, which of course is predatory.

Post # 44
Member
9527 posts
Buzzing Beekeeper

ohmylanta13:  How exactly am I entitled by saying I faced a painful topic? How am I asking special treatment? What victim card? If anything you are pulling a “I never had to face this hardship so I don’t have to have compassion for people who have faced” it card. Well, boo. I don’t want you to have to experience it to understand. I do not see your argument. And I am happy for you for that.

Post # 45
Member
79 posts
Worker bee

marriedtopizza:  i dont think it sounds like he intentionally got her drunk at all. He offered her a drink, she realized there was alcohol and wanted to see how it would make her feel. That tells me she wanted the alcohol and wanted to get drunk. It is an assumption he was drinking too, but I highly doubt he gave her drinks and stayed sober himself. 

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