(Closed) Wealth distribution in the US

posted 5 years ago in Money
Post # 3
Member
1608 posts
Bumble bee
  • Wedding: August 2013

Oh boo hoo hoo.  Both my parents started with nothing.  Worked long hours, went to school at night.   Were frugal.  My mom worked when pregnant, went back to work after 4 weeks (and a C section).   I love my Groomsmen, but this might have been tough on them, Groomsmen lived with us, so mom could work.  Mom sewed all her own maternity clothes.  Yes, I was lucky, but THEY worked for what they have. 

Post # 4
Member
3053 posts
Sugar bee
  • Wedding: February 2015

@juanita.kelly.9:  I don’t really understand the relevance of your response here.

 

@WannaBeeMrsB:  I’ve seen that before. It’s depressing. It makes me laugh at people I know who think they’re rich because they make over 100k a year. It makes me sad that someone woould rather spend money on a 10 million dollar house they do not need or even have enough people in their families to fill than donate some of that to veterans, children, etc (I know a lot of rich people do PURELY for the tax ride off though) It’s all just very sad IMO

Post # 5
Hostess
8576 posts
Bumble Beekeeper
  • Wedding: October 2014

I think there’s alot wrong in this country.. I’m not going to go into my views, because well.. they don’t matter, and they’d probably upset many many people here.

But the truth is – is that there are ALOT of hard working people, who work their butts off their entire lives, and have next to nothing to show for it. These people are your friends, relatives, co-workers. They work in our grocery stores & at our fast food places. They do the jobs that wealthy people don’t want to do, and they still aren’t able to put food on their plates.

There will never be a solution that makes everyone happy, but there are ALOT of things that could be changed for the better.

– Taxes are a joke. Most of the wealthy hide their money so it isn’t taxed anyway. The children credits are bogus. I know families who take home more money from their TAXES than they make in a year. I know a lady who makes about 26k a year, her husband makes about 20k. They get over $50,000 back in taxes every year because they have 4 children of their own, have 4 adopted children, and take every single tax credit possible. That 50k is coming out of everyone elses pockets.

 

My solution : Get rid of taxes. Instead, add an extra “federal” tax to every item we buy. Let’s just say it’s 3%. And let’s say that half of america is working & spending money [So half of 300 million]. Let’s say those 150 million each make 2,000 a month [we’re low balling here], and they spend about $1500 a month [saving $500 a month for retirement/savings]. $1500 x .03% = $45. $45 x 150,000,000.. I’ll let you do the math on that one. And that’s every month. It would be LESS taxes out of our paychecks, and it will hit EVERYONE. Immigrants, pimps, hoes, drugdealers, EVERYONE. Obviously, the figures would be much much higher because most people make more than $2000 a month, but you get the idea.

 

This one might offend some people – but disability is a joke. Don’t get me wrong, some people NEED disability. But, I think we’ve been WAY too leniant with it. I personally can name 10 people who are on disbility, receiving $800 a month for being BIPOLAR. Okay, I know there are extreme cases where medication doesn’t help.. but what’s the chance of every person I know with bi-polar, not being able to be medicated? Not likely. I also know another guy who is collecting disability because he gets anxiety from being around people. It’s funny because he has no problem going to the store to spend it.. just saying! America needs to work, not sit on their bums, and we seriously need to tighten up the ropes.

There are many, many more things that need to be changed, including Obamacare.

Post # 7
Member
8446 posts
Bumble Beekeeper
  • Wedding: April 2013

@jenilynevette:  reading your post makes me smile.  Really wish more people thought like this.

Post # 8
Member
7977 posts
Bumble Beekeeper
  • Wedding: July 2013 - UK

@jenilynevette:  Flat rate taxes don’t work though. Just look at VAT in the UK, because obviously that made everything better (NOT). Or the poll tax! Check out some of our ****** up taxes over here…

@WannaBeeMrsB:  Have you read The Spirit Level? It’s very entertaining, and by a very well respected anthropologist writing for a public audience. I also love the way they make their data public, so you can run your own data checks and make sure that their conclusions are correct.

The basic premise is this: it is INEQUALITY within a society which causes crime and social ills to rise, not MONEY. If everyone gets richer, but the poor become disproportionately poorer, societal ills increase. This is completely logical, of course… and their data proves it.

Post # 9
Hostess
8576 posts
Bumble Beekeeper
  • Wedding: October 2014

@Rachel631: But VAT is on top of taking money out of their checks, yes?

This would be NO money taken out of their checks, not to mention a low rate out of their checks.

There would also be NO taxes being paid to the people from credits, which saves the country money.

There’s a way to do it, it’s all about making it work.

In the end, nobody wants to have money taken out of their checks, but the country needs the money to run. Taxes are super messed up at the moment, and the only way to get around all of the problems we currently have, is to eliminate them.

Post # 10
Member
7977 posts
Bumble Beekeeper
  • Wedding: July 2013 - UK

@jenilynevette:  You and I will clearly never agree on this, I can see that now. We favour completely opposite policies…

I favour policies based on the Scandanavian system, whereby there are very high taxes, but LOTS of services. Also, all benefits are given as services and NOT as cash (this is where we go wrong in Britain, IMO). If you want free childcare, it is given on the basis of need. Free healthcare? Certainly. You want free food? Come and get food. But they don’t give you cash, because they’re not subsididing your booze and fag habit. They’re just helping you in times of need, because citizens don’t allow citizens to starve. It’s about targeting people in need. These countries have citizens with long life expectancies, low crime, high rates of educational achievement, just to name a few things.

Also, this crazy system of tax refunds etc… only in America!

Post # 11
Hostess
8576 posts
Bumble Beekeeper
  • Wedding: October 2014

@Rachel631:  I can see how that would be great, but that would never, ever stand in America.

I do believe in certain services, such as healthcare – America definantly needs to do something about that [and not the obamacare BS – that’s just going to screw ALOT of people over]

Everything in America is about money, and I don’t see it ever changing, so services would never work.

 

Post # 12
Member
3586 posts
Sugar bee
  • Wedding: January 2000

@soontobemrsm11:  you said

“…It makes me laugh at people I know who think they’re rich because they make over 100k a year…”

I disagree, if someone is happy with their salary and financial place in life, who are you to urge them on into unhappiness and a peevish class warfare mentality? Being content with one’s life is a lovely place to be. Developing a dog-in-the-manger attitude is a recipe for unhappiness.

In most parts of this country, $100,000 annual household income is supportive of a nice lifestyle.

For example, I consider myself rich. Wealthy. Laugh at me if you like! I”ll not get on the “he-has-more-than-me” treadmill. If one wants to play that game, look downwards into material wealth worldwide and see where you stack up. Now that’s what is eye-opening.

 

Post # 13
Member
7977 posts
Bumble Beekeeper
  • Wedding: July 2013 - UK

@jenilynevette:  I know my attitudes wouldn’t go down well in the US, but I really do believe that money is the root of all evil. On the other hand, I have to deal with it every day.

On the one hand, I earn a pittance compared to everyone else in the UK and it makes me feel guilty, because I’m not paying my way. I’m not paying for the services I use because I don’t pay tax (legally, I don’t have to), for example. On the other hand, I aim to end up in a caring profession, where I work with people who are so underpriviliged. I’ve worked with people who die in childbirth because they can’t afford transport to antenatal care, or whose children die because they can’t access antibiotics. I feel so guilty when I see what I have and they do not. In many ways I am wealthy- absolutely wealthy. I also used to earn minimum wage, and that was miserable. I am wealthy compared to how I used to be.

One problem with our UK benefits system is that most of them are paid to people in work, which is basically a way of subsidising greedy employers and keeping wages artificially low… an economic policy, not a social policy. My solution? High minimum wages which act as a living wage. Heavy business taxation and regulation, to minimise the gap between rich and poor, and prevent inflation and a rise in living costs. More services given as services and less as cash. Fewer means tested services… services given out on the basis of need alone. This may seem illogical considering my socialist views, but the time and money spent on means testing people could be better spent on services, full stop. Those who can afford a better service can go private. For everyone else, there’s the same service, regardless of money. And I believe that everyone should be taxed a % of their income to pay for universally free healthcare.

There are pros and cons to this system… the UK NHS. If you are seriously ill, the service is incredible, and it’s ALL FREE. I remember when I was taken in on suspicion of kidney failure… within 30 minutes I was with a specialist, getting labs. On the other hand, if you are judged not to have a serious problem, then you will never get seen. I have problems with my feet and knees, and it’s just not a priority. It won’t be a priority until I’m crippled, pretty much. They don’t do preventative. No resources for it. If I want preventative medical care, I have to pay for it.

@FauxPas2012:  +1. 100K is a **** ton of money! Fiance and I make a fraction of that, and we may not be wealthy, but we have a very nice life. At the height of his career, my Dad made somewhere in the region of 90K a year, and we were wealthy. Really, very wealthy as a family. Beautiful house, two kids in private school etc etc. An expensive divorce helped to polish off those savings, along with the collapse of several savings companies, and the recession did the rest. But to poo poo that sort of cash… whoah.

This said, I think PP was actually criticising millionaires, not the middle classes. And I think she is quite right to critixise some of the priorities of the wealthiest people in the world.

 

Post # 14
Member
9181 posts
Buzzing Beekeeper
  • Wedding: August 2013 - Rocky Mountains USA

@jenilynevette:  I agree with the first half of your original comment.  The U.S. currently has an extremely low rate of migration between classes.  It’s the same as the early 1900s with the robber barons and the working class.  It’s really disgusting that people can work their asses off for their whole lives and still struggle to feed and house themselves, let alone to retire.  While their bosses are literally making more money per day than they make all year.  Thanks, capitalism.

But, the issue with a flat tax rate (or taxing commodities, like you mentioned) is that it hits the lower-income people WAY harder.  If I make 15,000 a year and spend 10,000 of it on buying very basic things like food, gas, basic clothes, etc, then 67% of my income would be taxed.  Meanwhile I’m already spend the vast majority of my income on the basics, so those taxes are hitting me really hard.  If a super rich person makes 150,000 a year and spends 10,000 (or 20,000, or 30,000) on the basics, they have an extra 120,000 – 140,000 that’s discretionary money.  Getting taxed on that small amount isn’t going to hurt them at ALL.  Even if they choose to spend a bunch more, the ratio of taxes to required spending on basic commodies is way way lower than the poor person, so they’re not feeling the tax burden nearly as hard.

I hope I explained that well.  Basically it’s not fair to expect poor people to contribute a higher proportion of their basic life-and-death money to taxes than rich people.

Post # 15
Member
7977 posts
Bumble Beekeeper
  • Wedding: July 2013 - UK

@lolot:  Absolutely. And this is why I will always oppose flat rate taxation. Including VAT, which we are stuck with at 20%!

Post # 16
Hostess
8576 posts
Bumble Beekeeper
  • Wedding: October 2014

@lolot:  I do understand what you’re saying, but I do believe that adding a federal tax to purchases would lower how much we pay in taxes all together. So yes, of course the lower classes might still pay more taxes, but, as it stands, we basically are. They’ve nearly milked the middle class dry at this point.

But, when it comes to big ticket items.. million+ dollar homes, and 300,000 dollar cars – the wealthy are still going to be buying these items. A 3% tax increase won’t stop them from purchasing that new car that just came out if they really want it. And no, the percentage they pay based on their income won’t be the same as the lower income classes, but at least it’s something.

And again, it’ll hit everyone who don’t currently pay taxes, at all ever. Which is a BIG step.

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